View Poll Results: Should the country (taxes) pay for women's contraception?

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    45 38.46%
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Thread: Should the country pay for women's contraceptives?

  1. #61
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    Re: Should the country pay for women's contraceptives?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChuckBerry View Post
    You did no such thing. And I haven't repeated myself but once in this thread.
    Yes I did. Here, let's try it in list form.

    1. Not all women in poverty are concerned about STD's. They may be in relationships or married.
    2. Condoms alone are not ideal contraception. Condoms should be used with something else for best results (especially for poor women who may not have extra money to blow on EC if it breaks).
    3. Other forms of contraception may, in fact, be cheaper than condoms.
    Last edited by SmokeAndMirrors; 10-15-12 at 12:23 PM.

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    Re: Should the country pay for women's contraceptives?

    Everyone's being really ****ing stupid when they argue that if we stop supporting the poor fools in society then the poor fools will stop reproducing. :roll It's not to support the parents and their bad choices - it's to help the kids who are born into such an environment have a better chance at not being stuck in the life they were born into.

    I'd rather make efforts to boost kids out of their parent's trap than anything else . . .quality of life matters more than anything.


    Quote Originally Posted by Donahue View Post
    Maybe if we stop paying for WIC, etc. they'll start making better decisions.
    Oh sure - and then kids can die from polio and other things. WIC, etc - does more than just cover birth control and some food.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChuckBerry View Post
    Babies do not create cycles of poverty. Babies are born in to cultures that encourage dependence and lack a work ethic. Babies are the result, not the cause of, poverty.

    As birth control paid for by government or insurance companies, nothing.
    Lack of work ethic? You know - in some places being employed FULL TIME still places you in the lower percentile of income and if you have one child or two you're well into poverty.

    Take me for example - when I was employed as management I was full time and earned $8.00/hr - around here (at that time) that was doing pretty damn well. That was 40 x 8 = $320/week - over the course of a year that's around $16,000

    $16,000 a year - for full time employment . . . that WAS IT. Don't tell me that's a lack of work ethic - that's a lack of adequate income regardless of my work ethic.

    People apply for support from the state when they're just temporarily out of work - such as in the recent recession where countless large businesses folded and ditched thousands of employees out of job security. Young couples not ready yet to have a family - widowed parents who lost a spouse and weren't 'single' because they just didn't want to be married - these types of people were sluffed off, suddenly without employment and health coverage not of their own doing - and they still needed support. So what's your argument - what? Is the wife in a marriage because she's laid off of work and suddenly without her healthcare suppose to stop taking her monthly pill and risk pregnancy at the *worst* time for it? Are you actually suggesting that a married couple is suppose to stop wanting to have sex because they were laid off of work?

    Quit being ridiculous with your 'welfare baby queen' mantra. Most people on welfare are on it temporarily - only because they really NEED it . . . not because they're lazy.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChuckBerry View Post
    You're trying to muddy the waters. These pills can be used for the legitimate treatment of disease. For those purposes they of course ought to be covered. But I repeat...pregnancy is not a disease that requires treatment or prevention, and thus the cost of pills that prevent pregnancy are elective and ought not be covered.
    Pregnancy is a condition - and it does require treatment and it does require prevention if having a child is not ideal at the moment.

    Seems like common sense to me. Quit pretending it's not serious and important to ensure proper nutrition, health and overall care of a mother and her unborn.
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
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  3. #63
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    Re: Should the country pay for women's contraceptives?

    Quote Originally Posted by Donahue View Post
    Are you under the impression storks bring babies?
    No, but I'm also not under the impression that I live in fairytale land where bad things don't happen and everyone is perfect all the time.

  4. #64
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    Re: Should the country pay for women's contraceptives?

    Adam Smith remarked that "the most decisive mark of the prosperity of any country is the increase of the number of its inhabitants."

    Livi-Bacci observed, "All things being equal, population increase leads to increased per capita production."

    Mark Steyn notes in America Alone, "There is no precedent in human history for economic growth on declining human capital."

    Simon Smith Kuznets won the Nobel Prize in economics for his theory of "tested knowledge." As Kuznets explained: "More population means more creators and producers, both of goods along established production patterns and of new knowledge and inventions."


    So much for the theory that population control is good for society.

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    Re: Should the country pay for women's contraceptives?

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors View Post
    No, but I'm also not under the impression that I live in fairytale land where bad things don't happen and everyone is perfect all the time.
    Being "perfect" has nothing to do with conception, SAM.

    Sexual intercourse does.

    People managed to avoid tripping without falling dick first into a woman's vagina and vice versa through pretty much all of history.

  6. #66
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    Re: Should the country pay for women's contraceptives?

    Quote Originally Posted by Donahue View Post
    Voluntarily doing something that you can't afford is always bad behavior.

    The fact that there is a fair likelihood a human life can result of your voluntarily bad behavior, one which you clearly can't afford to take care of, only increases how bad of a decision it actually is.
    More "women who have sex and don't want to procreate are just bad people" rhetoric. What if this woman in poverty is married? Many are, these days.

    Humans are social creatures who rely heavily on their relationships for their mental well-being. Sex is part of a normal, healthy life. Sex with romantic partners is practically mandatory for the health of the relationship. Sex is good for you.

    Telling people that they should destroy their relationships for the terrible sin of being poor (and the even worse sin of being female and disinterested in breeding) is pretty back-asswards.

    Also, at some point, we're going to have to grow up and realize we don't live in Neverland, and pretending that we do is why we have so many problems in the first place.

  7. #67
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    Re: Should the country pay for women's contraceptives?

    Quote Originally Posted by Donahue View Post
    Being "perfect" has nothing to do with conception, SAM.

    Sexual intercourse does.

    People managed to avoid tripping without falling dick first into a woman's vagina and vice versa through pretty much all of history.
    Actually, they didn't. You have a shallow understanding of history. People screwed just as often -- if not more so. They just didn't live long enough to reproduce often.

    Women died in their youths from child birth. Children died in their youths from disease. Men died in their youths from violence.

    With today's longevity, we could drown the planet in a decade.

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    Re: Should the country pay for women's contraceptives?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Oh sure - and then kids can die from polio and other things. WIC, etc - does more than just cover birth control and some food.
    You might find this shocking but people did survive before the nanny state.

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    Re: Should the country pay for women's contraceptives?

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors View Post
    Actually, they didn't. You have a shallow understanding of history. People screwed just as often -- if not more so. They just didn't live long enough to reproduce often.

    Women died in their youths from child birth. Children died in their youths from disease. Men died in their youths from violence.

    With today's longevity, we could drown the planet in a decade.
    You're obviously too young to know any better but it is only within the last few decades these things have become common place. Not only did people manage to make it out of high school before getting pregnant but they even managed to make it into long lasting marriages and financial security before doing so. For most of this country's history being a "single parent" meant your spouse passed away. Despite the nanny state being a relatively new idea, these people still managed to work, provide for their families, and raise them.

    For the life of me I cannot figure out what would make you think people reproduce more often today than they did throughout history.

  10. #70
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    Re: Should the country pay for women's contraceptives?

    Quote Originally Posted by Donahue View Post
    You might find this shocking but people did survive before the nanny state.
    Ah yeah - good old mortality rates. . . where a family would bring 7 children into the world and only 2 would make it to adulthood. . . and young girls would be turned into nunneries when their dad's died.

    Yep - let's just digress as a society.

    If all the kids die before the age of 10 then we don't have to support them at all!

    Good plan!

    Or - why not just help said individuals to prevent pregnancy from the beginning!
    A screaming comes across the sky.
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