View Poll Results: Do you believe cyber warfare is analogous to conventional warfare?

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Thread: Is cyber warfare analogous to conventional warfare?

  1. #11
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    Re: Is cyber warfare analogous to conventional warfare?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    Within 50 years the U.S. military will have a Cyber Force as a separate branch of the military that will be tasked with safeguarding American internet infrastructure and developing methods of performing cyber attacks against enemies nations.
    CyberCom is a Joint Command staffed by all the branches; but it's own branch? I find it more likely that some of our current entities already oriented in that direction will swell with the increased mission.

    When you are targeting an enemy system, first you determine the effect desired (example: disrupt enemy C2 for 48 hours), and then you do the target system analysis (oh look, there is a central node that would take 48 hours to replace or fix), and then you do the weaponeering. If it is decided that the effect can be produced utilizing a virus v. a bomb; the intent and effect is the same. The only difference is the delivery vector.

  2. #12
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    Re: Is cyber warfare analogous to conventional warfare?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    CyberCom is a Joint Command staffed by all the branches; but it's own branch? I find it more likely that some of our current entities already oriented in that direction will swell with the increased mission.
    Yeah, I think it'll eventually be it's own branch. The reason why I think that is because cyber warfare will become so specialized that it will require it's own regimen of recruitment and training that will necessitate it to be separate from the entities in the other branches.

    Just like the Royal Marine Corps was originally part of the British Army until it was spun off as part of the Royal Navy, or how the air power became so important that it became it's own separate branch. That's the level of importance I think cyber warfare will get within 50 years.

    And even if the military branches keep their own component cyber warfare units, I think, at the very least, a singular branch will come about to defend internet infrastructure from cyber warfare attacks and develop doctrines and methods of doing so. That would be more of a Cyber Guard, however.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

  3. #13
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    Re: Is cyber warfare analogous to conventional warfare?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    Yeah, I think it'll eventually be it's own branch. The reason why I think that is because cyber warfare will become so specialized that it will require it's own regimen of recruitment and training that will necessitate it to be separate from the entities in the other branches.
    You are, in fact, already correct - but that does not necessitate a separate branch of active-duty military.

    Just like the Royal Marine Corps was originally part of the British Army until it was spun off as part of the Royal Navy, or how the air power became so important that it became it's own separate branch. That's the level of importance I think cyber warfare will get within 50 years.
    i think if anything you are underestimating.

    And even if the military branches keep their own component cyber warfare units, I think, at the very least, a singular branch will come about to defend internet infrastructure from cyber warfare attacks and develop doctrines and methods of doing so. That would be more of a Cyber Guard, however.
    I agree on the function, I simply disagree on where you place it.

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    Re: Is cyber warfare analogous to conventional warfare?

    I think that an attack on internet infrastructure would be considered an act of war. All military sensitive information and all programs used for high tech military are stored in the US's cyber cache. An attack on that could put the United States in a very bad situation.
    "Conservatism is the blind and fear-filled worship of dead radicals."
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    Re: Is cyber warfare analogous to conventional warfare?

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    Where did he say that?
    He signed and executive order for Stuxnet, and then bragged about it ... to show that he was tough. Though I guess he didnt openly say it, it was let leak to the new yourk times.

    Cyber Attacks on Iran — Stuxnet and Flame
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    Re: Is cyber warfare analogous to conventional warfare?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    You are, in fact, already correct - but that does not necessitate a separate branch of active-duty military.
    It doesn't yet. At the end of 50 years, I'm guessing it will.

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    i think if anything you are underestimating.
    Nope. I'm not underestimating cyberwarfare at all. If anything, 50 years is a conservative estimate. But I understand that the U.S. military is rather conservative establishment. The Royal Air Force was established as it's separate branch in 1918, right after the Great War introduced the power of aerial warfare. When Germany started rebuilding it's military during the 1930's, it developed the Luftwaffe as it's own separate branch. But it wasn't until 1947 that the U.S. Air Force was established as it's own separate branch.

    So I think that it won't be until after cyberwarfare is used in a major military conflict that a separate branch will be established.

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    I agree on the function, I simply disagree on where you place it.
    Well, I admit that I've never been in the military, so I don't know any of the nuts and bolts of what the military has in place for defense from cyberattacks and offensive uses of cyberwarfare. However, study of history is a serious hobby of mine, and I certainly see historical parallels and trends. Once methods of cyberwarfare become mainstream in military conflicts, a separate branch will be established to focus solely on cyberwarfare operations.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

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    Re: Is cyber warfare analogous to conventional warfare?

    Quote Originally Posted by Schutzengel View Post
    He signed and executive order for Stuxnet, and then bragged about it ... to show that he was tough. Though I guess he didnt openly say it, it was let leak to the new yourk times.

    Cyber Attacks on Iran — Stuxnet and Flame

    Participants in the Stuxnet program told the newspaper it significantly expanding America’s first sustained use of cyber weapons and that the attacks began during the Bush administration under the code name Olympic Games.

    Obama continued, accelerated use of Bush-era Stuxnet computer attacks on Iran | Fox News



    Point is Cyber-warfare has been around a long time. See the 1982 situation between US and USSR below:

    To illustrate the destructive capability of Stuxnet, the researchers referenced an oft-cited 1982 CIA digital attack on the Siberian pipeline that resulted in an explosion a fifth the size of the atomic bomb detonated over Hiroshima. According to the never-substantiated story, the United States discovered that Russia was stealing data on United States technology. So the CIA hatched a plot to insert a logic bomb into software that the agency knew the Russians were purchasing from a Canadian firm to operate pumps and valves on their natural gas pipeline. The equipment worked fine initially, but at a preprogrammed point, it caused valves in the pipeline to malfunction, creating a pressure buildup that exploded into a fireball so large it was captured by orbiting satellites.
    How Digital Detectives Deciphered Stuxnet, the Most Menacing Malware in History | Threat Level | Wired.com

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    Re: Is cyber warfare analogous to conventional warfare?

    Quote Originally Posted by Connery View Post
    Participants in the Stuxnet program told the newspaper it significantly expanding America’s first sustained use of cyber weapons and that the attacks began during the Bush administration under the code name Olympic Games.

    Obama continued, accelerated use of Bush-era Stuxnet computer attacks on Iran | Fox News





    Point is Cyber-warfare has been around a long time. See the 1982 situation between US and USSR below:



    How Digital Detectives Deciphered Stuxnet, the Most Menacing Malware in History | Threat Level | Wired.com
    I dont think he did anything wrong by continuing "Olympic Games" What I disagree with is the leaking of information that we did it.
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    Re: Is cyber warfare analogous to conventional warfare?

    There are entities already devoted to the pursuit of cyber warfare. these entities are not built upon the same large-base-triangle model of an active-duty branch of military, and it is not necessarily optimal that it become so. regardless, the power of bureaucratic / governing inertia suggests that it is more likely that groups that currently have this mission set will expand rather than choose to die to the benefit of a new bureaucracy. The Air Force did not spring - anew from Zeus's head like Athena, but rather grew out of the already-existent Army Air Corps.

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    Re: Is cyber warfare analogous to conventional warfare?

    Quote Originally Posted by Schutzengel View Post
    I dont think he did anything wrong by continuing "Olympic Games" What I disagree with is the leaking of information that we did it.
    I agree with your statement, however, was Obama the person who leaked the information and if he did was there a strategic reason behind it. We do not know many of the facts, indeed we are fed this information through filters and from that an argument is most likely vacuous and filled with assumptions and inaccuracies.

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