View Poll Results: Should the entire Nuclear Industry be financially liable?

Voters
4. You may not vote on this poll
  • No, each Nuclear Utility Corporation is independent

    3 75.00%
  • Yes, The Nuclear Corporations are a village

    0 0%
  • Nuke manufacturers like drug dealers, dealing their drug

    0 0%
  • Each Corporation is a "fictitious entity," ergo not lialble for anything

    1 25.00%
Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: Nuclear Reality-Profits divided amont the rich, liabilities divided among the poor!

  1. #1
    Iconoclast
    DaveFagan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    wny
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:07 PM
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    7,302

    Nuclear Reality-Profits divided amont the rich, liabilities divided among the poor!

    Japan utility seeks more funds for nuclear crisis

    AP Business News Template | TBO.com=
    "But in a statement, the company outlined two potential scenarios, one involving costs of some 10 trillion yen ($125 billion) that it said would make it difficult for TEPCO to raise funding from private lenders and oblige it to seek further government financial support."
    "Including the bailout, the government has injected 2.5 trillion yen ($31.3 billion) into TEPCO and allocated at least 5 trillion yen for compensation for the disaster and decontamination."
    "Officials say the plant has since stabilized, but it runs on makeshift equipment, causing concerns about its ability to withstand any major earthquakes. TEPCO officials say it will take about 40 years to fully decommission the wrecked reactors, a huge financial burden in addition to the astronomical compensation payments."

    The nuclear "nightmare" is the huge liability placed upon the public when something goes wrong.

    The unavoidable nightmare is that as "Nukes" age they will become a liability to the Corporations that have profitted and when that happens, the Corporations will file bankruptcy because it is just "good business."

  2. #2
    Sage
    longview's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:38 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    14,360

    Re: Nuclear Reality-Profits divided amont the rich, liabilities divided among the poo

    I think there is and must be a path forward for nuclear power.
    I also think they need to select one design and stick with it.
    the Idea that almost every plant is a custom design is crazy, if we built cars that
    way, we would need better walking shoes.
    Plant siting also disaster prep are needed also.
    If we are to replace natural hydrocarbons with anything,
    the energy needs to come from somewhere,and be stable and predictable.

  3. #3
    Sage

    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Goldsboro,PA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 03:20 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    5,595
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Nuclear Reality-Profits divided amont the rich, liabilities divided among the poo

    The true operating cost of nuclear must be known publicly, and its the same for other energy sources...relatively safe sources may be less expensive in the long run...
    For an absolute certainty, no corporation should be allowed to just "walk away"...
    This could be the end of corporations ...and they bring it upon themselves.

  4. #4
    Iconoclast
    DaveFagan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    wny
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:07 PM
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    7,302

    Re: Nuclear Reality-Profits divided amont the rich, liabilities divided among the poo

    Quote Originally Posted by longview View Post
    I think there is and must be a path forward for nuclear power.
    I also think they need to select one design and stick with it.
    the Idea that almost every plant is a custom design is crazy, if we built cars that
    way, we would need better walking shoes.
    Plant siting also disaster prep are needed also.
    If we are to replace natural hydrocarbons with anything,
    the energy needs to come from somewhere,and be stable and predictable.

    You said the energy needs to come from somewhere. How about enough solar energy falls upon Texas to power the world. We don't harness it. Why? I'll tell you why. Solar is a local resource. Best harnessed locally. Our current energy model uses a Centralized Distribution model that builds a large energy producing source and then keeps profitting from that energy distribution, like "Nukes." That way a company can build a Nuke and keep profitting from just maintaining it and spread that money around to stockholders, and be sure to Incorporate in the beginning to evade liability. Now, with alternative energy, and there is plenty of it, energy is generated locally and the Centralized Energy Distribution Network of large liability evading Corporations are out of the profit loop. Do you suppose these large Corporations cut out of the profit loop would fight "tooth and nail" to prevent popularization of " Local utilities", like small solar and wind energy. Yes, they will fight like hell, and that is why local solar and wind energy have not been able to get backing on a National level. They get lip service or just enough to give political deniability to to those working against them. That's the real world. We don't need Nukes. Wealthy stockholders and GE need nukes.

  5. #5
    Iconoclast
    DaveFagan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    wny
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:07 PM
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    7,302

    Re: Nuclear Reality-Profits divided amont the rich, liabilities divided among the poo

    Quote Originally Posted by earthworm View Post
    The true operating cost of nuclear must be known publicly, and its the same for other energy sources...relatively safe sources may be less expensive in the long run...
    For an absolute certainty, no corporation should be allowed to just "walk away"...
    This could be the end of corporations ...and they bring it upon themselves.

    Every "business student" knows that Corporations are written to avoid "liability." That is the strength and business desirability of Corporations. You choose a name and just like that you are a "fictitious entity" and that is the correct legal term for who the Corporation now is. Can't lay a glove on 'em, especially if you would like to choke one. Any liability is only equal to the Corporation's assets, and good managers will milk anything of value out just before bankruptcy. Remember that bankruptcy is a planned event. This is about business, not a roll of the dice.

