View Poll Results: Would you own an assault Rifle? Why?

Voters
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  • No! Only crazies own assault rifles.

    15 11.11%
  • No, they are too expensive!

    7 5.19%
  • No, no need to.

    41 30.37%
  • Yes, for self defense

    44 32.59%
  • Yes, for recreation and sport

    52 38.52%
  • Yes, to perform my patriotic duty if the nation is invaded

    43 31.85%
  • Yes, because it's my constiutional right

    45 33.33%
  • Yes, because I'm one of the CRAZIES!!! hahahahaha

    15 11.11%
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Thread: Why would you own an assault rifle?

  1. #721
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    Re: Why would you own an assault rifle?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Besides fighting each other and the police, they find them most effective at terrorizing a population where the law abiding Mexican citizen is disarmed.
    Your reasons in bold are why they were banned in this country. And despite the fact that we are the most heavily armed country on the planet our intentional gun death rates are higher than all other wealthy populous nations.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  2. #722
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    Re: Why would you own an assault rifle?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Well, yes. To be precise, I keep using the phrase "assault" rifles with quotes, because most people don't know that and use the phrase indiscriminately.

    In reality we're talking about military-STYLED rifles, semi-auto with detachable magazines, and NOT actual assault rifles.... but so many people don't know the difference that they figure "scary-looking rifle" = "assault" rifle.... meh, it gives me a headache some days but whaddaya do....
    This is directed more towards the casual reader who may not know much about firearms per-se, especially our cousins across the pond who haven't served in their military.

    To play devil's advocate for a moment, the following 'cosmetic' differences do affect the total performance of the firearm...

    Semi-Auto Action: Allows for a higher cyclic rate than a bolt/pump/breech action without the ammunition limitation of a revolver. It's true that a revolver can fire just as fast as any semi-auto, but a magazine is much faster to change then a revolver's cylinder even with a speed loader and practice. This is why the military and the FBI now issue semi-auto pistols instead of revolvers.


    Detachable Magazine: As above, allows for faster reloading, though pro-gun-control needn't worry about high capacity magazines since they are very prone to failure and are thus rarely desired by even the most zombie-apocalypse survivalist. Belt-fed systems are far superior to any high capacity mag., and belt-fed systems are beyond the common citizen's reach due to the cost and hassle of a type 3 tax stamp.


    Folding/Telescopic Stock: Helps with close-quarters combat such as clearing rooms without sacrificing a longer stock needed for proper mid/long-range accuracy. I have a folding stock (and a short barrel) on my issued M249 for this very reason.


    Pistol Grip: Helps the shooter acquire and maintain a proper sight picture (does pro-gun control even know what that is?) through the use of a more natural wrist/hand position.


    Bayonet Mount: Makes shoulder-punches (again, does pro-gun-control even know what that is?) lethal.


    Flash Suppressor: Allows the shooter to maintain night-vision. During the day, reduces chance of being detected by muzzle-flash. Helps reduce eye fatigue and maintain a proper sight picture.


    I happen to believe that all of the above listed features are right and proper for the average law-abiding citizen to posses, but our pro-gun argument is weakened when we dismiss these features as merely 'cosmetic' when they do actually serve a functional purpose.
    Last edited by Jerry; 08-02-12 at 02:43 AM.

  3. #723
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    Re: Why would you own an assault rifle?

    "Until "Fast and Furious," Americans knew "very little" about the flow of U.S. firearms to cartels, said Josiah Heyman, an anthropology professor at the University of Texas at El Paso and an expert on violence in Mexico and its relationship to U.S. policy."

    "The flow of U.S. guns south, as Mexican drugs come north, has emerged as rival cartels increasingly wage a brutal war for control of smuggling routes, analysts said.

    More than 68,000 firearms from the United States ended up in Mexico from 2007 and 2011, according to U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives statistics released in April.

    The gun owners are usually a mystery: ATF authorities have been unable to determine the purchasers of half or more of the U.S. guns found in Mexico in each of those five years, ATF statistics show.

    Mexican authorities report that drug trafficking organizations are more frequently using rifles such as the AK and AR variants with detachable magazines -- generally, assault rifles, the ATF said.

    American firearms are in high demand because Mexico's firearm laws are highly restrictive and high-powered weapons such as the AK-47-style pistol are deemed for the exclusive use of the Mexican military, U.S. prosecutors said in court documents.

    The AK-47-style pistols resemble the AK-47 assault rifle, but with shorter barrels and without a rear stock. Cartels prefer their small size, high ammo capacity and suitability for close-quarters combat, prosecutors say."

