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Do think Sharia Law is a REAL possiblity in the US?

Do think Sharia Law is a REAL possiblity in the US?


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sharia law is possible if good people do nothing to prevent it. all i was trying to say. it's unlikely, but then again so are lightning strikes killing babies, doesnt mean it doesnt happen from time to time.

Sharia Law, as I understand it, is a body of rules that (at least some) devout Muslims follow in an effort to be faithful to Islam. I doubt many non-Muslim Americans are going to be converting to Islam anytime soon, and I am not concerned with most of these rules. "What to eat" rules may actually help make a family healthier. "Whom to marry" rules offend me -- especially arranged marriages, but I disapprove of many marriages and as long as both parties are adults, I don't feel any need to step in. Polygamy (assuming that Sharia Law blesses this) is illegal everywhere in the US, as is child abuse. I don't care (and actually approve) if two parties to a contract want to agree in advance that any dispute they may have will be resolved by arbitration, whether the arbitrator is a religious leader or not.

So, what is it we need to worry about? Law-breaking. Honor killings and the like. But we address this by insisting on justice for all Americans, not by silly, unconstitutional laws that "outlaw" an honor killing defense in a murder case -- a defense that has never and will never and could never succeed in any American court.

I'm not sure what you're worried about -- as for social ills, I can think of worse ones than having a few more Muslim neighbors. I see such ladies out shopping occassionally, and they seem scared to me. THAT is a social ill I really can't abide -- no woman should be afraid to shop in my neighborhood just because she has a hijab (head scarf) on, and no woman should be afraid to wear the garments of her faith in my neighborhood.
 
Sharia Law, as I understand it, is a body of rules that (at least some) devout Muslims follow in an effort to be faithful to Islam. I doubt many non-Muslim Americans are going to be converting to Islam anytime soon, and I am not concerned with most of these rules. "What to eat" rules may actually help make a family healthier. "Whom to marry" rules offend me -- especially arranged marriages, but I disapprove of many marriages and as long as both parties are adults, I don't feel any need to step in. Polygamy (assuming that Sharia Law blesses this) is illegal everywhere in the US, as is child abuse. I don't care (and actually approve) if two parties to a contract want to agree in advance that any dispute they may have will be resolved by arbitration, whether the arbitrator is a religious leader or not.

So, what is it we need to worry about? Law-breaking. Honor killings and the like. But we address this by insisting on justice for all Americans, not by silly, unconstitutional laws that "outlaw" an honor killing defense in a murder case -- a defense that has never and will never and could never succeed in any American court.

I'm not sure what you're worried about -- as for social ills, I can think of worse ones than having a few more Muslim neighbors. I see such ladies out shopping occassionally, and they seem scared to me. THAT is a social ill I really can't abide -- no woman should be afraid to shop in my neighborhood just because she has a hijab (head scarf) on, and no woman should be afraid to wear the garments of her faith in my neighborhood.

the main thing that worries me is complacency. i understand where you're coming from, but lets look at what actually happens in two scenarios:

a muslim woman wears her religious garb in america, no one bothers her, she goes about her business and goes home.
a muslim woman doesnt wear her religious garb in a muslim-majority country (most of them, there are a few non-radical exceptions like turkey/indonesia), she gets harrassed/beaten, and goes home bruised to be further discplined by her husband.

so, i don't want sharia here, because i don't want my sisters or my mothers/grandmothers, or my daughters/granddaughters if i ever have any having to deal with even the possibility of being forced into such an abusive thing as a state under sharia law.

this is what sharia law looks like:


i just don't want the slippery slope, i understand you're supporting we simply not allow the more radical elements of sharia, but that's unlikely to occur in practice. in areas of the world where sharia law is in place, it's all or nothing, 'moderate' sharia does not exist or at-least i'm not familiar with any examples but i'll be more than willing to look into any sources you have that can demonstrate that such a thing exists.
 
I don't share your level of confidence. I see a division between Conservative Christians and everyone else in the not too distant future, and Sharia Law making a very strong bid as the dominant system among "everyone else".

I see more danger of Conservative Christians trying to enact their versions of Sharia.
Forcing children of incest and rape victims to bear their attackers children is very "Sharia" like. Subjugating women is at the heart of Sharia.
 
