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Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Muhammed a Crime? [W:636]

Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Muhammed a Crime?


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You have obviously been unable to understand what I have written. Don't feel bad, it's very complicated stuff, I understand why it might go over a person's head.

Meanwhile, I take you silence on the matter of TV censorship as tacit admission for your unlibertarian support of it.

And I ask again: WHAT censorship?

 
I know you're mad because I called you out on your anti-Islamic remarks. But show a little class upstairs please, out of respect for the forum if not for me.

But I'm overflowing with panache tonight, Guy!

I've already called you out on your pro-Islamist nonsense, and so now I can relax a wee bit.
 
I think I have been pretty clear that I support some authoritarian measures to the extent that they correct an imbalance or injustice. This does not pertain this thread, however, and is more about things like affirmative action to make up for Jim Crow.

Unless you're an anarchist, everybody is an authoritarian to some extent, even libertarians. The real question is, how intellectually honest is a person?

Is it "intellectually honest" to make up your own facts?
 
Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

I'm torn on this issue.

On the one hand, free speech should be protected at all costs.

However, when one's free speech is directly responsible for violence towards innocent people all over the world I do wonder if some responsibility for that rests with the "speaker"?

Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.

A joke about a bomb on an airplane?
Making a verbal threat towards the president?
Libel and slander?
Conspiracy?

Aren't those non-violent actions that result in criminal charges where one could easily argue freedom of speech?

The d!ckwad that wrote and produced that stupid trash movie knew exactly what the outcome might be.
We all know what might happen if we do the same thing.

Now multiple people, who had nothing to do with the movie or the sentiment behind it, are dead.


Why can't the people who made that movie be held accountable?

Does my right to free speech supersede your right to live?

The flip side of that is: If you know something is offensive - just ignore it and/or don't volunteer to witness it.

Salman Rushdie should be able to write any book he chooses to write. People have the right not to buy it and not to read it. They can ignore it.

I think intent and context go a long way in these kinds of issues.

Was the movie simply hate speech designed to incite violence? If so, I see no reason that somebody should not be held responsible for their consequences.

I can easily go back and forth on this.
When it comes right down to it, you have the heart of a tyrant.
 
And I ask again: WHAT censorship?



I just hope you aren't smoking tonight, Pinkie, cause one little ember and that straw man of his would go "whoosh".
 
Pinkie, you know paper publishers/hate group leaders have been successfully prosecuted for more than the hate speech.

Yes, but those prosecutions were based on criminal acts. So, for example, in the "Solider of Fortune" case, a magazine allowed personal ads to run, offering hit man services. A hit man was in fact hired through the ad, and the magazine's owner's was prosecuted and convicted for conspiracy.

Or, in the Palladin Press case, a publisher of self-help books published a "How To Get Away With Murder" manual. A purchaser of that book followed the instructions and a murder took place. The publisher, facing conspiracy charges, withdrew the book from circulation as part of a plea agreement -- even though many 1st Amendment pundits thought he would win.

 
Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

Isn't it possible in the USofA to be charged with a crime for conspiring to kill the president?
Without ever leaving your bedroom, can't you be charged with a crime for simply blogging about such a thing?

No shots fired, never being closer than 1000 miles away, but just discussing over the phone, or through the internet can't you be charged with a crime?
I think that is only true if you are nominally a Republican speaking out against a Democrat. The converse is not likely to be investigated or prosecuted.

Is it helpful to talk about killing a president? Generally it is not.

But we can vote. If elections are stolen...then all bets are off.
 
I just hope you aren't smoking tonight, Pinkie, cause one little ember and that straw man of his would go "whoosh".

I'm just wondering where Guy's getting all these allegations he's making, because they sure seem baseless to me.
 
Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

He DID translate it into Arabic. What did he think was going to happen? They'd all become Christians?

This thread shows the inability of the right to get past simplistic jingoism. Did anybody think this wouldn't happen? The simmering rage of Islam that you all are telling us about...well, he poured gasoline on it...Hello?
I think every one of us should mock Islam every day. We should destroy their holy places and show the islamists that their god is a farce. But I have no strong opinion on this.
 
Yes, but those prosecutions were based on criminal acts.

For example, a neo-nazi leader and publisher convicted of murder, iirc.
 
Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

I think that is only true if you are nominally a Republican speaking out against a Democrat. The converse is not likely to be investigated or prosecuted.

Is it helpful to talk about killing a president? Generally it is not.

But we can vote. If elections are stolen...then all bets are off.

This was such a nuisance post. I really don't care if you are still nursing a grudge over Bush beating Gore. IMO, this is completely and totally unacceptable.

There is nothing civil about assasination jokes.
 
I'm just wondering where Guy's getting all these allegations he's making, because they sure seem baseless to me.

I think he's talking about FCC regs, Pinkie. Basically saying that if you truly believe in free speech, you'll oppose any and all imposed standards of...ah...decency on network TV (that about right, Guy?).
 
I think he's talking about FCC regs, Pinkie. Basically saying that if you truly believe in free speech, you'll oppose any and all imposed standards of...ah...decency on network TV (that about right, Guy?).

Precisely. That's a very big part of censorship going on today that needs to be addressed.
 
Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

Of course it should. There are 4 people dead because the government lacks the balls to detain a person that deliberately inflames others to violence.
If there is a god, he must love those with the heart of a tyrant. Why else would he have created so many of them?
 
I think he's talking about FCC regs, Pinkie. Basically saying that if you truly believe in free speech, you'll oppose any and all imposed standards of...ah...decency on network TV (that about right, Guy?).

Well, the FCC does regulate broadcasters, but if they did not, the system would break down. A channel has to be assigned, frequencies partioned out, etc.

At one time, the FCC DID censor the content of tv. But to my (admittedly limited) knowledge, that has not been true in at least a decade.
 
Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

This was such a nuisance post. I really don't care if you are still nursing a grudge over Bush beating Gore. IMO, this is completely and totally unacceptable.

There is nothing civil about assasination jokes.
So, in your opinion should people who write a book about killing Bush be prosecuted? Were they? Or is this goofy law more about stifling political speech concerning democrats?
 
Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

If there is a god, he must love those with the heart of a tyrant. Why else would he have created so many of them?

This is also a nuisance post. Do you have a POV on the OP, sir?
 
Is this a real murder, eco? Or a hypothetical?

I don't recall the case name. But I believe there has been conviction of 3rd party, iirc.
 
Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

So, in your opinion should people who write a book about killing Bush be prosecuted? Were they? Or is this goofy law more about stifling political speech concerning democrats?

This is not my day to play Supreme Court Justice, and I do it as a volunteer only for people who ask respectfully. I do not care to research this arcania for you.
 
Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

I'm not a prude. I go to nude beaches with my girlfriends. I'm ok with polygamy (both ways) and I get plenty. I'm also ok with regulating a public good in a manner that is best for the public, that being a public and fair manner.

I don't see the harm being done by nudity or profanity so I can't say I see restricting it as a the best for the public.

There is no need for nudity or profanity on the very few public airwave stations, and keeping those stations family-friendly is the will of the people.

I don't understand why there needs to be a need and it really has nothing to do with the will of the people but the rights of people. If people don't like the programming they can very easily not tune in.
 
I don't recall the case name. But I believe there has been conviction of 3rd party, iirc.

Well, conspiracy to murder is a big hammer, eco. Once a death occurs, the cops and/or the FBI can roll up a whole lot of people, and I imagine more'n one of this fringe groups has been broken that way.

Do you remember any of the facts? How did they kill the victim?
 
Re: Should The US Make Speech That's Critical or Disparaging of Mohammed a Crime?

I'm not a prude. I go to nude beaches with my girlfriends. I'm ok with polygamy (both ways) and I get plenty. I'm also ok with regulating a public good in a manner that is best for the public, that being a public and fair manner.

There is no need for nudity or profanity on the very few public airwave stations, and keeping those stations family-friendly is the will of the people.

Well, I am a prude, and I don't think anybody has the right to impose their prudery on others, whether they themselves are prudes or not.
 
Well, conspiracy to murder is a big hammer, eco. Once a death occurs, the cops and/or the FBI can roll up a whole lot of people, and I imagine more'n one of this fringe groups has been broken that way.

Do you remember any of the facts? How did they kill the victim?

Neo-nazi gang (2 males and a female?) attacked someone/people in the street (pipes/knives?) and the material found in their possession (home) lead to a conviction of the publisher/leader, due to the direct and real of the publishings.
 
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