View Poll Results: Do you support this Gas price idea?

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  • Yes

    4 9.30%
  • No

    37 86.05%
  • Part of it, I will explain in a post.

    2 4.65%
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Thread: Idea to control gas prices and help conversion to electric cars.

  1. #11
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    Re: Idea to control gas prices and help conversion to electric cars.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    This really won't work. There is no reason to favor US oil over foreign oil...it's all the same stuff. If this plan were implemented, you might succeed in diverting all the US oil to be used in the US, but really what would be the point of that? Both the US and foreign oil would still be used by consumers, and the producers of both would earn roughly the same amount of profit (sans differences in shipping costs). All that would change is that they'd just ship the foreign oil to some other country instead of the US. And since there isn't enough US-produced oil to meet 100% of the US demand, it would just cause the price of gas to go up. And although I support a gas tax, this is a needlessly complicated and protectionist scheme.

    As for the "moron with a hummer that enjoys bowing to Arabs"...I should note that our largest supplier of foreign oil is Canada, which accounts for more oil imports than all the Middle Eastern countries combined.
    Your not getting it.

    its NOT the same stuff. It has two SEPERATE markets and is taxed at two massivly different rates.
    Shipping the oil we use now to other places IS THE POINT. We dont need it and dont want to pay for it.

    As for the high consumption gas users, they would pay a high price. NOT subsidzed by the poor that only use there USA gas share.

    And remember price of gas is two seperate prices. Say $1 gal domestic gas, and $9 gal imported gas.

    protection ism is what keeps US CITIZENS from eating rat meat and rice every day...........

  2. #12
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    Re: Idea to control gas prices and help conversion to electric cars.

    Quote Originally Posted by 274ina View Post
    Your not getting it.

    its NOT the same stuff. It has two SEPERATE markets and is taxed at two massivly different rates.
    Shipping the oil we use now to other places IS THE POINT. We dont need it and dont want to pay for it.

    As for the high consumption gas users, they would pay a high price. NOT subsidzed by the poor that only use there USA gas share.

    And remember price of gas is two seperate prices. Say $1 gal domestic gas, and $9 gal imported gas.

    protection ism is what keeps US CITIZENS from eating rat meat and rice every day...........
    You've gone off the deep end. I have no idea what reality you're operating in. It's too nonsensical to even follow. Especially the bold.

  3. #13
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    Re: Idea to control gas prices and help conversion to electric cars.

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    You didn't address my questions at all. What would that do to our trading status with a large number of other countries? What in your scenario causes gas prices to be low? "USA only price gas prices" doesn't help anyone understand what you think causes prices to be low in your scenario. It's just a supply restriction and consumption cap. That makes lives of ordinary Americans much more difficult logistically and thus economically, and puts upward pressure on prices, as far as I can see.

    I'm sure that whatever the case, there would be some eventual upsides in some respects if we implemented it (although I voted No). My argument though is just that I don't think you're representing the reality of your scenario very well. I.e. you are ignoring or denying many the implications (some of which would be profound).
    I dont give a damb about "trading partners" or any of that WTO crap. I would kill them al l if I could. NOT TRADING is the POINT.

    The price would be low because we would not allow it to be sold to those that will pay a higher price. (ie those that manipulate currencys etc)

    There is no supply restriction or cap on consumption, you can buy all you want, but the high consumer must PAY for it. The low consumer pays a low affordable price.

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    Re: Idea to control gas prices and help conversion to electric cars.

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    You've gone off the deep end. I have no idea what reality you're operating in. It's too nonsensical to even follow. Especially the bold.
    Deep end?

    Here is REALITY for you.....................

    Bain Buys American Co Outsources Jobs, Flys Chinese flag | All Things Democrat

    All becasue of your "trading partners" worries.

    you love the CHINAMAN, you f*** go live with him.

    And if you cant understand different priceing, then go buy some imported ethanal, and see what you pay for it! LOL
    (it has massive taxes etc added to it to protect USA corn producers- what I am proposing here is the same thing)

  5. #15
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    Re: Idea to control gas prices and help conversion to electric cars.

    Quote Originally Posted by 274ina View Post
    I dont give a damb about "trading partners" or any of that WTO crap. I would kill them al l if I could. NOT TRADING is the POINT.
    Then THIS attitude is what you're really asking people if they agree with, underneath it all. You're asking them if they think this attitude about foreign trade makes sense for the US to adopt. Outright protectionism, to hell with all other nations? Yeah we'll see how many people you can rally to go along with that idea...

    There is no supply restriction or cap on consumption, you can buy all you want, but the high consumer must PAY for it. The low consumer pays a low affordable price.
    You didn't address Kandahar's comments either, now that I think about it. Take another look:

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar
    And since there isn't enough US-produced oil to meet 100% of the US demand, it would just cause the price of gas to go up.
    And not just the price of gas, but the price of all goods and services that require gas engines to do or move things.

  6. #16
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    Re: Idea to control gas prices and help conversion to electric cars.

    Quote Originally Posted by 274ina View Post
    Your not getting it.

    its NOT the same stuff. It has two SEPERATE markets and is taxed at two massivly different rates.
    Shipping the oil we use now to other places IS THE POINT. We dont need it and dont want to pay for it.
    Well actually we DO need it, since the production capacity of the US is less than 100% of the oil it needs...but I'm more interested in that second part. Why don't we want to pay for it? What's wrong with it?