I see more danger of Conservative Christians trying to enact their versions of Sharia.
Forcing children of incest and rape victims to bear their attackers children is very "Sharia" like. Subjugating women is at the heart of Sharia.

i agree in principle, but theres a significant gap between the debate on when life actually begins (all research points to consciousness-like brain activity within the first 3 months of pregnancy, and i'm pro-choice), and stoning your daughter to death for looking at a boy.
 
the main thing that worries me is complacency. i understand where you're coming from, but lets look at what actually happens in two scenarios:

a muslim woman wears her religious garb in america, no one bothers her, she goes about her business and goes home.
a muslim woman doesnt wear her religious garb in a muslim-majority country (most of them, there are a few non-radical exceptions like turkey/indonesia), she gets harrassed/beaten, and goes home bruised to be further discplined by her husband.

so, i don't want sharia here, because i don't want my sisters or my mothers/grandmothers, or my daughters/granddaughters if i ever have any having to deal with even the possibility of being forced into such an abusive thing as a state under sharia law.

this is what sharia law looks like:


i just don't want the slippery slope, i understand you're supporting we simply not allow the more radical elements of sharia, but that's unlikely to occur in practice. in areas of the world where sharia law is in place, it's all or nothing, 'moderate' sharia does not exist or at-least i'm not familiar with any examples but i'll be more than willing to look into any sources you have that can demonstrate that such a thing exists.


I'd imagine all decent people are horrified at these appalling acts of violence against women that occur in the ME, but they don't occur (IMO) because of the religious beliefs of the people there. Human rights violations are always worse in countries that lack such features of first world nations are industrialization, public education, a significant middle class, etc. I don't see much difference between a woman being stoned to death for some "violation" of religious law (as interpreted by some cult leader) and a baby girl left to die of exposure in China because of the "one child" law.

In the US, the factors that create a danger to women in the ME Muslim nations cannot be replicated. Does that mean there'll never be a death by stoning here? Certainly not -- murders happen here every day. But we do have law and order, and we do punish law breakers even if they fervently believe their actions were dictated by God.

There's only one sizable Muslim community in the US that I know about -- in Detroit. I lived there, decades ago, and it was scarey to be hassled by gaggles of young Muslim men -- but I felt the cops would step in and protect me if it got too bad. IMO, this is where European nations fell down on the job -- when they began to see street crime by Muslim youths, they tried appeasement rather than stepping up enforcement. I honestly do not think such a thing could happen here. If ever I thought it was, I'd be right there with you, fighting against it.

 
I'd imagine all decent people are horrified at these appalling acts of violence against women that occur in the ME, but they don't occur (IMO) because of the religious beliefs of the people there. Human rights violations are always worse in countries that lack such features of first world nations are industrialization, public education, a significant middle class, etc. I don't see much difference between a woman being stoned to death for some "violation" of religious law (as interpreted by some cult leader) and a baby girl left to die of exposure in China because of the "one child" law.

In the US, the factors that create a danger to women in the ME Muslim nations cannot be replicated. Does that mean there'll never be a death by stoning here? Certainly not -- murders happen here every day. But we do have law and order, and we do punish law breakers even if they fervently believe their actions were dictated by God.

There's only one sizable Muslim community in the US that I know about -- in Detroit. I lived there, decades ago, and it was scarey to be hassled by gaggles of young Muslim men -- but I felt the cops would step in and protect me if it got too bad. IMO, this is where European nations fell down on the job -- when they began to see street crime by Muslim youths, they tried appeasement rather than stepping up enforcement. I honestly do not think such a thing could happen here. If ever I thought it was, I'd be right there with you, fighting against it.


i think the problem would be, that by the time we got to the point where sharia law was being actively utilized, the justice system/police would be so infiltrated by islam that they'd cease to function in their role of protectors as you describe. your example of detroit disturbs me, it seems my fears are already being put into practice, albeit in an isolated locale on the other side of the country. in addition, i have to say this after your statement regarding being protected by the police:

protect yourself! if you're not a handgun owner/not familiar with handguns, there are many classes offered by the NRA nation-wide. in addition, if you don't have it, consider getting your concealed-carry license if applicable. there's an old saying that i saw posted on this forum a bit ago which applies: when seconds count, the police are only minutes away. not that i advocate shooting muslims for leering at you, but situations escalate and i'd rather be surrounded by 50 men with my pistol, than by 3 men without.

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/index.php that's the website i generally use when purchasing firearms, if nothing else it's a good catalog to browse :).
 
i think the problem would be, that by the time we got to the point where sharia law was being actively utilized, the justice system/police would be so infiltrated by islam that they'd cease to function in their role of protectors as you describe. your example of detroit disturbs me, it seems my fears are already being put into practice, albeit in an isolated locale on the other side of the country. in addition, i have to say this after your statement regarding being protected by the police:

protect yourself! if you're not a handgun owner/not familiar with handguns, there are many classes offered by the NRA nation-wide. in addition, if you don't have it, consider getting your concealed-carry license if applicable. there's an old saying that i saw posted on this forum a bit ago which applies: when seconds count, the police are only minutes away. not that i advocate shooting muslims for leering at you, but situations escalate and i'd rather be surrounded by 50 men with my pistol, than by 3 men without.