    On the border: Guns, drugs -- and a betrayal of trust - CNN.com
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  4. #724
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    Re: Why would you own an assault rifle?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Zombies -> semi-auto rifle FTW, better skull penetration that most shotgun loads.

    For those that are looking at us crosseyed and backing away slowly, we don't necessarily mean literal zombies. "Zombies" is a metaphor for "some unexpected and improbable but highly disasterous Black Swan Event."
    To agree and reiterate, the whole 'zombie-apocalypse' thing is a social meme expressing a nameless fear, to vent that fear through rational thought-experiments and humor.

    Zombie Meme | WeKnowMemes

    IMO the current popularity of the zombie-apocalypse meme is due to the lack of terrorist attacks...that we know Jihadists are actually out there, and we're subconsciously anxious about when/where/how they'll strike next. The zombie-apocalypse meme allows us to use centuries worth of films, stories, music and games as tools to vent.
    Last edited by Jerry; 08-02-12 at 03:16 AM.

  5. #725
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    Re: Why would you own an assault rifle?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    ATF authorities have been unable to determine the purchasers of half or more of the U.S. guns found in Mexico in each of those five years, ATF statistics show.
    The other half, of course, we know where they came from, because we sold it to them

  6. #726
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    Re: Why would you own an assault rifle?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    To agree and reiterate, the whole 'zombie-apocalypse' thing is a social meme expressing a nameless fear, to vent that fear through rational thought-experiments and humor.

    Zombie Meme | WeKnowMemes

    IMO the current popularity of the zombie-apocalypse meme is due to the lack of terrorist attacks...that we know Jihadists are actually out there, and we're subconsciously anxious about when/where/how they'll strike next. The zombie-apocalypse meme allows us to use centuries worth of films, stories, music and games as tools to vent.
    so sad to see that someone who usually shows such wisdom is so eager to accept the governments' lies about the reality of the solanum virus.

  7. #727
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    Re: Why would you own an assault rifle?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    most of this is somewhat true. but some is not. I'd rather have more rounds and not need them........

    I reviewed a shooting out of Kalifornia

    1) one bad guy armed with an old 32 caliber browning pistol-the one that was popular with French and other continental European police Departments

    4) LAPD or County Sheriffs. three armed with Smith and wesson 357s with 125 grain JHP-the really good stuff-the ammo Evan Marshall's studies proved was the most effective pistol stopping round on earth

    PO PO #4-870 shotgun triple ought buck


    bad guy starts firing at Cop #1-cop #1 takes a minor hit to the leg-goes down but takes a kneeling position and fires all 6 shots at the mope-at least 4 are solid chest hits.

    bad guy reloads and engages cop #2-hits the cop twice in the chest-body armor stops the weak 32 but the third round clips the deputy in the shoulder-that cop fires simultaneously-at least two center of mass hits. Cop #1 has speed loaders he cranks a few more rounds at the mope-hits him 3-4 times

    Mope reloads and starts moving at an angle towards the guy with the leg wound. cop #3 in a flanking position blasts the mope with two rounds of buck shot-the coroner couldn't figure out how many hit but it was a lot

    cop #4 breaks the mope's pelvis figuring (wrongly) the mope is wearing body armor. mope reloads and gets off 6 rounds at that cop

    that cop shoots him three more times-the mope drops his now empty gun and says

    I give up, I've had enough

    he dies en route to the hospital

    he took over a DOZEN lethal hits from really good shots using really heavy stuff

    he got off over 18 rounds
    Was the dude high or did he just have a superhuman pain threshold? My buddy has a cuz who is an LEO in Florida, they had a guy hopped up on PCP causing a domestic disturbance. They tried to subdue him with batons, broke his nose and ribs, that didn't work he got in and took two cops out of the fight so they tased him, that didn't work so they had to shoot. I think it was something like 40 hot load .357 rounds into the bad guy's chest alone. He wasn't the only casualty but fortunately the only fatality.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

  8. #728
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    Re: Why would you own an assault rifle?

    Quote Originally Posted by MadLib View Post
    The gun control issue is one of the more complicated issues. With something like SSM or even tax issues you can pretty quickly come up with an opinion even if you are not well educated on the matter. Gun issues are a bit more complicated. Gun experts and LEO in general seem to be more gun-rights so that's where I lean. My POV is that rather than restricting what types of guns people can have we should restrict what kinds of people can have guns.

    People who DEFINITELY should have limited or no access to firearms:
    Good news for you, as I'll address further, most of what you want is already law to and extent. Though that can be refined a bit. I'll explain.

