View Poll Results: Do you think water boarding is torture?

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    114 77.55%
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Thread: Do you think water boarding is torture?[W:453]

  1. #461
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    Re: Do you think water boarding is torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    What DD fails to understand is our enemies don't play by the same rules we do.....I don't understand why he just does not get it when they show terrorists cutting off our soldiers heads.........
    Oh ....I get it NP.....I just don't see how that justifies us engaging in morally rehensible actions just because others do. Maybe you like bringing this countries morals and values down. I, however, believe that this nation has become the great nation that it is by being a moral beacon to the world. To me...that is something we should never ever sacrifice.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

  2. #462
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    Re: Do you think water boarding is torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by Oozlefinch View Post
    Can you prove that? No, you can't. Sorry, but I debate based upon facts and past events, not conjecture. And that is all you have.

    Imagine we got into a war with the Soviets next year. Do you believe they will generally follow the rules? I do, because they are professionals and know how the game is played. Will they worry about us following the rules? Not really, because they know that we also are professionals and follow the rules.

    However, in this case we are not fighting a professional force. Not only that, but a force that actually accepts such behaviors as what they do as "routine". So do you really think they believe waterboarding to be "torture"? If anything else, it is probably more effective because they can't understand why on earth we would even bother to keep them prisoner in the first place, since they would not do so if the tables are turned.

    I have provided sources, can you do the same for your claims?

    What would call proof?

    Retired Adm. Dennis C. Blair, President Obama's nominee to lead the U.S. intelligence community, told Congress yesterday that torture "is not moral, legal or effective" and that "there will not be any waterboarding on my watch."

    Intelligence Pick Calls Torture Immoral, Ineffective - washingtonpost.com

    Or this:

    Or listen to Army Col. Stuart Herrington, a military intelligence specialist who conducted interrogations in Vietnam, Panama and Iraq during Desert Storm, and who was sent by the Pentagon in 2003 -- long before Abu Ghraib -- to assess interrogations in Iraq. Aside from its immorality and its illegality, says Herrington, torture is simply "not a good way to get information." In his experience, nine out of 10 people can be persuaded to talk with no "stress methods" at all, let alone cruel and unusual ones. Asked whether that would be true of religiously motivated fanatics, he says that the "batting average" might be lower: "perhaps six out of ten." And if you beat up the remaining four? "They'll just tell you anything to get you to stop."

    Worse, you'll have the other side effects of torture. It "endangers our soldiers on the battlefield by encouraging reciprocity." It does "damage to our country's image" and undermines our credibility in Iraq. That, in the long run, outweighs any theoretical benefit. Herrington's confidential Pentagon report, which he won't discuss but which was leaked to The Post a month ago, goes farther. In that document, he warned that members of an elite military and CIA task force were abusing detainees in Iraq, that their activities could be "making gratuitous enemies" and that prisoner abuse "is counterproductive to the Coalition's efforts to win the cooperation of the Iraqi citizenry." Far from rescuing Americans, in other words, the use of "special methods" might help explain why the war is going so badly.

    The Torture Myth (washingtonpost.com)

    I don't say these things without having some idea what the prevaling thought on the matter is before I say them.

    And I have many sources throughout this thread.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  3. #463
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    Re: Do you think water boarding is torture?

    But remember--they're not people, they're "enemy combatants." Therefore, it's okay to torture them.

    /snark
    "A man you can bait with a tweet is not a man we can trust with nuclear weapons." --Hillary Rodham Clinton
    "Innocent until proven guilty is for criminal convictions, not elections." --Mitt Romney

  4. #464
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    Re: Do you think water boarding is torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    More than that. But, you have offer nothing that matches even reading about it.
    Other than going through it, personally knowing the people that teach it, and personally knowing people that have been POWs? Guess ya got me

  5. #465
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    Re: Do you think water boarding is torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Other than going through it, personally knowing the people that teach it, and personally knowing people that have been POWs? Guess ya got me
    Yeah, I do. If you're correct, than you should be able to present something verifable. If you can't, the odds are great that you merely think you know.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Do you think water boarding is torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Yeah, I do. If you're correct, than you should be able to present something verifable. If you can't, the odds are great that you merely think you know.
    Well, I'm not going to post a transcript of the last 23 years of my life so, you go on thinking you know better.

  7. #467
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    Re: Do you think water boarding is torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Well, I'm not going to post a transcript of the last 23 years of my life so, you go on thinking you know better.
    they always know better.
    The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.

    An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.

  8. #468
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    Re: Do you think water boarding is torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Well, I'm not going to post a transcript of the last 23 years of my life so, you go on thinking you know better.
    Funny how those who can prove no evidence alway think they know more than those who do. At the end of the day, I'm the one who produced evidence.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  9. #469
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    Re: Do you think water boarding is torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Funny how those who can prove no evidence alway think they know more than those who do. At the end of the day, I'm the one who produced evidence.
    I don't really care if I can prove it. I've lived it. And I disagree that it is "torture" as a result of my personal exp. I also disagree that it should be continued to be used, you should be happy with that.

    All you've produced is a regurgitation of someone else's opinion. Subjective X2.

  10. #470
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    Re: Do you think water boarding is torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    I don't really care if I can prove it. I've lived it. And I disagree that it is "torture" as a result of my personal exp. I also disagree that it should be continued to be used, you should be happy with that.

    All you've produced is a regurgitation of someone else's opinion. Subjective X2.
    And you can get away with that sitting in your living room. But you spoke up here. Outside of your own mind, others need actual evidence. And no, my source is far less subjective than you, with far more to base their opinion on. You just don't want to see it.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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