View Poll Results: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firearm?

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Thread: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firearm?

  1. #91
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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    WHY? Do you know of any cases where dozens of innocent people were slaughtered by voters without proper ID?

    I have been voting for forty years. My signature which I give when I want to vote each time matches my signature in the voter registration ID has sufficed for all that time.
    Even those under 18, convicted of a felony and non-citizens have that ability to "match their own signatures" perhaps even multiple times. I can sign many names, yet that does not give me the right to vote multiple times. I live within 1 mile of a county line and could easily vote in multiple districts under different name/address combinations if no "positive" ID was required.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Even those under 18, convicted of a felony and non-citizens have that ability to "match their own signatures" perhaps even multiple times. I can sign many names, yet that does not give me the right to vote multiple times. I live within 1 mile of a county line and could easily vote in multiple districts under different name/address combinations if no "positive" ID was required.
    I'm originally from Chicago, where a man had the right to vote as many times as he could get away with. Dead pets too!
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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    The day for asking what "should" be done to reduce gun violence has passed. The only question left is what government may do to burden the right to own guns -- and I think a marksmanship requirement and almost all other existing burdens on the right to own guns are patently unconstitutional.

    Wanna reduce gun violence? So do I. Let's discuss ways to do that that are legal. I agree with Ikari -- education is a great idea, but it's not the only option available.

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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by Das Sozialist View Post
    Do you believe Americans should have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firearm? Why or why not?
    To carry a firearm in public (non-hunting) people should have a valid security reason. e.g. transporting cash or valuables.

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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by Pinkie View Post
    Wanna reduce gun violence? So do I. Let's discuss ways to do that that are legal. I agree with Ikari -- education is a great idea, but it's not the only option available.
    What I would say is that I would like to reasonably reduce gun violence through methods which preserve the rights of the individual. Gun violence will never be zero, and I understand that point.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Even those under 18, convicted of a felony and non-citizens have that ability to "match their own signatures" perhaps even multiple times. I can sign many names, yet that does not give me the right to vote multiple times. I live within 1 mile of a county line and could easily vote in multiple districts under different name/address combinations if no "positive" ID was required.
    I understand your point - however - in real life we have precious few examples of such voter fraud. This is a solution in search of a problem.
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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    I understand your point - however - in real life we have precious few examples of such voter fraud. This is a solution in search of a problem.
    Of course you have few examples of "this kind" of voter fraud since that would REQUIRE that an ID to be presented by the voter to prove it. That is akin to denying that shoplifting exists simply because an inventory shortage is noticed, since few are actually caught red handed with products hidden inside their clothing as they leave the store. I agree that it may not be as widespread as we THINK it is, yet ALL assert that voter ID laws will affect MOSTLY demorat voters, how can that assertion be proven?
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Of course you have few examples of "this kind" of voter fraud since that would REQUIRE that an ID to be presented by the voter to prove it. That is akin to denying that shoplifting exists simply because an inventory shortage is noticed, since few are actually caught red handed with products hidden inside their clothing as they leave the store. I agree that it may not be as widespread as we THINK it is, yet ALL assert that voter ID laws will affect MOSTLY demorat voters, how can that assertion be proven?
    I believe the suggestion is that there is a large group of people who tend to vote Democratic that may be on the end of the socio-economic spectrum where the obtaining of proper ID may pose a financial burden akin to a poll tax. Another group is the elderly who may not have seen their proper papers in decades.
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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by hazlnut View Post
    To carry a firearm in public (non-hunting) people should have a valid security reason. e.g. transporting cash or valuables.
    You wish the constitution was different on this point. It's not. Care to move on?

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    Re: Should Americans have to undergo marksmanship training to be able to own a firear

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    What I would say is that I would like to reasonably reduce gun violence through methods which preserve the rights of the individual. Gun violence will never be zero, and I understand that point.
    I couldn't agree more, Ikari. It's time for the medical community and the social scientists to start urping ideas to reduce gun violence -- because asking the government to handle the problem is no longer an option.

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