View Poll Results: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firearm?

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Thread: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firearm?

  1. #191
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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
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  2. #192
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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    and just as an FYI.

    COngress is mandated by the constitution to promote firedarms training and marksmanship.
    This is now the national matches at Camp Perry OH. (20 years ago anyway)
    Of course it is now just for the military (98%) and people have never heard of it.

    I went there one year to support it.

  3. #193
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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    If anything, the language of the Second Amendment is stronger and clearer than that of the First Amendment.
    I've got a less restrictive outlook on weapons than most people in the NRA but this is bull****.
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  4. #194
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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    I don't believe folks should be required by law to undergo training (safety or marksmanship) before purchasing a firearm. That said, it's a darn good idea to opt to go for it. However, we could make law that says, if you **** up with said weapon and shoot someone and if you also opted to not complete safety courses, a depraved indifference charge is added onto the incident.

    So, instead of an accidental shooting, the charge would become depraved indifference.

  5. #195
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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    I don't believe folks should be required by law to undergo training (safety or marksmanship) before purchasing a firearm. That said, it's a darn good idea to opt to go for it. However, we could make law that says, if you **** up with said weapon and shoot someone and if you also opted to not complete safety courses, a depraved indifference charge is added onto the incident.

    So, instead of an accidental shooting, the charge would become depraved indifference.
    That is nonsense unless that same would apply to ALL "accidents", including home, workplace and motor vehicle related. I do not need a course for handgun use, although I would gladly take a test, just as I did for driving. You, and the NRA, wish to make "CCW tests" into a mandatory gold mine for the mighty "certifiers" and "trainers". How about we make that liability joint for all that take your mandated classes and get "certified" but later have an "accident"? For every dollar of fine or day in jail given to the "accident causer", your gun safety instructor/certifier gets the same sentence?
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  6. #196
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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    That is nonsense unless that same would apply to ALL "accidents", including home, workplace and motor vehicle related. I do not need a course for handgun use, although I would gladly take a test, just as I did for driving. You, and the NRA, wish to make "CCW tests" into a mandatory gold mine for the mighty "certifiers" and "trainers". How about we make that liability joint for all that take your mandated classes and get "certified" but later have an "accident"? For every dollar of fine or day in jail given to the "accident causer", your gun safety instructor/certifier gets the same sentence?
    Someone who has no license or drivers training takes a car for a joyride and kills someone accidentally may face charges of depraved indifference. What I was trying to achieve is not the creation of some certifying authority - those already exist in number (you can get a training cert from any range), but a clear message that if you go untrained you are responsible for that decision when the problems occur.

  7. #197
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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by Das Sozialist View Post
    Do you believe Americans should have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firearm? Why or why not?
    Because it's one more excuse for government to interfere with our lives. It's easy to dream up legislation and get it passed. It can be a total pain in the butt to have to live with it.
    Last edited by lunchbox; 08-13-12 at 03:03 PM.

  8. #198
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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Someone who has no license or drivers training takes a car for a joyride and kills someone accidentally may face charges of depraved indifference. What I was trying to achieve is not the creation of some certifying authority - those already exist in number (you can get a training cert from any range), but a clear message that if you go untrained you are responsible for that decision when the problems occur.
    Having a DL does not make you "not liable" for errors in your judgment, nor should having a "gun degree". I see that you are confused with what constitutes an accident vs. what constitutes criminal intent. You wish to transform carrying "uninformed" into intent to cause harm, with absolutely no evidence that it even played any part in the decision to discharge a round. Criminal intent is still something that requires proof, with or without training. You do not become presumed guilty, simply because you refuse to pay fees and tolerate infringements on your rights. Name one range that will certify me for the same price as a driver's license and I will go there, until then it is simply infringement on a constitutional right.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  9. #199
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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    It is not true that all gun owners already do some sort of training. My state, SD, is an example. We do not require a permit to buy any firearm. We do not require a permit to carry in your home or place of business. We do not require a permit to carry openly in public.

    We only require a permit to carry concealed. No class of any kind is required to obtain this permit. $10 and a simple application to the Sheriff's office will get you a permit in the mail within 2 weeks, provided you pass the background check.

    Further, we are moving away from requiring a permit at all, to carry concealed or otherwise (link). Permits will still be available so that citizens may take advantage or reciprocity laws with other states.

    We view the right to carry a firearm anywhere in public as fundamental a right as religion and speech.

    However, we also honor the concern over untrained persons carrying a lethal weapon. Our compromise, therefore, is to add basic gun safety as part of the mandatory highschool curriculum; a class taught by law local enforcement which would cover law, maintenance and basic marksmanship, to include range qualification.

    The end result would be a trained citizen lawfully enjoying their right to carry without be infringed upon by permit requirements. Both sides of the issue would get everything they want.
    I spent 2 years of my life in Ellsworth / Rapid City... SD is a lovely state from March to October... :-)
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  10. #200
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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Having a DL does not make you "not liable" for errors in your judgment, nor should having a "gun degree". I see that you are confused with what constitutes an accident vs. what constitutes criminal intent. You wish to transform carrying "uninformed" into intent to cause harm, with absolutely no evidence that it even played any part in the decision to discharge a round. Criminal intent is still something that requires proof, with or without training. You do not become presumed guilty, simply because you refuse to pay fees and tolerate infringements on your rights. Name one range that will certify me for the same price as a driver's license and I will go there, until then it is simply infringement on a constitutional right.


    Even IF it were free it would still be an infringement on your rights... period.
    History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid. - Ike

    Tea is better for you than Kool-Aid.

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