View Poll Results: Women voting, bad idea?

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  • women voting is a terrible idea

    18 15.65%
  • women voting is fine with me

    97 84.35%
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Thread: Women voting, bad idea?

  1. #191
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    Re: Women voting, bad idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by ab9924 View Post
    Thank you. Exactly! You represent the statistics that contradicts the progressive/democratic idea, that men could be househusbands. Statistically, of course, not individually. However there is no statistics that women can be both working and housewives. So women have it both ways, and man hang on by the thread of shrinking job markets. As it stands today.
    I heard a statistic on the radio a month or two ago (no, not conservative talk radio, btw, in case anyone was wondering) saying that simultaneously, while job markets for men are shrinking, and job markets for women are opening up wider and becoming more and more monopolized by women, while women are making more money and men are making less, that at the same time the percentage of women who say that it is very important to them that their potential husband make more money than they do is also skyrocketing. It's unbelievable. I swear, in so many ways, women as a group have become like a real world, human manifestation of the phrase "have their cake and eat it too".

    Sure, I have no doubt that in polls and stuff, women say they are perfectly comfortable with men being "househusbands" and bringing in no money as a contribution. I don't think they're lying, either. I think they are perfectly comfortable with it on a philosophical and ideological level... for other, hypothetical couples. Just not in their life. Not for a man they marry. Maybe we are heading that way and a couple generations from now we'll get there, but right now I just don't see it, in the real world. I have never in my life seen a well-off, professional woman marrying a man who makes ten bucks an hour, or doesn't work at all. On the other hand, I have certainly seen plenty of the reverse and no one questions it at all.

    Before anyone jumps on me btw, I am aware that I'm speaking in broad generalizations. I'm sure many people know a couple or two who embody the reverse of what was once the norm. But sometimes in discussions like these, generalities are what counts, because by and large that's what is happening.

  2. #192
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    Re: Women voting, bad idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by NitroHangover View Post
    I heard a statistic on the radio a month or two ago (no, not conservative talk radio, btw, in case anyone was wondering) saying that simultaneously, while job markets for men are shrinking, and job markets for women are opening up wider and becoming more and more monopolized by women, while women are making more money and men are making less, that at the same time the percentage of women who say that it is very important to them that their potential husband make more money than they do is also skyrocketing. It's unbelievable. I swear, in so many ways, women as a group have become like a real world, human manifestation of the phrase "have their cake and eat it too".

    Sure, I have no doubt that in polls and stuff, women say they are perfectly comfortable with men being "househusbands" and bringing in no money as a contribution. I don't think they're lying, either. I think they are perfectly comfortable with it on a philosophical and ideological level... for other, hypothetical couples. Just not in their life. Not for a man they marry. Maybe we are heading that way and a couple generations from now we'll get there, but right now I just don't see it, in the real world. I have never in my life seen a well-off, professional woman marrying a man who makes ten bucks an hour, or doesn't work at all. On the other hand, I have certainly seen plenty of the reverse and no one questions it at all.

    Before anyone jumps on me btw, I am aware that I'm speaking in broad generalizations. I'm sure many people know a couple or two who embody the reverse of what was once the norm. But sometimes in discussions like these, generalities are what counts, because by and large that's what is happening.
    I can't find anything relating to that claim that women want men who make more than they do in increasing numbers.

    But, if it's true, I could believe it, for one very simple reason.

    Women out-pacing men in education and the work force is a very recent phenomena. So recent that all of these women grew up in a society where men were still thought of as bread winners.

    Economics can change overnight, but gender bigotry lasts for a lifetime unless the person makes a conscious effort to change it within themselves.

    I can tell you that for myself, I've dated guys all over the map, including those who either make less than me or have higher expenses (thus effectively having less money). It really doesn't bother me, personally, even in a cohabitation situation. I just expect them to contribute in some other way.

    Would I be in a committed relationship with a capable man who was persistently unemployed and stayed home? Probably not, but it's not because he's a man. It's because I'm childfree, so it's not like there will ever be kids to take care of. Domestic stuff is definitely work, but it's not 8 hours a day work if you don't have kids so there's no justification for him deciding to just not work. Also, I am very career oriented and I think I would have trouble relating to someone who had no career ambitions at all.

    It doesn't matter to me what he's making. What matters to me is that he cares about something. If what he cares about pays beans, that's fine.
    Last edited by SmokeAndMirrors; 10-14-12 at 02:47 AM.

  3. #193
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    Re: Women voting, bad idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    What say you, should women be voting?
    Voted no for the lulz. We live in a democratic republic anyway, votes don't mean **** unless you vote the same way the majority of the designated electors within the electoral college vote. Voting is just a feel-good device designed to make the general populace feel important.
    I love the NSA. It's like having a secret fan-base you will never see, but they're there, watching everything you write and it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that I may be some person's only form of unconstitutional entertainment one night.

  4. #194
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    Re: Women voting, bad idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by NitroHangover View Post
    No. None of that changes what the guy said. Does what he said not offend you as a feminist?
    I am sorry, but about what guy are you talking?
    Former military man (and now babysitter of Donald Trump) John Kelly, is a big loud lying empty barrel!

  5. #195
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    Re: Women voting, bad idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by NitroHangover View Post
    Because the man is obviously a feminist himself, or at least considers himself one. He is never going to realize that his ugly views about men are (supposedly) unacceptable for a feminist unless feminists, and women in general, tell him so. In droves. It's not going to matter to him coming from me, clearly.

    And I harp on the feminists about it because I hold a strong suspicion that those types of views and that type of rhetoric regarding men are generally acceptable among many feminists, and I am hoping that some feminists will come along and prove me wrong. So far, none have. None have condemned it. Women have even liked his posts along the way. This is very disturbing to me. It strengthens the notion that feminists are not really anti-sexism, anti-discrimination, anti-gender stereotyping, and pro-equality as they claim... but rather pro-woman and anti-man.

    All I want is some indication that that's not true.
    If the complain party you were having is still about my remarks, here are a few things:

    1. I am not a feminist
    2. I do not consider myself a feminist
    3. I have realistic views about how some men are dumb, beer swilling, violent people with a cavemen attitude towards women
    4. not all men are that kind of insensitive Neanderthal men but as long as there is a view in society that what these men are doing is not so terrible they will not have to do a thing to change their attitude. There are still plenty of enablers who do not think that what these men are doing is that bad, and those enablers are both genders IMHO.
    5. my first statement was to a point sarcasm, when I said "if anyone has to loose their right to vote it is men because.....". But that does not mean that I want men to loose their right to vote or think they should loose that right. My issue with the first statement as to why women should not be allowed to vote (generalizing all women by this woman's twisted view on women in general) is that "if" anyone at all has to loose their right to vote it should not be women but that men might be much more "on the block" by past behavior to loose this right (again, I do not think they should).
    6. women do not have to prove anything. Sure there are women with warped views of men, I met a lady once who refused to cook meals for her sons because she was not their house slave. But during my 10 years plus working at a hard rock bar (not the famous one but a regular one) I have met many men with cavemen attitudes to women. A lot of these views were about the place of women in society but even more where about where women are in their relationships and what their rights and duties to them were.
    7. women might have liked my post because they too had the same idea as I had, the somewhat sarcastic view that "if" anyone has the right to loose the right to vote, why not men? And as said before, I do not want to loose their voting rights but if there has to be made a choice then why not men?
    8. of course some women are anti-men. And some have the right to be that. There are hundreds and hundreds of battered women shelters in the US because some men do not think women are anything more than punching bags. And I know, that is just a small number of men and most men would never ever raise their hands to their spouse/loved one, it still happens on a daily basis. And more than that. Doctor Phil had a show with men and women who were having problems, a lot of these problems had to do with these men having a terrible attitude towards women's rights in their marriage and the equality between men and women.

    and finally:
    9. Yes women have to stand up, but not to validate your need of for reassurance (just kidding) but they have to stand up for their rights.
    Former military man (and now babysitter of Donald Trump) John Kelly, is a big loud lying empty barrel!

  6. #196
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    Re: Women voting, bad idea?

    You think taking all guns would be difficult an dangerous....try taking womens right to vote lol....but anyway kind of a silly questions all considered.

  7. #197
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    Re: Women voting, bad idea?

    I can't believe this is a real question...
    Gary Johnson 2012!!!

    There is all the difference in the world between treating people equally and attempting to make them equal. - F.A. Hayek

  8. #198
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    Re: Women voting, bad idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Letting women vote was a bad idea, Mississippi tea party leader says: Jarvis DeBerry

    Letting women vote was a bad idea, Mississippi tea party leader says: Jarvis DeBerry | NOLA.com



    Not really breaking news, so I didn't put it there.

    What say you, should women be voting?
    Ah the "Tea Party." Continuing to stand up for the same views as the original teapartiers---representation in government only for the people we consider to be worthy of it.
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  9. #199
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    Re: Women voting, bad idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by NitroHangover View Post
    I heard a statistic on the radio a month or two ago (no, not conservative talk radio, btw, in case anyone was wondering) saying that simultaneously, while job markets for men are shrinking, and job markets for women are opening up wider and becoming more and more monopolized by women, while women are making more money and men are making less, that at the same time the percentage of women who say that it is very important to them that their potential husband make more money than they do is also skyrocketing. It's unbelievable. I swear, in so many ways, women as a group have become like a real world, human manifestation of the phrase "have their cake and eat it too".
    I don't follow you here - have their cake and eat it, too? Is there something wrong with wanting to be successful as a couple? Aside from what Smoke already said (that there are no statistics to back up your claim that women want their husbands to make more money) - women, as a group, are so diverse it's not even funny. Just like men. Not all men fill the stereotypical power-grabbing CEO world empire male niche.

    Sure, I have no doubt that in polls and stuff, women say they are perfectly comfortable with men being "househusbands" and bringing in no money as a contribution. I don't think they're lying, either. I think they are perfectly comfortable with it on a philosophical and ideological level... for other, hypothetical couples. Just not in their life. Not for a man they marry.
    Now - there' a huge difference between having a partner that isn't employed at all - and having a partner that just brings in less than you do. My Dad brings in significantly less than my mother does - they're perfectly fine. Because when you're a couple it's not just *his income* and *her income* as separate entities. It's *our* income - *household* income.

    Of course - *my* household income is significant right now but I don't earn it actively. I'm a sahm (stay at home mom) - well - college mom, now. And I don't bring in the money, sure. But without me being a stay at home mom for all these years we wouldn't have been able to make a decent life for ourselves. We bought a shackle of a house and I've improved it. We've saved thousands every year on gas and childcare because I don't need to drive to work and put the kids in a care program of some type after school. . . .so on - so forth. I can spend an entire day coupon clipping and shopping for the bargain saving further money. My husband earns the money and I spend as little as possible - as wisely as possible.

    It's not like I'm a bump on a log here - and if I was employed - a lot of this, like the kitchen, wouldn't be getting done. And a stay at home dad is the same thing.

    Of course - a 'homemaker' is slightly different in my view. I stay home because of the child-issue, mainly. . . if I don't ever get a job - I'd be a homemaker. . .and that is something I have a problem with. Children and some other full time activity (like home renovations) are the main things I'd support for a homemaker - but if they don't have a reason *not* to work I see nothing standing in their way of fulltime employment.

    No one wants to take care of someone when that other is doing nothing with their time. . . it doesn't take much to shift into being a lazy bum. Male or female - doesn't matter. If you aren't working you better be doing something worthy of support.

    My goal for myself is to get through college - and at some point earn enough to where my husband doesn't have to work if he does't want to. He's older than me - worn out from his health issues and years in the military. He's a wonderful husband - supportive of my many endeavors, even the ones that didn't work out and chewed up a lot of money in the process of my failure - and I feel like he's earned a real break without having to worry about the bills.

    But I can attest from personal experience that stay at home dads are fabulous - better than I was. They're moer active, outgoing, and don't whine about chores. I can tell you I still delay the laundry for as long as possible and maybe it'll be next week when I finally get around to folding it - because I hate that ****. However, I've know 7 stay at home dads (temporary - sure - because they were unemployed for a stretch of time - but sahds none the less) and they were great. The house was always clean, everything was always done, the kids had trips to the zoo and everything else. They really approached it like a job - whether they enjoyed it or not didn't seem to matter at all. . . and they did truly enjoy spending time with their kids. My brother in law was phenomenal. He took a cooking class during his time as a sahd and my sister would come home to international cuisine every night. Meanwhile - it took me 2 years to remodel the kids entire bathroom. LOL It probably would have taken him 2 months.
    Last edited by Aunt Spiker; 10-14-12 at 11:51 AM.
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  10. #200
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    Re: Women voting, bad idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Letting women vote was a bad idea, Mississippi tea party leader says: Jarvis DeBerry

    Letting women vote was a bad idea, Mississippi tea party leader says: Jarvis DeBerry | NOLA.com



    Not really breaking news, so I didn't put it there.

    What say you, should women be voting?
    Hells no Women shouldn't be voting. Its too complicated for her. A woman's place is pregnant ,barr foot, popping babies and ready to fix her man a sandwich and to get him a beer at a moments notice.(sarcasm)
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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