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Thread: Ayn Rand is the L. Ron Hubbard of Politics

  1. #281
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    Re: Ayn Rand is the L. Ron Hubbard of Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    I'll take a shot. Prove the creation story or the flood story ever really happened.
    Creation stories are just that, stories. And the flood actually happened, so, you're wrong about that.

    I'd rather hear from Hatuey anyway. You opinion is not particularly interesting.

  2. #282
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    Re: Ayn Rand is the L. Ron Hubbard of Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    Creation stories are just that, stories. And the flood actually happened, so, you're wrong about that.
    Then you should have no problem producing evidence that a worldwide flood actually happened. Go for it.

    I'd rather hear from Hatuey anyway. You opinion is not particularly interesting.
    Yours isn't particularly sane.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

    Blog me! YouTube me! VidMe me!

  3. #283
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    Re: Ayn Rand is the L. Ron Hubbard of Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Then you should have no problem producing evidence that a worldwide flood actually happened. Go for it.



    Yours isn't particularly sane.
    Meh, anyone who quotes sacred text as proof of any argument should really consider taking a college course. It just makes for bad argument. I'm a Muslim so why should I take your interpretation of any bible as truth? I'm a atheist, why should I take your interpretation of the bible as truth? I'm a christian, why should I take your interpretation of the bible as truth?

    Audience people!

    Edit: (This wasn't towards you Cephus!!!)
    I'm coming to see that no matter what law we regulate, be it the stand your ground act, there is never an objective morally right answer to any morale question; in fact, since there are multiple objectively right answers to every moral question that leaves us with a lot of grey area and a lot of black area (not in the racial since).
    -Jryan

  4. #284
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    Re: Ayn Rand is the L. Ron Hubbard of Politics

    There is ample evidence for a great flood. Deucalion, Noah, Atlantis, etc. Flood myth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    So that's a real bad example if you're trying to come up with Biblical historical inaccuracies.

  5. #285
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    Re: Ayn Rand is the L. Ron Hubbard of Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    There is ample evidence for a great flood. Deucalion, Noah, Atlantis, etc. Flood myth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    So that's a real bad example if you're trying to come up with Biblical historical inaccuracies.
    Wrong, just wrong... So within the past 2000 years we have had global flooding from a tidal wave (only thing that could cause such an event for a short period) when?

    (I could be wrong, just wrong. If I am, please school me)
    I'm coming to see that no matter what law we regulate, be it the stand your ground act, there is never an objective morally right answer to any morale question; in fact, since there are multiple objectively right answers to every moral question that leaves us with a lot of grey area and a lot of black area (not in the racial since).
    -Jryan

  6. #286
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    Re: Ayn Rand is the L. Ron Hubbard of Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Jryan View Post
    Wrong, just wrong... So within the past 2000 years we have had global flooding from a tidal wave (only thing that could cause such an event for a short period) when?

    (I could be wrong, just wrong. If I am, please school me)
    Sure, no problem. It was way more than 2000 years ago, for starters.

  7. #287
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    Re: Ayn Rand is the L. Ron Hubbard of Politics

    Here's a better wikipedia article:List of flood myths - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

  8. #288
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    Re: Ayn Rand is the L. Ron Hubbard of Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    Sure, no problem. It was way more than 2000 years ago, for starters.
    zzzzzz Continue please? (I'm 110% sure that your own fellow christian colleagues disagree because the earth didn't exist "way before that" because jesus hadn't created it, but continue please)
    I'm coming to see that no matter what law we regulate, be it the stand your ground act, there is never an objective morally right answer to any morale question; in fact, since there are multiple objectively right answers to every moral question that leaves us with a lot of grey area and a lot of black area (not in the racial since).
    -Jryan

  9. #289
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    Re: Ayn Rand is the L. Ron Hubbard of Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Jryan View Post
    zzzzzz Continue please? (I'm 110% sure that your own fellow christian colleagues disagree because the earth didn't exist "way before that" because jesus hadn't created it, but continue please)
    Well, look, even a Biblical literalist isn't going to say it was 2000 years ago. I mean, look at the timeline, Noah is purported to have lived about 4000 years before Christ.

    But as I said earlier, I am approaching this from a strictly philological perspective, not a religious one. Calling the Bible "historically inaccurate" is a sweeping and wholly small minded thing to say. Genesis is, of course, full of fantasy, but it is a creation epic not unlike Hesiod. It is literary, and very few of the Abrahamic religions take it literally.

    The rest of the Bible is as historically accurate as any other comparable ancient text, more some than many. Who won what battle, who begat whom, and so on, are highly accurate. One of the major apparent inaccuracies is in Exodus, since there is no corroborating evidence that the Hebrews ever lived in Egypt. But really, that is not a bad record for historicity in an ancient text. The Bible is more "historically accurate" than most comparable works (whatever that means... only a simpleton would think there was an easy definition of "historical accuracy"). Compare Suetonius, a Roman gossip-monger who is a key source of what we know about the Julio-Claudians.

    The jury is still out on the historicity of Jesus but if you pay attention to the recent scholarship then you'd know that the weight of evidence is tilting in favor of the fact that there was a historical Jesus. It does seem to strain credulity that Jesus is an entirely fabricated character. I admit, I once leaned toward the hypothesis that Jesus was a myth, because the Christ cult is certainly part of the mystery cult tradition that includes Isis, Eleusis and Mithras. It seemed likely that Jesus was made up out of thin air, just like Mithras. But the most likely explanation is that Jesus was a real Jewish hero-teacher much like the character found in the New Testament who fused Jewish teaching with Greek philosophy to create the Abrahamic-Hellenic hybrid espoused in the Bible. There probably wasn't a census around the time of His birth, and a number of other facts were probably fudged to align with certain old testament prophecies. But the broad strokes are likely true, and that is a lot to expect from ancient texts. So just like there was probably a real Trojan War, there was a probably a real Jesus.

    So, is the Bible "historically accurate?" If one is inclined to give short answers to these type of complex questions, then the short answer is "Yes."

  10. #290
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    Re: Ayn Rand is the L. Ron Hubbard of Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Jryan View Post
    Meh, anyone who quotes sacred text as proof of any argument should really consider taking a college course. It just makes for bad argument. I'm a Muslim so why should I take your interpretation of any bible as truth? I'm a atheist, why should I take your interpretation of the bible as truth? I'm a christian, why should I take your interpretation of the bible as truth?
    Because interpretation and faith mean nothing in a rational debate, only evidence, logic and critical thinking do. That's where religion fails, they have no evidence, they apply no logic and they are unable to think critically about their beliefs. They do not follow the evidence to a conclusion, they start with a conclusion and only pay attention to evidence that supports their preconceived notions.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

    Blog me! YouTube me! VidMe me!

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