View Poll Results: Should we eliminate taxes that tax you for the right to own property?

Voters
34. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    20 58.82%
  • No

    7 20.59%
  • Eliminate just some of them(please comment on which ones and why)

    7 20.59%
Page 1 of 11 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 106

Thread: Should we eliminate taxes that tax you for the right to own property?

  1. #1
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Last Seen
    07-19-17 @ 03:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    60,458

    Should we eliminate taxes that tax you for the right to own property?

    Some good examples of this would be car registration and property taxes where you are charged to use your property, be it your car, or your home. When the government charges you for use they are in effect taking ownership of whatever it might be over, be it again, your car or your home and in effect making you a renter. It is clear this is a violation of property rights in on both front, but the question remains do we as a people agree with it? There is of course other examples of such taxes and my question does in fact include them as well.

    It should also be noted for our liberal friends that in many states you must renew your registration on your car every year and this can run easily up in the hundreds of dollars. Obviously, this can make it challenging for the poorer among us to pay such fees. Considering that they are supporters of the progressive tax system and enjoy the argument that the poor can not pay higher taxes when arguing for such a system it would make sense then to believe they would not be in support of this kind of tax.

  2. #2
    Pontificator
    iliveonramen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    On a Gravy Train with Biscuit Wheels
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 05:41 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    9,213

    Re: Should we eliminate taxes that tax you for the right to own property?

    It should also be noted for our liberal friends that in many states you must renew your registration on your car every year and this can run easily up in the hundreds of dollars. Obviously, this can make it challenging for the poorer among us to pay such fees. Considering that they are supporters of the progressive tax system and enjoy the argument that the poor can not pay higher taxes when arguing for such a system it would make sense then to believe they would not be in support of this kind of tax.
    I'm pretty sure most Liberals would be fine with eliminating those taxes if the revenue instead was raised through a progressive state/local income tax. I think conservatives would have a cow and most likely that's what is preventing it. The county I live in is very liberal and they instead have support systems in place via county tax to support those that can't afford the taxes you mention.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

  3. #3
    Discount Philosopher
    specklebang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Las Vegas
    Last Seen
    06-05-14 @ 08:26 PM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    11,524

    Re: Should we eliminate taxes that tax you for the right to own property?

    The point you are (perhaps inadvertently) making is that the accusation that the poor don't pay taxes is unfounded. Everyone pays taxes, lots and lots of them.

    Your examples of car and property tax are good. Often, more money means a more expensive house and more taxes. Poor means renting or minmal housing so little if any tax. Same with cars. When I bought my car new, the tax was almost $400.00. Now, 5 years later, the tax is down to about $130.00. People who drive beaters probably just pay the $30 minimum.

    The State needs to get taxes somewhere. Nobody likes to pay tax but without money, your State can not function.


    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Some good examples of this would be car registration and property taxes where you are charged to use your property, be it your car, or your home. When the government charges you for use they are in effect taking ownership of whatever it might be over, be it again, your car or your home and in effect making you a renter. It is clear this is a violation of property rights in on both front, but the question remains do we as a people agree with it? There is of course other examples of such taxes and my question does in fact include them as well.

    It should also be noted for our liberal friends that in many states you must renew your registration on your car every year and this can run easily up in the hundreds of dollars. Obviously, this can make it challenging for the poorer among us to pay such fees. Considering that they are supporters of the progressive tax system and enjoy the argument that the poor can not pay higher taxes when arguing for such a system it would make sense then to believe they would not be in support of this kind of tax.

  4. #4
    Politically Correct

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:17 AM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    2,851
    Blog Entries
    8

    Re: Should we eliminate taxes that tax you for the right to own property?

    At the very least, things like property taxes seem like a sensible way to pay for things like firefighters.
    (avatar by Thomas Nast)

  5. #5
    Guru

    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Last Seen
    09-14-16 @ 12:48 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    4,415

    Re: Should we eliminate taxes that tax you for the right to own property?

    Only tax on property:
    investment propertys
    2nd homes
    corp owned property

  6. #6
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Last Seen
    07-19-17 @ 03:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    60,458

    Re: Should we eliminate taxes that tax you for the right to own property?

    Quote Originally Posted by specklebang View Post
    The point you are (perhaps inadvertently) making is that the accusation that the poor don't pay taxes is unfounded. Everyone pays taxes, lots and lots of them.
    The point that is actually made there is that after everything is said and done they are left with more than they paid in taxes to begin with.


    Your examples of car and property tax are good. Often, more money means a more expensive house and more taxes. Poor means renting or minmal housing so little if any tax. Same with cars. When I bought my car new, the tax was almost $400.00. Now, 5 years later, the tax is down to about $130.00. People who drive beaters probably just pay the $30 minimum.
    I went today to get my car registered and there was a woman talking about her troubles revolving around her living arrangements with her friends. When she got up to get her car registration renewed it turned out to cost her $220 dollars. I couldn't help to think how someone can afford to spend $220 dollars when they are having trouble finding a stable place to lay their heads at night.

    In fact, I see many poor people driving around in newish cars but living in houses that were built back in the 1960's and probably cost in the low hundred range. In such neighborhoods its not rare to see pretty newish cars on regular basis in fact. I would imagine that many of these people never considered that on their first year owning the car it would cost them $500 bucks to just drive the car on the street.

