View Poll Results: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Muhammed a Crime?

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Thread: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Muhammed a Crime? [W:636]

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    re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Muhammed a Crime? [W:636]

    Quote Originally Posted by Krhazy View Post
    Nobody is proposing surrendering free speech. This type of limitation would be no more of a surrender than defamation law or obscenity legislation. You just can't get over the idea of "appeasing muslims" -- or what rational people would refer to as dealing in a practical manner with the reality of islamic extremism. You are placing your sheer hatred for these extremists over the lives of Americans and the interest of juvenile filmmakers. And you are acting as a useful idiot by encouraging behavior which extremists can use as propaganda to recruit new members for generations to come. That, to me, is worrisome.
    They can recruit new members all they want, for as long as they want, as long as they keep their crap in their own part of the world. As for the lives of Americans, we shouldn't be in that ****hole in the first place, as far as I am concerned. If they want to make war and kill each other, because they can't figure out how to co-exist peacefully with each other, I don't really care. I refuse to bow to the coercion of extremist babies who can't handle someone hurting their feelings. They need to grow up and get a clue that not everyone agrees with them, or fears their God.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
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    re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Muhammed a Crime? [W:636]

    Quote Originally Posted by Krhazy View Post
    But it's not for the benefit of terrorist foreigners, its for the benefit of our soldiers and diplomats, and US tourists traveling overseas.

    The insulting hackery of this thread is the "appeasing muslims" strawman argument. Nobody on the left has any desire to appease muslims, only to safeguard American lives and American interests abroad.
    I don't see much of a difference between banning free speech and blaming free speech but I also just don't see how censorship would be much of a solution for the violence emanating from people willing to use airplanes as weapons or bomb a high school because they disagree with a movie, cartoon, op-ed, etc.

    Lines have to be drawn and what is "critical" or "disparaging" is awfully subjective. It's not exactly uncommon for an Islamist group to kidnap a journalist then televise his execution in Allah's name. I don't know if you would consider denouncing that critical or disparaging but it's not exactly unreasonable to believe those nutjobs who kidnapped someone then executed him on television would be angry about that denunciation. So do we cheer for the executed journalist just so the executioners aren't offended enough to bomb an embassy?

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    Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

    Quote Originally Posted by RadicalModerate View Post
    You do realize Piss Christ was about the lack of respect for Christ, right?
    Doesn't excuse it. You don't show lack of respect by committing a blasphemy yourself, this was an artist placing his message above others beliefs. However it is protected.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

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    Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

    Quote Originally Posted by RadicalModerate View Post
    Exactly. Freedom of speech is really the closet thing to an "all or nothing" issue that we have. Censorship and the punishment of unpopular ideas is like a slowly rising ooze that needs constant vigilance to keep under control. Thank god for the ACLU, huh??

    People in this country do NOT have a right to NOT be offended.
    The ACLU is a little too selective of who they decide to back, but otherwise I agree with you that speech is incredibly important to protect.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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    re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Muhammed a Crime? [W:636]

    Quote Originally Posted by Krhazy View Post
    Nobody is proposing surrendering free speech. This type of limitation would be no more of a surrender than defamation law or obscenity legislation. You just can't get over the idea of "appeasing muslims" -- or what rational people would refer to as dealing in a practical manner with the reality of islamic extremism. You are placing your sheer hatred for these extremists and the interest of juvenile filmmakers over the lives of Americans. And you are acting as a useful idiot by encouraging behavior which extremists can use as propaganda to recruit new members for generations to come. That, to me, is worrisome.
    Yes, by all means, we should sacrifice a principle to expediency and thereby establish a new principle.

    Here we have a stupid movie made about a warlord who has been dead for over a thousand years. Are you advocating that films should not be allowd that mock other warlords? Of course not. This warlord cobbled together a religio-political ideology to help consolidate his power and further his conquests. Do you advocate censorship of that which mocks any other religion or political ideology? Of course not.

    Son, just because you are hypocritical and incapable of anything approaching reason, that is no reason why we should sacrifice our freedom of speech. What is truly worrying is that you are so uneducated that you would so easily do the bidding of those who wish to change our culture to be more like theirs.
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

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    Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

    Quote Originally Posted by Donahue View Post
    ?

    I haven't seen the film nor do I have any real desire to but I feel like liberals
    It's not a liberal thing, Donahue, merely a stupid and hypocritical thing. The very notion of freedom of speech is due to liberal idiology -- an ideology towards which many stupid leftist kids may have little actual connection thes days, but there is nothing inherently contradictory between being a liberal and respecting freedom of speech.
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

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    Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gardener View Post
    It's not a liberal thing, Donahue, merely a stupid and hypocritical thing. The very notion of freedom of speech is due to liberal idiology -- an ideology towards which many stupid leftist kids may have little actual connection thes days, but there is nothing inherently contradictory between being a liberal and respecting freedom of speech.
    You cut off the operative half of my quote.

    What I was saying, in regard to liberals, was that I feel they and the media are treating this very differently than if Christians killed people over something negative about Christianity. I think the fact that we're actually talking about a movie driving these people to storm embassies over the world and kill several people mind boggling. Would we be talking about hypothetically banning homosexuality in public if Christians stormed the set of Modern Family and killed the actors?

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    Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

    Quote Originally Posted by Donahue View Post
    You cut off the operative half of my quote.

    What I was saying, in regard to liberals, was that I feel they and the media are treating this very differently than if Christians killed people over something negative about Christianity. I think the fact that we're actually talking about a movie driving these people to storm embassies over the world and kill several people mind boggling. Would we be talking about hypothetically banning homosexuality in public if Christians stormed the set of Modern Family and killed the actors?
    What is even more mind boggling is how stupid people are blaming the film, yet the majority of those rampaging like they are doing have never seen it.

    Yes, these unthinking people are treating it very differently than they do anything associated with Christianity, They do so because they are dogmatic, stupid and hypocritical. What I am saying here is that these people are not treating it this way because they are liberal -- in fact, they are treating it this way because they AREN'T liberal. They are merely useful idiot leftists.

    Just as conservatives are certainly not exemplified by the Fred Phelps gang or David Duke, not all liberals are not all represented by reactive idiots sympathetic to anything Islamist. These are only the extremes of either here, so you need to distinguish between the two and develop a more accurate language for describing people.
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

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    re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Muhammed a Crime? [W:636]

    Quote Originally Posted by Krhazy View Post
    But it's not for the benefit of terrorist foreigners, its for the benefit of our soldiers and diplomats, and US tourists traveling overseas.

    The insulting hackery of this thread is the "appeasing muslims" strawman argument. Nobody on the left has any desire to appease muslims, only to safeguard American lives and American interests abroad.
    Then don't send people to places that hate Americans. It is really that simple.

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    Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

    Quote Originally Posted by RadicalModerate View Post
    Clearly, this movie was meant to stir up more dirt between Muslims and Jews. If any piece of "art" was created to incite hate and possibly violence, it's the "Innocence of Muslims". So again, should this guy be punished?
    Not only no. But hell no. If were reversed and muslims said this about whatever this dude is I would hell no too. Speacking ones opinion should not be punishable by law or the government.
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