View Poll Results: Does An American Have Freedom Of Science?

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  • No; there are limits to religious freedom when that is contradicted by science

    5 19.23%
  • Science cannot limit an American's freedom of religion

    7 26.92%
  • Sometimes. Kids should be taught whatever their parents want, but not abused.

    2 7.69%
  • I think my religion explains the world and I have no use for science

    0 0%
  • What I do in my private life is my own business, and I can raise my kids however I like

    10 38.46%
  • No opinion or undecided

    2 7.69%
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Thread: You Have No Constitutional Right To Your Own Science

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    You Have No Constitutional Right To Your Own Science

    Science is the process of ascertaining what reality is. You may not accept some scientific theories -- for example, I reject all the evidence that second-hand smoke causes lung cancer, as I do not believe the method used to reach the conclusion was sound.

    However, if you have beliefs, for religious or other purposes, that you cannot die in a fire because you have on "magic underwear", or that humans lived at the same time as dinosaurs, you have no right -- in your capacity as my neighbor, representative or fellow voter -- to impose such nonsense on me. You cannot call such beliefs "science", and I should not be buying textbooks for schoolchildren via my tax dollars that teach such silliness. If you believe your gay child is possessed by the devil, that's sad. But if you try and torture that child to "convert" him or "cleanse" him, I'll be sending the cops along to arrest you for child abuse.

    There is a difference between thinking abortion is wrong and thinking abortion does not exist, or is killing off a race of aliens.

    So, my fundamentalist fellow Americans: feel free to embrace your fairy tales...but do not ask me to pay for them.

    What say you?
    Last edited by Pinkie; 10-07-12 at 12:18 PM.

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    Re: You Have No Constitutional Right To Your Own Science

    Don't impose your beliefs on my children, and I won't impose my beliefs on yours.

    Fiddling While Rome Burns
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    Re: You Have No Constitutional Right To Your Own Science

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Don't impose your beliefs on my children, and I won't impose my beliefs on yours.
    Absolutely.

    But if your beliefs inspire you to beat your child, don't your fellow Americans have the right to stop you?

    If you believe ridiculous things, must your fellow Americans buy textbooks for your kids that teach them these beliefs are "science"?

    And if I elect you, do you have the right (as my political representative) to denounce a scientific breakthrough on the basis of your religious beliefs?

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    Re: You Have No Constitutional Right To Your Own Science

    Quote Originally Posted by Pinkie View Post
    Absolutely.

    But if your beliefs inspire you to beat your child, don't your fellow Americans have the right to stop you?

    If you believe ridiculous things, must your fellow Americans buy textbooks for your kids that teach them these beliefs are "science"?

    And if I elect you, do you have the right (as my political representative) to denounce a scientific breakthrough on the basis of your religious beliefs?
    There is no reason to limit this to science or religion. The principle at work in your question is one based upon human liberty. It is not: "Do I have the right to impose my religion or my phony science upon you?" but "Do I have the right to impose my will upon my fellow man in any context?" Answer question #2 and you answer question #1.

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    Re: You Have No Constitutional Right To Your Own Science

    Science does not limit freedom of religion.

    It only shows us what reality is. Specifically, the natural world. Not the supernatural world, which is the realm of Religion and Theology.

    You can't reject reality without being a delusional idiot. Mind you, you have the right to be a delusional idiot. But, reality is what you're going to be taught about in schools, not your fantasies.

    Of course, an uneducated populace, in no circumstance, can maintain any form of democracy and liberty.

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    Re: You Have No Constitutional Right To Your Own Science

    Quote Originally Posted by DinodudeEpic View Post
    Of course, an uneducated populace, in no circumstance, can maintain any form of democracy and liberty.
    No wonder we're going down hill...
    Men do what they have to when they want to, Great men do what they have to, even when they don't want to.

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    Re: You Have No Constitutional Right To Your Own Science

    Quote Originally Posted by Pinkie View Post
    Absolutely.

    But if your beliefs inspire you to beat your child, don't your fellow Americans have the right to stop you?

    If you believe ridiculous things, must your fellow Americans buy textbooks for your kids that teach them these beliefs are "science"?

    And if I elect you, do you have the right (as my political representative) to denounce a scientific breakthrough on the basis of your religious beliefs?



    1. Discipline yes. Beat abusively no.

    2. Those who want their children to be educated in a certain manner differing substantially from societal norms should put their children in private schools. This would include rabid atheists who don't want their children exposed to Christmas as much as fundamentalists who don't want their children exposed to evolution. Vouchers.

    3. Denounce? As is "speak against"? Sure, anyone can say anything. Denounce as in "try to block it"? Well, the bugger's got to stand to election doesn't he? Hold him accountable at the polls.

    Fiddling While Rome Burns
    ISIS: Carthago Delenda Est
    "I used to roll the dice; see the fear in my enemies' eyes... listen as the crowd would sing, 'now the old king is dead, Long Live the King.'.."

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    Re: You Have No Constitutional Right To Your Own Science

    Pinkie, I have no way of making a choice in your poll. You have mixed things up too much. Clarify your thinking and give me some choices on just one aspect of freedom of and from religion.

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    Re: You Have No Constitutional Right To Your Own Science

    Quote Originally Posted by OhIsee.Then View Post
    Pinkie, I have no way of making a choice in your poll. You have mixed things up too much. Clarify your thinking and give me some choices on just one aspect of freedom of and from religion.
    I'm sorry; you aren't alone in finding my poll confusing.

    Choice 1: When science conflicts, everyone in America is ruled by science in their public lives, and children are as well in their private lives.

    Choice 2: Science is a religion, and no more sound than mine.

    Choice 3: No taxpayer should buy books for science classes which contain false statements based on religion.

    Choice 4: I have no use for science.

    Choice 5: Parents should have no limits placed on how they treat their kids based upon science.

    Choice 6: Undecided or no opinion.

    Maybe Goshin can alter the poll questions?

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    Re: You Have No Constitutional Right To Your Own Science

    Why we are treating the two as somehow similar is beyond me. Science and religion are two separate entities and should be treated as such. Government does indeed need to deal with both, but separately. Both evolution and intelligent design can indeed be taught in schools, but not together. Intelligent design belongs in a Religion class and Evolution in a Science class. I do not believe one or the other.

    Many people seem to be polarised by this issue, why either has to be the basis for public policy is baffling, and why it is a continued source of debate is even more so. Again, they are separate and should be treated as such.
    "After all, you know, there are worse things in life than death. I mean, if you've ever spent an evening with an insurance salesman, you know exactly what I mean."
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