    As for the high consumption gas users, they would pay a high price. NOT subsidzed by the poor that only use there USA gas share.
    I agree they should pay a higher price...they should pay the cost of the extra gas they use, plus a gas tax. What makes this complicated scheme of tariffs, subsidies, and gas cards superior to a simple $1 per gallon (or however much) gas tax?

    And remember price of gas is two seperate prices. Say $1 gal domestic gas, and $9 gal imported gas.
    That would result in a massive shortage of affordable gasoline. What would happen is that people would hoard as much $1 gas as they could...and those with the means would quickly buy it up at bargain-basement prices and sell it abroad for the real price. Essentially, everyone would be paying $9 a gallon for their gas except for the few lucky people who were able to get their hands on the $1 gas before it was all gone.

    protection ism is what keeps US CITIZENS from eating rat meat and rice every day...........
    Yeah...I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you haven't studied much economics.
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  7. #17
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    Re: Idea to control gas prices and help conversion to electric cars.

    I don't think it would get passed by the best Congressmen that money can buy. The largest energy companies control those Congressmen and that would be Exxon/Mobil, Chevron, BP, Shell, Total, Electric utilities, Natural Gas Utilities, nuke Utilities, etc., with the largest pocketbooks. Why do you suppose wars are where OIL is? Did you organize to get our Nation involved? Who/what pushes those wars? Who is the largest consumer of energy in the world? Pentagon! So, wars consume energy at a profit to the large energy corporations, and then the large energy corporations get to distribute and profit from the energy removed from the countries we took war to. Who'd a thunk it, eh! Feel sumpin' slippin'?

  8. #18
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    Re: Idea to control gas prices and help conversion to electric cars.

    Quote Originally Posted by 274ina View Post
    Funny, thats that same thing GOP like you say about healthcare......
    Doesn't matter who says that, it's the truth.

    So I will restate the same old arguments.

    If you cant afford it, thats not our problem.........Lets see, $4 tax added to $5 gas....thats $9 gal to fill your hummer after you use up all your USA gas the first week.
    You are advocating a rationing card, this has nothing to do whatsoever with "affording it". You are advocating market controls, which never work economically, I'll give you a for instance, people who have travel heavy jobs would be limited to the same allotment as the little old lady who goes grocery shopping once a week and church on sundays. What will a commuter do when their allotment runs out? Can you answer that? And what economic fallout do you expect in the aggregate if your numbers bear out to lost production?

    I know you hate sharing, it hurts your profits, as does a person like me useing 5gal of gas per MONTH.
    You are dangerously close to being insulting here. First, business exists for profit, "sharing" isn't a viable economic system which is why communism never quite gets off the ground. Markets tend to like it when a supply and demand curve is based upon equitable value, production, and trade.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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    Re: Idea to control gas prices and help conversion to electric cars.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Well actually we DO need it, since the production capacity of the US is less than 100% of the oil it needs...but I'm more interested in that second part. Why don't we want to pay for it? What's wrong with it?



    2: I agree they should pay a higher price...they should pay the cost of the extra gas they use, plus a gas tax. What makes this complicated scheme of tariffs, subsidies, and gas cards superior to a simple $1 per gallon (or however much) gas tax?



    That would result in a massive shortage of affordable gasoline. What would happen is that people would hoard as much $1 gas as they could...and those with the means would quickly buy it up at bargain-basement prices and sell it abroad for the real price. Essentially, everyone would be paying $9 a gallon for their gas except for the few lucky people who were able to get their hands on the $1 gas before it was all gone.



    Yeah...I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you haven't studied much economics.

    2: its better becasue a $1 gas tax does nothing to remove US prices from world prices.

    3: How can you hord somthing that is already limited? I said USA share of gas. If you are allowed to buy 100 gal gas, 40 diesel, 10 premium, month, then they can keep the points, use them, or sell them to high gas consumers.
    Actual gas is not effected. its only "points" that is effected.
    Low gas users will use the little gas they need, and sell the points to high gas consumers.
    High consumers will get by useing USA share, buying a few points as needed, and if they REALLY use lots of gas, then be forced to buy imported gas.

    Yes I have studied ecomonics. Lots since "free trade" has F**** me out of a life now.

    Read "free trade doesnt work" and learn..........along with "when the wolf finallly came"

    I dont "compete" with slaves. I kill slaves or shut them out. You will also note USA has been protectionist for 95% of its history........

  10. #20
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    Re: Idea to control gas prices and help conversion to electric cars.

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    My thoughts are that Federal taxes should be gradually raised over a period of years to the point where (if this had been done in previous years at the current cost of gas) today's price would be $7 a gallon. People would be buying cars that get great mileage and clamoring for car manufacturers to improve efficiency.

    And. I wouldn't have to guess whether the aisle behind me was clear as I tried to see around the big, honkin' SUV sitting next to me.
    Mags, the first 40% of every dollar of gas sold goes to federal taxation, the second to last 8% goes to the companies supplying and the last 8 goes to the sellers. The reason a lot of chotchkies, junk food, vehicle services and other items are sold at gas stations is that they are higher profit items. Just petroleum product sales is a net loser. How much more does the government deserve for doing all of the regulating and none of the work?
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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