    1. Convicted violent felons, or at the very least felons convicted of an aggravated violent felony
    Anyone with a felony conviction or dishonorable discharge is already disbarred legally from owning a weapon. To refine that I would rather that the felonies be only those that are violent or have violence as a component(black market felonies) and I would remove dishonorable discharge, they are both catchalls that overgeneralize the removal of rights. If they were shortened in scope to eliminate non-violent offenses and had a period certain opportunity for the restitution of rights for good behavior it would be perfect law.

    2. The mentally insane. Of course it depends on the disorder, someone with a Cluster B personality disorder (this includes psychopathy, which is the primary reason I chose Cluster B: psychopaths should have NO access to firearms as they are incapable of responsible or non-criminal use of weapons); it also includes borderline personality disorder (excessively emotional), histrionic personality disorder (excessive pathological attention-seeking), and narcissistic (arrogance with a touch of total lack of empathy)). Paranoid schizophrenics should have LIMITED access to guns because although unlike Cluster B they are not inclined towards violence, they cannot differentiate between reality and imagination and may hallucinate a burglar and end up shooting their neighbor. While registering to get a gun (something I believe could be necessary)* people should be given a psychological exam to see if they are mentally fit to own a gun.
    Anyone involuntarily committed to an institution of mental health is disqualified from owning a gun, I like your idea of only limiting mental disorders to those of violence or potential psychotic breaks, makes more sense than someone within the fully functioning autism spectrum being disbarred "just because". I think upon conditions of medicating the problem within control some people could have their rights restored. But I am not willing to go as far as mandatory testing for everyone who wants a gun, it's a little too far on the prior restraint side for my tastes. Rights do have some responsibilities and risks.

    People who reasonably could have access to firearms restricted:

    1. People with ties to organized crime groups like Mexican drug cartels or Mafia

    2. Non-citizens. Illegals should be given no access to weaponry.
    No argument to your first group.........but you have to prove it, street gangs would be the most preferable group, they are the most random in application of violence. You have to go out of your way to be on a Mafia hit list, and cartels are a combination of being in the wrong place at the wrong time OR being in their way. Street gangs will shoot at the wrong address and call it a write off.
    If I were to restrict weapons I would say off-the-bat no WMDs (nukes, bio weapons, chem weapons), no explosives. If I had to restrict any firearm in particular it would be a sniper rifle. Reason being is that's past the reasonable point for self-defense - a 14.5×114mm cartrige could be fired over a mile away. I don't think people should be given access to guns like that in the highly improbable case of a revolution against the government. At that point the law is void anyway.
    Okay, no problem with restricting WMDs, they are indifferent weapons, area effective, and you don't aim them as much as disperse them. Explosives have a purpose, and a semi-safe handling, they shouldn't be outright legal but permittable, I have no problem with an advance license requirement for ownership and detonation. "Sniper" rifles are really just long guns, there is nothing about them that makes them deadlier than a hunting rifle, most large bore hunting rifles are accurate from +705yds to a little over a mile, with the longest shot ever placed on target at about 2mi. by a Canadian sniper using a Barrett .50cal. but just about any long barreled hunting rifle will shoot up to about a mile and on target if you know how to adjust for windage and loss of velocity.

    *I understand that criminals could find ways to get arms without registering, which makes me a bit iffy on registration. I think registration should be simple: a psychology test, background check, etc. It should be ABSOLUTELY FREE to register although a minor tax on automatics might be a little useful. Since registering would be free it would be a FELONY to get unregistered weapons in the United States of MadLib.
    Criminal background check, IF there is a further question by civilians(such as the gun range owner in Colorado) who notice behaviors that are a little off allow for them to sign a sworn affadavit, legally binding, that allows for further questioning/testing.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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    Re: Why would you own an assault rifle?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Yes, they are illegal in Mexico so they get them from the US where they are legal and they can buy them through our inadequate gun control laws here.




    They have been getting them from the US since our ban here ended, that is why a sting operation was undertaken.
    Dude, more of those cartel guns are untraceable. Most probably Venezuelan, Columbian, and other S.American surplus. The traceable stuff comes from the U.S. and that's a matter of a closer border, but if you want to stick with the Fast and Furious talking points be my guest.
    Last edited by LaMidRighter; 08-02-12 at 01:20 PM.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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    Re: Why would you own an assault rifle?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Zombies -> semi-auto rifle FTW, better skull penetration that most shotgun loads.

    For those that are looking at us crosseyed and backing away slowly, we don't necessarily mean literal zombies. "Zombies" is a metaphor for "some unexpected and improbable but highly disasterous Black Swan Event."
    Damn it man.

    Did you really have to go an explain it? I actually preferred it when people looked at me funny and backed away.
    “Tyranny is defined as that which is legal for the government but illegal for the citizenry.”
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