  6. #6
    Sage
    longview's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:38 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    14,360

    Re: Nuclear Reality-Profits divided amont the rich, liabilities divided among the poo

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    You said the energy needs to come from somewhere. How about enough solar energy falls upon Texas to power the world. We don't harness it. Why? I'll tell you why. Solar is a local resource. Best harnessed locally. Our current energy model uses a Centralized Distribution model that builds a large energy producing source and then keeps profitting from that energy distribution, like "Nukes." That way a company can build a Nuke and keep profitting from just maintaining it and spread that money around to stockholders, and be sure to Incorporate in the beginning to evade liability. Now, with alternative energy, and there is plenty of it, energy is generated locally and the Centralized Energy Distribution Network of large liability evading Corporations are out of the profit loop. Do you suppose these large Corporations cut out of the profit loop would fight "tooth and nail" to prevent popularization of " Local utilities", like small solar and wind energy. Yes, they will fight like hell, and that is why local solar and wind energy have not been able to get backing on a National level. They get lip service or just enough to give political deniability to to those working against them. That's the real world. We don't need Nukes. Wealthy stockholders and GE need nukes.
    I am actually all for solar (photo voltaic s), and it would help us a lot to have several thousand watts
    worth installed on every roof.
    The issue would be having the power available when you need it.
    There is a reason that you do not see many solar manufacturers running their factories with their own
    products, and it's not costs.
    They cannot get reliable enough power from solar panels to keep the factory running.
    I think the real issue is energy storage, batteries in their current state just do not cut it.

  7. #7
    Iconoclast
    DaveFagan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    wny
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:07 PM
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    7,302

    Re: Nuclear Reality-Profits divided amont the rich, liabilities divided among the poo

    Quote Originally Posted by longview View Post
    I am actually all for solar (photo voltaic s), and it would help us a lot to have several thousand watts
    worth installed on every roof.
    The issue would be having the power available when you need it.
    There is a reason that you do not see many solar manufacturers running their factories with their own
    products, and it's not costs.
    They cannot get reliable enough power from solar panels to keep the factory running.
    I think the real issue is energy storage, batteries in their current state just do not cut it.
    The original Edison Nickel/iron battery is a good one because it uses up electrolyte not metal plates. There are still functional nickel/iron batteries operating continuously since around 1900. Just keep adding potassium hydroxide. Once in a while douche the plates with a water rinse. They're not as powerful a battery as lead/acid, but that is the tradeoff. That is also the problem with the windpower sold in the USA as renewable energy. It is not. Those huge windmills have no storage. It is financial trickery to steer renewable energy monies into the Centralized Distribution of Energy MONOPOLY. That's also what "Nukes" are about. Always follow the Big Money.

  8. #8
    Sage
    jamesrage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    A place where common sense exists
    Last Seen
    12-10-17 @ 09:23 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    31,067

    Re: Nuclear Reality-Profits divided amont the rich, liabilities divided among the poo

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    Japan utility seeks more funds for nuclear crisis

    AP Business News Template | TBO.com=
    "But in a statement, the company outlined two potential scenarios, one involving costs of some 10 trillion yen ($125 billion) that it said would make it difficult for TEPCO to raise funding from private lenders and oblige it to seek further government financial support."
    "Including the bailout, the government has injected 2.5 trillion yen ($31.3 billion) into TEPCO and allocated at least 5 trillion yen for compensation for the disaster and decontamination."
    "Officials say the plant has since stabilized, but it runs on makeshift equipment, causing concerns about its ability to withstand any major earthquakes. TEPCO officials say it will take about 40 years to fully decommission the wrecked reactors, a huge financial burden in addition to the astronomical compensation payments."

    The nuclear "nightmare" is the huge liability placed upon the public when something goes wrong.

    The unavoidable nightmare is that as "Nukes" age they will become a liability to the Corporations that have profitted and when that happens, the Corporations will file bankruptcy because it is just "good business."

    No the entire nuclear industry shall not be financially liable. Each Nuclear Utility Corporation is independent.So throw the people that run that corporation and anyone else responsible into jail and make them pay any fines or make them work it out of jail.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  9. #9
    Iconoclast
    DaveFagan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    wny
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:07 PM
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    7,302

    Re: Nuclear Reality-Profits divided amont the rich, liabilities divided among the poo

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    No the entire nuclear industry shall not be financially liable. Each Nuclear Utility Corporation is independent.So throw the people that run that corporation and anyone else responsible into jail and make them pay any fines or make them work it out of jail.

    What you say sounds sensible, but what you overlook is that this "Corporate" status as a fictitious entity protects them from liability. The Nuclear village initiates legislation favorable to their existence. They purchase politicians. They collectively influence legislation to their favor. Again, they are only liable to the extent of their Assets. A good bankruptcy lawyer makes sure all assets are removed before filing. Those are the realities. Of the poll choices, the only true one is the fourth one. It's not meant to be a "ringer," just an educational endeavor. Most people really don't understand the nuclear legal infrastructure.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •