View Poll Results: Are we better off in the 21c compared to 19c?

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  • Yes, much better

    36 72.00%
  • Yes, slightly better

    4 8.00%
  • No change

    0 0%
  • No, slightly worse

    2 4.00%
  • No, much worse

    6 12.00%
  • I can't make up my mind

    1 2.00%
  • Other

    1 2.00%
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Thread: Are we better off in the 21c compared to 19c?

  1. #51
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    Re: Are we better off in the 21c compared to 19c?

    Quote Originally Posted by Luna Tick View Post
    Yes, but we've gone backward since the 20th Century.
    That was twelve years ago. Yeah that sounds right.

  2. #52
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    Re: Are we better off in the 21c compared to 19c?

    Quote Originally Posted by LiberalAvenger View Post
    That was twelve years ago. Yeah that sounds right.
    Farther back into the 20th Century when the middle class was doing better.

  3. #53
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    Re: Are we better off in the 21c compared to 19c?

    Quote Originally Posted by Luna Tick View Post
    Farther back into the 20th Century when the middle class was doing better.
    Sure, as long as they were white. And if you were a woman, your financial situation was still dominantly dependent on a man. Being independent as a woman was pretty tough right up until the 70's.

    It may be true the middle class was more stable, but they were also homogenized, oppressive, exclusionary, and bigoted.

  4. #54
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    Re: Are we better off in the 21c compared to 19c?

    Quote Originally Posted by Luna Tick View Post
    Farther back into the 20th Century when the middle class was doing better.
    OK. We will need another world war to do that well.

  5. #55
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    Re: Are we better off in the 21c compared to 19c?

    Quote Originally Posted by Luna Tick View Post
    Yes, but we've gone backward since the 20th Century.
    Not at all. We now have ubiquitous cell phones and internet, stem cell therapies, GMO foods, and other new technological marvels that have already made this world a better place...and we're only 12 years into the new century. We'll soon have self-driving cars, ubiquitous 3D printing, better genetic therapies, efficient solar energy, hydroponic agriculture, sustainable (and healthier) meat production, and the near-eradication of many diseases including malaria.

    And if we're defining "we" as "citizens of earth" rather than "citizens of the United States," then we've also made a lot of economic progress since the 20th century. The world is far better off today than it was just 12 years ago by almost any measurement, and we still have a lot to look forward to in the 21st century.
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    Re: Are we better off in the 21c compared to 19c?

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors View Post
    I honestly can't even imagine how anyone could ask whether we're better off now or 200 years ago.
    Well, now you can.

    Material progress does not automatically equal human progress.

  7. #57
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    Re: Are we better off in the 21c compared to 19c?

    Quote Originally Posted by Canell View Post
    Well, now you can.

    Material progress does not automatically equal human progress.
    You're right, but I just rattled off half a dozen ways in which we've made dramatic human progress in the last 200 years. I'm sure there are hundreds.

    Society is less violent, more caring, better educated, and more equal than it ever was anywhere in the world 200 years ago.

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    Re: Are we better off in the 21c compared to 19c?

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors View Post
    Society is less violent, more caring, better educated, and more equal than it ever was anywhere in the world 200 years ago.
    It may be banal to quote this but here we go anyways:

    snopes.com: The Paradox of Our Time

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    Re: Are we better off in the 21c compared to 19c?

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors View Post
    You're right, but I just rattled off half a dozen ways in which we've made dramatic human progress in the last 200 years. I'm sure there are hundreds.

    Society is less violent, more caring, better educated, and more equal than it ever was anywhere in the world 200 years ago.
    Less violent? Serial killers, mass shootings at schools, texas tower, resturants, you name it. Oh I almost forgot 9-11.

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    Re: Are we better off in the 21c compared to 19c?

    Most likely because there was more of the natural world that was "unscathed".
    "The assumption that animals are without rights and the illusion that our treatment of them has no moral significance is a positively outrageous example of Western crudity and barbarity. Universal compassion is the only guarantee of morality." - Schopenhauer

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