Discount Guns for Sale - Buds Gun Shop that's the website i generally use when purchasing firearms, if nothing else it's a good catalog to browse :).

I'm not likely to be leered at these days -- I'm 59 years old. The phenomena is something this country has dealt with, successfully, with virtually every wave of immigration (and no one expects a ton of people from the ME to emigrate to the US anytime soon). I'd felt it before, as I grew up in New York and was used to being near gaggles of young Puerto Rican men (who aren't immigrants, but behave in similar ways when they first arrive here).

The Detroit area Muslim community is decades old, has never been a criminal problem and presents no threat to its neighbors. My point in mentioning it is, these are mainly people who fled Iran after the Shah was overthrown -- in the 1970's. They had money and education and thus, the ability to move here en masse. Those circumstances are not likely to be repeated.

By contrast, European nations see waves of immigrants from the ME who are temporary residents, seeking employment, or otherwise young men without their families. It's very hard, once residency is established in any EU nation, to control that person's movement inside any other EU nation -- again, not conditions that can occur here.

I say this with great compassion, roflrepublican: bigotry against American Muslims is far more serious a threat than lawbreaking by American Muslims will ever be. The ladies I spoke of are usually my age. I'm not proud that anyone's grandma is afraid to be out alone in my neighborhood during the day just because some of my neighbors are racist idijits.
 
Im asking this question because of some of the people I have encountered that want extra laws made banning it and they say they would never vote for ANY Muslim politician because of it.

SO I ask, do you fear Sharia Law and think its a possibility here in the US.

I do not.
It can be established here, believe that.
 
I'm not likely to be leered at these days -- I'm 59 years old. The phenomena is something this country has dealt with, successfully, with virtually every wave of immigration (and no one expects a ton of people from the ME to emigrate to the US anytime soon). I'd felt it before, as I grew up in New York and was used to being near gaggles of young Puerto Rican men (who aren't immigrants, but behave in similar ways when they first arrive here).

The Detroit area Muslim community is decades old, has never been a criminal problem and presents no threat to its neighbors. My point in mentioning it is, these are mainly people who fled Iran after the Shah was overthrown -- in the 1970's. They had money and education and thus, the ability to move here en masse. Those circumstances are not likely to be repeated.

By contrast, European nations see waves of immigrants from the ME who are temporary residents, seeking employment, or otherwise young men without their families. It's very hard, once residency is established in any EU nation, to control that person's movement inside any other EU nation -- again, not conditions that can occur here.

I say this with great compassion, roflrepublican: bigotry against American Muslims is far more serious a threat than lawbreaking by American Muslims will ever be. The ladies I spoke of are usually my age. I'm not proud that anyone's grandma is afraid to be out alone in my neighborhood during the day just because some of my neighbors are racist idijits.

while on the one hand i know that such bigotry against them will only lead them to increased violence/lawbreaking, on the other i'm wary of as you mentioned previously, the policy of appeasement. it's a fine line to travel, i'd hate to be the one actually responsible for treading it, because i doubt i could. also, it's relatively easy to move about the US, i just recently drove from erie PA back to Tampa FL and never encountered any 'borderchecks' so i don't see the distinction you're making between resident mobility in the EU as opposed to the US unless i'm missing something thanks to this blue moon harvest pump ale?
 
I see more danger of Conservative Christians trying to enact their versions of Sharia.
You see that because you're over indulged and don't understand what's really out there. Sharia would stomp all over your sense of freedom and literally saw your head off for protesting over it. Now tell me, liberal, does that happen to you now in this country? You don't know how good you have it.

Forcing children of incest and rape victims to bear their attackers children is very "Sharia" like. Subjugating women is at the heart of Sharia.
Preserving life is more important than your agenda of death. I'm sorry. There's too much bull**** surrounding the rape thing. First of all, pregnancy from rape is rare, and second, females often lie about being raped, in the first place. There are all kinds of options you can take without willfully slaughtering your unborn. Grooming young women for a sexual lifestyle is very "liberal" like, and is at the heart of liberalism.
 
You see that because you're over indulged and don't understand what's really out there. Sharia would stomp all over your sense of freedom and literally saw your head off for protesting over it. Now tell me, liberal, does that happen to you now in this country? You don't know how good you have it.

