View Poll Results: Are Unions Still Viable?

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  • Yes

    27 48.21%
  • No

    16 28.57%
  • Sometimes

    13 23.21%
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Thread: Are Unions Still Viable?

  1. #21
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    Re: Are Unions Still Viable?

    Sometimes is the best answer for this question...

    In some unions it is very viable...see NFL

    In others...not so much....public sector unions
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  2. #22
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    Re: Are Unions Still Viable?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Laws? Who passed them?
    economic laws, haymarket. you are arguing that corporate entities such as unions have ceased to have the same aggregate effects in the last couple of decades that they had in the previous 4 decades. Your evidence for doing so seems to be "i have a study that agrees with me and disagrees with you".

    the strongest bit of evidence for the OP remains simple history - unions are doomed because of the destruction they bring to bear on the industries and employers they attach themselves to. they are a vanishingly small section of the private sector, and even their public sector allies are finding it increasingly difficult to remain tied to them.

    You use reports that are a decade out of date and fail to take in the changes wrought by foreign outsourcing and you get all whiny when I point it out.

    Too bad.
    tell me more about how foriegn outsourcing will have uniquely not effected union states. This ought to be fun.

  3. #23
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    Re: Are Unions Still Viable?

    Quote Originally Posted by MarineTpartier View Post
    I recently attended a course where I was instructed on the inspection of OSHA code as well as Laser, Radiation, small arms firing range, etc safety. I started thinking while I was subjected to death by Power Point "With all of these OSHA codes, minimum wage, workman's comp laws, etc. What do union's do?" Therein lies the question. What DO unions do? OSHA code, if you are not familiar with it, is the epitomy of ridiculous regulations imposed by the Federal gov't. Some of it is good, I will admit, but dictating how many toilets I have to have on a work site is going a little far. Minimum wage is something we are all familiar with. Workman's Comp is very complicated however, it is required in all states depending upon the states regulations. Unions don't have to negotiate safer working environments, the Federal gov't does that already. They don't have to negotiate salary, the Federal gov't does that already. They don't have to make businesses compensate injured employees, the state governments does that already. What I see of unions is almost always bad. They demand pay that is more than the market rate. They demand benefits that are more than the market rate. They demand work conditions that are more than OSHA code requires. Unions, IMO, were needed in the early industrialization of the US. Now, they are nothing more than an irritant. Am I wrong?
    ***Please, keep the debate civil. Just because someone holds a different opinion than you doesn't mean they are a lesser form of human than you.***

    I will give you the perfect example to answer your post...whether you accept it is up to you....I worked for a company and I was in the union...the shop steward recieved numerous complaints from union workers about an unsafe working condition. He went to management brought up the concern, management blew him off and said there is no safety issues it was worker laziness and error that caused the injuries....The shop steward called the Local President and explained the situation and the union had their lawyer look into it....the lawyer found that in a 7 yr period 34 employees were injured over this steamer...he checked further and found the steamer not to be up to safety code...he contacted management and afforded them an opportunity to JUST FIX THE STEAMER....they refused and kept denying there was a problem...the lawyer took the next step osha stepped investigated the steamer said it was NOT UP TO SAFTEY cod and they had x amount of time to fix it...and then the fines start.....they fixed it...they could have saved alot of time and alot of problems.....THATS what unions and Osha does...some people just cannot understand how unscrupulous and uncaring some in business. The workers and their unions are not the villains republicans always want to make them out to be...you have villains of your own

  4. #24
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    Re: Are Unions Still Viable?

    Unions proved themselves no longer 'viable' when they became enmeshed with political parties and organized crime. Today, unions reward nepotism and preserve incompetence. They are every bit as much of the problem with job loss in this country as are industry owners. They are leeches and parasites. They dont 'create' anything but rather suck and drain off resources.

  5. #25
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    Re: Are Unions Still Viable?

    Unions remain a viable source of campaign funds for candidates from the Democratic party.

    That's about it - and, to the Democrats, that's all that matters.

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    Re: Are Unions Still Viable?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    One other reason is that the advice given to companies trying to stop a union is simple: pay your people what unions shops pay and give them the same benefits. Thus, many non union companies and their employees are riding on the success of the union movement and their workers do not even realize it.
    This is an excellent point.
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  7. #27
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    Re: Are Unions Still Viable?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    economic laws, haymarket. you are arguing that corporate entities such as unions have ceased to have the same aggregate effects in the last couple of decades that they had in the previous 4 decades. Your evidence for doing so seems to be "i have a study that agrees with me and disagrees with you".

    the strongest bit of evidence for the OP remains simple history - unions are doomed because of the destruction they bring to bear on the industries and employers they attach themselves to. they are a vanishingly small section of the private sector, and even their public sector allies are finding it increasingly difficult to remain tied to them.



    tell me more about how foriegn outsourcing will have uniquely not effected union states. This ought to be fun.
    You are simply anti-union.

    History proves your assumption are false. Look at the greatest period of prosperity in the last century in America - the Fifties and Sixties - and they are also the period of highest percentage of union membership. Your allegations about history and unions are simply false and not supported.

    As to foreign outsourcing and not impacting union states - I have no idea what you are talking about. It seems that neither do you since you simply threw a few words out there and did not develop the thought.
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  8. #28
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    Re: Are Unions Still Viable?

    private sector unions are still viable in certain aspects.

    public sector unions are not viable, except as campaign financiers.

  9. #29
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    Re: Are Unions Still Viable?

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Unions proved themselves no longer 'viable' when they became enmeshed with political parties and organized crime. Today, unions reward nepotism and preserve incompetence. They are every bit as much of the problem with job loss in this country as are industry owners. They are leeches and parasites. They dont 'create' anything but rather suck and drain off resources.
    Thats just your opinion...there are republican involved with organized crime and theres been people from all walks of life involved in organized crime.
    Organized crime is not limited to the Italian Mafia...Jamie Dimon Ceo of Jpmorgan was involved in organized crime...the list is endless.
    Leeches and parasites are all the banks that have been LOSING IN COURT left and right for sucking the blood from the working class daily....you need to get off your silly republican talking points and find some reality.

  10. #30
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    Re: Are Unions Still Viable?

    Quote Originally Posted by lpast View Post
    Thats just your opinion...there are republican involved with organized crime and theres been people from all walks of life involved in organized crime.
    Organized crime is not limited to the Italian Mafia...Jamie Dimon Ceo of Jpmorgan was involved in organized crime...the list is endless.
    Leeches and parasites are all the banks that have been LOSING IN COURT left and right for sucking the blood from the working class daily....you need to get off your silly republican talking points and find some reality.
    You and your 'liker' are the best counter arguments I could possibly make.

    Unions are leeches. They dont start businesses. They dont hire people. They have outlived their usefulness and today serve to protect incompetent workers and stuff political campaign coffers.

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