View Poll Results: Is patriotism overrated?

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Thread: Is patriotism overrated?

  1. #1
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    Is patriotism overrated?

    I'm back.

    Even though I haven't posted in over 2 years and like 99% of you don't even know/remember who I am, I decided to make my triumphant return with something that has been on my mind lately.

    I genuinely feel that being a patriot is overrated and slowly becoming just blatantly obnoxious as time goes on. It's rooted in discrimination and crosses over into just pure jingoism at times. From things like screaming "USA! USA! USA!" as loud as you can to arguing about what nation is the best, it has become more and more clear to me that it's all just archaic and neanderthal-like garbage.

    Maybe I'll elaborate later on, but I want your opinion and I'd like it if we could get a good discussion going about this. So what do you think?


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    Re: Is patriotism overrated?

    Patriotism is not overrated. Jingoism/xenophobia is.

    When I think of the U-S-A! chants back in 1980 in Lake Placid, I get goose bumps. That's a far cry from people who want to shove their nationality down the throats of others.

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    Re: Is patriotism overrated?

    I view patriotism and nationalism as two different things. Being a nationalist is what you described as chanting "USA USA!" very lowdly or saying "my country is the best". I believe that is nationalism. And American Exceptionalism falls under this in my opinion.
    Being a patriot in my opinion is looking out for what is best for your country, trying to make your country better, speaking out when you believe your country is wrong. Being a patriot is not someone thinking their country is best no matter what, or the whole "my country right or wrong" attitude.


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    Re: Is patriotism overrated?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    I view patriotism and nationalism as two different things. Being a nationalist is what you described as chanting "USA USA!" very lowdly or saying "my country is the best". I believe that is nationalism. And American Exceptionalism falls under this in my opinion.
    Being a patriot in my opinion is looking out for what is best for your country, trying to make your country better, speaking out when you believe your country is wrong. Being a patriot is not someone thinking their country is best no matter what, or the whole "my country right or wrong" attitude.
    I would personally be more radical with this and say even that definition of patriotism is something I would say is overrated. Looking out for your country first and viewing yourself as a citizen of your nation rather than a member of the human society in general is what I would consider to be a mentality we need to get past.

    I really think we need to sort of evolve past the idea of caring only about what happens within our immediate land mass.


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    Re: Is patriotism overrated?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cilogy View Post
    I would personally be more radical with this and say even that definition of patriotism is something I would say is overrated. Looking out for your country first and viewing yourself as a citizen of your nation rather than a member of the human society in general is what I would consider to be a mentality we need to get past.

    I really think we need to sort of evolve past the idea of caring only about what happens within our immediate land mass.
    You can view yourself as a member of human society and a member of your country. The two are not opposites. You can look to advance your country and you can also look to advance human society as a whole.


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    Re: Is patriotism overrated?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    You can view yourself as a member of human society and a member of your country. The two are not opposites. You can look to advance your country and you can also look to advance human society as a whole.
    Good point, but for some reason it just seems less and less important to advance your country simply because that incites a lot of the issues humans have with each other around the world.


  7. #7
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    Re: Is patriotism overrated?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cilogy View Post
    I'm back.

    Even though I haven't posted in over 2 years and like 99% of you don't even know/remember who I am, I decided to make my triumphant return with something that has been on my mind lately.

    I genuinely feel that being a patriot is overrated and slowly becoming just blatantly obnoxious as time goes on. It's rooted in discrimination and crosses over into just pure jingoism at times. From things like screaming "USA! USA! USA!" as loud as you can to arguing about what nation is the best, it has become more and more clear to me that it's all just archaic and neanderthal-like garbage.

    Maybe I'll elaborate later on, but I want your opinion and I'd like it if we could get a good discussion going about this. So what do you think?
    If you think its overrate then would you want your elected officials to be globalist/internationalists or would you want your elected officials to be patriotic?
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  8. #8
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    Re: Is patriotism overrated?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    If you think its overrate then would you want your elected officials to be globalist/internationalists or would you want your elected officials to be patriotic?
    Well it's more of a philosophical question I suppose. My view is that even elected officials need to get over that mentality; we need to collectively move past it as a species.


  9. #9
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    Re: Is patriotism overrated?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    I view patriotism and nationalism as two different things. Being a nationalist is what you described as chanting "USA USA!" very lowdly or saying "my country is the best". I believe that is nationalism. And American Exceptionalism falls under this in my opinion.
    Being a patriot in my opinion is looking out for what is best for your country, trying to make your country better, speaking out when you believe your country is wrong. Being a patriot is not someone thinking their country is best no matter what, or the whole "my country right or wrong" attitude.

    Actually those two words practically synonymous with each other.

    Patriotism - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary
    : love for or devotion to one's country

    Nationalism - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary
    1
    : loyalty and devotion to a nation; especially : a sense of national consciousness exalting one nation above all others and placing primary emphasis on promotion of its culture and interests as opposed to those of other nations or supranational groups
    2
    : a nationalist movement or government
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  10. #10
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    Re: Is patriotism overrated?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cilogy View Post
    Well it's more of a philosophical question I suppose. My view is that even elected officials need to get over that mentality; we need to collectively move past it as a species.
    So your could care less if your elected officials have no loyalty to your country. The duty of elected officials is to represent the interests of those that elect them.Being globalist/internationalists would conflict with the duties of elected officials.Elected officials should be more patriotic/nationalistic than those they represent, not less in order to being able to do their job effectively.
    Last edited by jamesrage; 11-02-12 at 02:13 AM.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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