Preserving life is more important than your agenda of death. I'm sorry. There's too much bull**** surrounding the rape thing. First of all, pregnancy from rape is rare, and second, females often lie about being raped, in the first place. There are all kinds of options you can take without willfully slaughtering your unborn. Grooming young women for a sexual lifestyle is very "liberal" like, and is at the heart of liberalism.

Thank you for proving my point. I ask you what is so different? Stoning a womwn to death because she is accused of adultery or forcing a womwn to bear a rapists child?
Wake up, you and your ilk are our religious radicals and radicals of any religion are all pretty much the same.
 
Thank you for proving my point.
You stated that Conservative Christianity is more dangerous than Sharia and I explained how you are wrong. I didn't prove your point. You didn't even prove your point. You never had a point to begin with.

Study the issues, igunaman. You can't just parrot what you hear on the streets and expect to be taken seriously.
 
You stated that Conservative Christianity is more dangerous than Sharia and I explained how you are wrong. I didn't prove your point. You didn't even prove your point. You never had a point to begin with.

Study the issues, igunaman. You can't just parrot what you hear on the streets and expect to be taken seriously.

no he NEVER stated that! he stated how theres more of a danger of religious right extremist being in power more than extremist Muslims

he never compared how dangerous they are to eachother

so YES you did prove his point for him
 
You stated that Conservative Christianity is more dangerous than Sharia and I explained how you are wrong. I didn't prove your point. You didn't even prove your point. You never had a point to begin with.

Study the issues, igunaman. You can't just parrot what you hear on the streets and expect to be taken seriously.

I said that Radical Religious sects are all the same. They all seek to degrade women and take away their rights. They all claim to speak for "God" and do despicable things in his name. Even you will admit that Conservative Christian are more likely than Muslims to get their way in "Christian" America.
 
no he NEVER stated that!
Let's examine the original quote, shall we?

"I see more danger of Conservative Christians trying to enact their versions of Sharia".

He's saying that Conservative Christianity is a version of Sharia (which is total bull****) and that is more dangerous. What did you get from that piece?
 
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I said that Radical Religious sects are all the same.
No, you didn't. you said:

I see more danger of Conservative Christians trying to enact their versions of Sharia.
The greater danger is in Christianity. You said it yourself. Why are you avoiding the truth iguanaman? First you fire off pointless salvos and now you're denying what you said. You've even drawn objectiveless-J into the fray.
 
Let's examine the original quote, shall we?

"I see more danger of Conservative Christians trying to enact their versions of Sharia". He's saying that Conservative Christianity is a version of Sharia (which is total bull****) and that is more dangerous. What did you get from this piece?



now I thank you for proving MY point :laughat:
he is saying christian extremist are more plausable here in the US not more dangerous

your kneejerk false reaction is the BS lol

he also backed up that statement in his other post

sorry you are wrong :shrug:
 
No, you didn't. you said:

The greater danger is in Christianity. You said it yourself. Why are you avoiding the truth iguanaman? First you fire off pointless salvos and now you're denying what you said. You've even drawn objectiveless-J into the fray.

you are now flat out lying, lol he said theres more danger, as it becoming true in the US and then backed that up in post 439.
 
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he is saying christian extremist are more plausable here in the US not more dangerous.
That's what you said he's trying to say and I'm sure he'd agree with you because he can't think for himself. The problem is, you aren't making any sense, either.
 
you are now flat out lying, lol he said there more danger as it becoming true in the US and then backed that up in post 439.
Slow down, dude. You're thinking faster than you can type. Or is it vice-versa?
 
It shouldn't be a matter of which is more dangerous, but a matter of all religion being dangerous.

All religion is irrational and dangerous in some form or another.
 
It shouldn't be a matter of which is more dangerous, but a matter of all religion being dangerous.

All religion is irrational and dangerous in some form or another.
So is Secularism. It's the most souless, decadent & indifferent system on the planet. I'm much happier as a Christian than I ever was in your neck of the woods.
 
That's what you said he's trying to say and I'm sure he'd agree with you because he can't think for himself. The problem is, you aren't making any sense, either.

Im sure you think that but the post history proves you wrong, not our fault you totally kneejerked and now you are trying to save face :shrug:
 
Slow down, dude. You're thinking faster than you can type. Or is it vice-versa?

nope just like exposing people when they make stuff up :D :shrug:
 
So is Secularism. It's the most souless, decadent & indifferent system on the planet. I'm much happier as a Christian than I ever was in your neck of the woods.

Secularism in itself is the embracement of logic and reason. As was quite accurately put, religion is a symptom of irrational belief and groundless hope. Besides, human decency is not derived from religion. It precedes it.
 
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