    The State needs to get taxes somewhere. Nobody likes to pay tax but without money, your State can not function.
    Avenues are important and something people just carelessly forget. If I own my home or my car I should not lose it if I fail to pay the state as if they have some sort of claim to either my car or my home. If we are to believe that the state is the original owner (not saying I do but its an active argument) they would need to sell it to people for them to own and build whatever they wanted to build (which is actually another layer to the problem here since they actively control such things and once again asserting ownership of property) However, property taxes leads to you believe they never actually sold it at all and instead allowed people to simply build on their land and in turn they pay a fee for the continued use of it. When they in turn sell such property to another "user" this fee gets transfered to the new "user" as if it is simply rent and if this new "user" fails to pay such fee they are also up to losing such property as was the prior user when he used the property. This is in effect exactly how rental property works. If you fail to pay your rent you can be kicked out and lose access to the rental property. Do we as a people agree to only have the right to rent?
    Last edited by Henrin; 09-21-12 at 03:26 PM.

  7. #7
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Last Seen
    07-19-17 @ 03:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    60,458

    Re: Should we eliminate taxes that tax you for the right to own property?

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    I'm pretty sure most Liberals would be fine with eliminating those taxes if the revenue instead was raised through a progressive state/local income tax. I think conservatives would have a cow and most likely that's what is preventing it. The county I live in is very liberal and they instead have support systems in place via county tax to support those that can't afford the taxes you mention.
    Income taxes are even worse. In that case they are not only asserting ownership of property, but ownership of the fruits of your labor and anything they do not take is simply a gift from the real owner.

  8. #8
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Last Seen
    07-19-17 @ 03:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    60,458

    Re: Should we eliminate taxes that tax you for the right to own property?

    Quote Originally Posted by 274ina View Post
    Only tax on property:
    investment propertys
    2nd homes
    corp owned property
    That is all just revolving around the rich though as if the amount you have is somehow important here to it being an acceptable avenue or not. I do not believe such things matter to the overall question.

  9. #9
    Discount Philosopher
    specklebang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Las Vegas
    Last Seen
    06-05-14 @ 08:26 PM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    11,524

    Re: Should we eliminate taxes that tax you for the right to own property?

    I went today to get my car registered and there was a woman talking about her troubles revolving around her living arrangements with her friends. When she got up to get her car registration renewed it turned out to cost her $220 dollars. I couldn't help to think how someone can afford to spend $220 dollars when they are having trouble finding a stable place to lay their heads at night.
    • There's an old saying. "Poor people have poor ways" and it appears to be true. Many people buy better cars than they should because they only look at the payment, not the total investment.

    In fact, I see many poor people driving around in newish cars but living in houses that were built back in the 1960's and probably cost in the low hundred range. In such neighborhoods its not rare to see pretty newish cars on regular basis in fact. I would imagine that many of these people never considered that on their first year owning the car it would cost them $500 bucks to just drive the car on the street.
    • Yup. They don't think it through. If they had more of a "business head", they wouldn't be low income.


    Avenues are important and something people just carelessly forget. If I own my home or my car I should not lose it if I fail to pay the state as if they have some sort of claim to either my car or my home. If we are to believe that the state is the original owner (not saying I do but its an active argument) they would need to sell it to people for them to own and build whatever they wanted to build (which is actually another layer to the problem here since they actively control such things and once again asserting ownership of property) However, property taxes leads to you believe they never actually sold it at all and instead allowed people to simply build on their land and in turn they pay a fee for the continued use of it. When they in turn sell such property to another "user" this fee gets transfered to the new "user" as if it is simply rent and if this new "user" fails to pay such fee they are also up to losing such property as was the prior user when he used the property. This is in effect exactly how rental property works. If you fail to pay your rent you can be kicked out and lose access to the rental property. Do we as a people agree to only have the right to rent?
    • That's more of a philosophical issue than an actual issue. We all know that property tax comes with ownership. If you rent, then your landlord pays the taxes and to some degree, adds them to your rent.

    Nobody likes taxes. But that's how the world turns.





    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    The point that is actually made there is that after everything is said and done they are left with more than they paid in taxes to begin with.




    I went today to get my car registered and there was a woman talking about her troubles revolving around her living arrangements with her friends. When she got up to get her car registration renewed it turned out to cost her $220 dollars. I couldn't help to think how someone can afford to spend $220 dollars when they are having trouble finding a stable place to lay their heads at night.

    In fact, I see many poor people driving around in newish cars but living in houses that were built back in the 1960's and probably cost in the low hundred range. In such neighborhoods its not rare to see pretty newish cars on regular basis in fact. I would imagine that many of these people never considered that on their first year owning the car it would cost them $500 bucks to just drive the car on the street.



    Avenues are important and something people just carelessly forget. If I own my home or my car I should not lose it if I fail to pay the state as if they have some sort of claim to either my car or my home. If we are to believe that the state is the original owner (not saying I do but its an active argument) they would need to sell it to people for them to own and build whatever they wanted to build (which is actually another layer to the problem here since they actively control such things and once again asserting ownership of property) However, property taxes leads to you believe they never actually sold it at all and instead allowed people to simply build on their land and in turn they pay a fee for the continued use of it. When they in turn sell such property to another "user" this fee gets transfered to the new "user" as if it is simply rent and if this new "user" fails to pay such fee they are also up to losing such property as was the prior user when he used the property. This is in effect exactly how rental property works. If you fail to pay your rent you can be kicked out and lose access to the rental property. Do we as a people agree to only have the right to rent?

  10. #10
    Sage
    Mach's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Texas
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Liberal
    Posts
    11,513

    Re: Should we eliminate taxes that tax you for the right to own property?

    I thought if they opposed renters, that it's natural for them to turn around and try to turn you into a renter. Isn't that their typical mode of operation?

    Renters bad. Government collecting your taxes near-involuntarily? Greatest thing since Nutella.

Page 1 of 11 123 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •