View Poll Results: Should Harry Reid Resign?

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  • Of course, you can't lie about stuff like that if you are an elected US official

    22 46.81%
  • No, politicians lie all the time.

    16 34.04%
  • Nope, still don't believe Romney has ever paid taxes.

    9 19.15%
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Thread: Should Harry Reid Resign?

  1. #21
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    Re: Should Harry Reid Resign?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    Reid's words... "But Mitt Romney can't do that because he's basically paid no taxes in the prior 12 years."

    I don't believe paying $6.2 million in taxes can be accurately described as " basically paid no taxes"... you?
    Still only addressing the 2 years released. Yes, what percentage of his income has Mitt Romney paid over 12 years? If he's paid 6.2 million out of say 80 million, then it could easily be argued that yes he's basically paid no taxes. Until he releases what is being asked for, Reid's claim is not disproved. Actually, as it stand,s Mitt Romney has paid far less taxes than a sizeable percentage of Americans. He's paid what? 14.1%? His secretaries pay more taxes without the help of tax shelters, lawyers and IRS savvy assistants to help them.

    Reid has Romney where he wants him. He's showing just how little in taxes the guy is paying in comparison to the "middle class" which sometimes pays 35%. Romney can cry about the raw figures as much as he wants. However some people will only look at the percentage he pays vs the percentage they pay and wonder why he keeps a higher percentage of his wealthy income than they do. People are eventually going to start demanding he pay a higher percentage because he can afford to far more than they can. It's as good a political chess game as I've seen anybody play and Romney is pretty close to being check mated.

    This isn't the Obama birther thing. There is definitely political fallout from releasing these documents. Which is why Romney is in a tough position. Obama released his birth certificate. And what? It made birthers the laughing stock of the crowd. Romney releases his tax returns and the majority of Americans will take notice of just what percentage of his income he's "forced" to live with vs what they are forced to live with.
    Last edited by Hatuey; 09-23-12 at 11:59 AM.
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  2. #22
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    Re: Should Harry Reid Resign?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Still only addressing the 2 years released. Yes, what percentage of his income has Mitt Romney paid over 12 years? If he's paid 6.2 million out of say 80 million, then it could easily be argued that yes he's basically paid no taxes. Until he releases what is being asked for, Reid's claim is not disproved. Actually, as it stand,s Mitt Romney has paid far less taxes than a sizeable percentage of Americans. He's paid what? 14.1%? His secretaries pay more taxes without the help of tax shelters, lawyers and IRS savvy assistants to help them.
    first, i'm going by Reids exact words... and not interjecting a metric that isn't stated... by that, i mean , Reid did not say he paid no taxes over the course of 12 years .. he said he paid no taxes in the prior 12 years.
    paying 1 dollar anywhere in that 12 years disproves his claim, based upon the verbiage he employed.
    I can understand how and why people will claim to know what Reid meant.. but I also know what he actually said.... it's all part of the same game


    as for Mitt paying less taxes than his secretaries... well, we know that's a false claim in terms of real dollars... but it's also a false comparison.
    we know most of his income is taxed as capital gains... and we also know that if his secretaries income was in the form of capital gains, their rate would be identical.
    we know that his income, from wages, is taxed at the same exact rates as his secretaries income from wages... maybe even more if his income from wages surpasses her's on the progressive rate scale
    sure, you can argue income should be income should be income... but that is not reality, that is not law... that's an argument based in an alternate reality.

    Reid has Romney where he wants him. He's showing just how little in taxes the guy is paying in comparison to the "middle class" which pays 35%. Romney can cry about the raw figures as much as he wants. However some people will only look at the percentage he pays vs the percentage they pay and wonder why he keeps 86% of his income while they only get to keep 65%. People are eventually going to start demanding he pay a higher percentage because he can afford to far more than they can. It's as good a political chess game as I've seen anybody play and Romney is pretty close to being check mated.
    it's political gamesmanship, to be sure... and not without merit.... it's poor in terms of "truthiness" , but smart in terms of political theater.
    unfortunately, Democrats tipped their hand when they started chastising Romney for paying too much in taxes on the return he just released.
    it is as clear as a sunny day that what his tax return tells us is irrelevant... pay too little, pay too much... it doesn't matter.. the populist smears march on.

    This isn't the Obama birther thing. There is definitely political fallout from releasing these documents. Which is why Romney is in a tough position. Obama released his birth certificate. And what? It made birthers the laughing stock of the crowd. Romney releases his tax returns and the majority of Americans will take notice of just what percentage of his income he's "forced" to live with vs what they are forced to live with.
    true, I don't see this as being like the birther thing either..I see it as the run of the mill political theater and spin... nothing new, nothing unusual... same old disingenuous political crapola.

    Romney does a poor job at defending against this tactic though...he seems kinda weak right now.
    he needs to point out things like giving away 4 million in charity along with the 2 million in taxes he paid in 2011... he needs to invoke Judge Learned Hand.... he needs to do a lot of things he isn't doing.... it's not like the Democratic talking points are bulletproof... far from it.

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    Re: Should Harry Reid Resign?

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain America View Post
    I have always heard that people in glass houses should not throw stones.

    If we ousted every lying politician, there would be none left to screw us blind.

    Mitt is on record for fibbing time and time again. Should we have him resign the GOP candidacy?
    What Reid did was considerably more than a "fib." Do you not agree?
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    Re: Should Harry Reid Resign?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    So he's released 20% of what is being asked for. Still doesn't disprove Reid's claim.
    Price Waterhouse, who prepared his taxes, says that at least since 1990, Reid is full of ****:

    Letter from PricewaterhouseCoopers | Mitt Romney for President
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: Should Harry Reid Resign?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    Price Waterhouse, who prepared his taxes, says that at least since 1990, Reid is full of ****:

    Letter from PricewaterhouseCoopers | Mitt Romney for President
    The Romney campaign with a digital letter from PricewaterhouseCoopers says that. - so where are the returns?
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Should Harry Reid Resign?

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain America View Post
    I have always heard that people in glass houses should not throw stones.

    If we ousted every lying politician, there would be none left to screw us blind.

    Mitt is on record for fibbing time and time again. Should we have him resign the GOP candidacy?
    Yes. They should be licensed to practice politics. And things like this should lead to them losing that license. Including Romney.
    “Tyranny is defined as that which is legal for the government but illegal for the citizenry.”
    ― Thomas Jefferson

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    Re: Should Harry Reid Resign?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    The Romney campaign with a digital letter from PricewaterhouseCoopers says that. - so where are the returns?
    It's not a "digital letter"; it's scanned pieces of paper. Are you suggesting it's a forgery? Or that the general counsel of PWC is lying? Or both?
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: Should Harry Reid Resign?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    The Romney campaign with a digital letter from PricewaterhouseCoopers says that. - so where are the returns?
    Why should have to show them?

    BTW I have never from my first job sweeping floor in a saw mill, to the engineering position I have now paid 35%. And that has covered just about all ranges of middle class.
    “Tyranny is defined as that which is legal for the government but illegal for the citizenry.”
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    Re: Should Harry Reid Resign?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aberration View Post
    Why should have to show them?
    For the same reason Obama ended up showing his birth certificate. End of controversy. The longer he takes, the more people will become suspicious. The relevance of Obama's birth certificate was none to most people for the simple reason that all security agencies do background checks on members of congress. Tax returns? Not so much.

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    It's not a "digital letter"; it's scanned pieces of paper. Are you suggesting it's a forgery? Or that the general counsel of PWC is lying? Or both?
    No. I'm suggesting that Romney still hasn't released any evidence to refute the claims being made. Release the return like your father, end of claims.

    Or was this only relevant when it had to do with a birth certificate?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    Not that most of you can handle linguistic subtlety, but he didn't "question the authenticity" of Obama's birth certificate. He pointed out that Obama has yet to produce one, which is true.

    While this COULD be questioning authenticity, it could also be, as it is for others, offered as an example of the secrecy and untrustworthiness inherent in Obama -- if there's nothing to hide, why can't he just show it? Is there something on the full-out certificate he doesn't want people to know, separate from his place of birth? Questions will linger as long as the actual certificate -- which is much more detailed than the computer-generated version Hawaii produced -- is kept confidential.

    In other words, one can accept his place of birth and his natural-born citizenship while at the same time wondering what else it is he might not want people to know. Given the context of of what the man said, and the fact that the Republican club shouted down the audience member who wanted to raise MORE questions about Obama's citizenship, it certainly isn't unreasonable to suspect this was more likely the case. Why is there so much secrecy in an Administration which pledged to be 100% transparent?
    Come on Harshaw, step up and let's see you back up your own words here. Or is this different?
    Last edited by Hatuey; 09-23-12 at 01:09 PM.
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    Re: Should Harry Reid Resign?

    well, despite no evidence to the claims of him paying "no taxes in 12 years".... despite smatterings of evidence to the contrary of those claims.... some folks are just gonna believe what their Democratic party leaders tell them to believe.

    maybe it's not so different from the birther thing after all

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