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America's greatest sin [W:264]

What is America's greatest sin?

  • The war for independence

    Votes: 1 1.2%
  • Slavery

    Votes: 27 31.4%
  • Indians / native Americans

    Votes: 31 36.0%
  • Hiroshima, Nagasaki bombing

    Votes: 3 3.5%
  • The war in Vietnam

    Votes: 1 1.2%
  • The FED

    Votes: 6 7.0%
  • The Cold war

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • The Civil war

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Other

    Votes: 14 16.3%
  • I can't tell

    Votes: 3 3.5%

  • Total voters
    86
Y'see Tigger, we're not that far apart. Those are exactly the tactics I think should be applied to bringing down capitalism. :thumbs:

Here's the difference......

When something horrific happens in a Capitalist society, they don't turn to France or England to fix the problem. However, when a Tsunami hits Japan or Mexico City falls down in an earthquake, they expect the US to be there 20 minutes later to fix the problem. Part of the problem is that we don't send these countries the bill afterwards. Just like we released all the nations of their debt for rebuilding after WWII.
 
Here's the difference......

When something horrific happens in a Capitalist society, they don't turn to France or England to fix the problem. However, when a Tsunami hits Japan or Mexico City falls down in an earthquake, they expect the US to be there 20 minutes later to fix the problem. Part of the problem is that we don't send these countries the bill afterwards. Just like we released all the nations of their debt for rebuilding after WWII.

but yet it took the UK 40 years to pay back her war debt to the US....
 
but yet it took the UK 40 years to pay back her war debt to the US....


There's a long history of the US and UK being closely allied, politically, militarily and culturally. Lots of countries without such close ties feel much less obligated to try to pay their debts.
 
but yet it took the UK 40 years to pay back her war debt to the US....

Plus Japan actually declined a lot of help, and in 2009, when Brazil was rocked by massive landslides, they didn't ask for or accept any aid.

Despite what we like to think, the world wouldn't fall apart if the US wasn't here.
 
Thoughts anyone? :)

This is one of those, "who's more evil, Jeffrey Dahmer or Ted Bundy?" questions.

In the end, they're both pretty damn evil, but in different ways.
 
Course the problem with over simplistic 'Universals' is no one society has a homogeneous moral code. There would be no way to say all of a certain group adhere to the same system, can't in anyway you slice a society. Look how difficult it would be to get a Universal Christian code and how quickly it fell into sects, quite often at each others throats.

The loss of 'rugged individualism' is just one downside to any one size fits all on the planet. Conform or be worn down. Accept or be isolated. My way or the Gulag. Sounds like genocide on a never before attempted scale.

I'll wager a shiny nickle if some Universal Moral Code was enforced around the world it wouldn't last a New York minute.

And I just have to ask, what if the very guy who so loves this sophomoric New World Order discovers the Code adopted for world implementation is very much like the one he claims to be fleeing from? Where to go? To one of the isolation zones? To the wear them down zone- is that like 'Arbeit macht frei'?

Sounds like an unworkable way to try and kill off a few million people because they don't agree with some vague code some one thinks everyone else will gladly accept.

I can almost see the smug look turn to confusion once 'the one' realizes a vote was taken and his way will be the highway! :mrgreen:
 
Dope.
This country imports a ton a day.
The cartel love us.
 
I can almost see the smug look turn to confusion once 'the one' realizes a vote was taken and his way will be the highway! :mrgreen:

That's what I have that shiny .45ACP with my initials engraved in the case sitting on my dresser for.
 
That's what I have that shiny .45ACP with my initials engraved in the case sitting on my dresser for.


If might makes right, the majority tends to have more "might" on its side.

One of the things I love about our Constitution is that the Founders tried hard to keep the majority from tyrannizing the minority.
 
If might makes right, the majority tends to have more "might" on its side.

True, but the majority also tends to have most of the people who are unwilling to pull the trigger on another human being which tends to even things out a little. Besides that one round isn't for anyone other than ME.

One of the things I love about our Constitution is that the Founders tried hard to keep the majority from tyrannizing the minority.

One of the things I don't terribly care for in the document.
 
One of the things I don't terribly care for in the document.



Tigger, my dear friend, you are most definitely one of those minorities whose views are thus protected.... if ours was a dictatorship of the majority view that did not tolerate dissent of any kind, you'd probably be clapped in irons in some dank dungeon, or else burnt at the stake. One would think you might appreciate that it is not so.
 
For me Americas greatest sin is the invention of fast food, this started a chain reaction in the worlds food industry in which saw the West move away from local organic produce and begin to use factories to produce our meats, milk, eggs etc. Not saying America is the only country to blame but she def got the ball moving and lead the way.
 
Tigger, my dear friend, you are most definitely one of those minorities whose views are thus protected.... if ours was a dictatorship of the majority view that did not tolerate dissent of any kind, you'd probably be clapped in irons in some dank dungeon, or else burnt at the stake. One would think you might appreciate that it is not so.

We are not friends sir, dear or otherwise.

If this was a dictatorship of people like you I'd rather be dead, thank you very much.
 
Why doesn't it surprise me that you devalue ideals such as Nationalism, Exceptionalism, and Greed? Believe it or not, there is more to life than sunshine and lollipops. Not everyone gets a trophy in the real world. You have to break a couple eggs to make an omelette. Your ideal of peace and happiness is totally unrealistic on any signifiant level.
Yup, when you break some eggs in your effort to make an omelet you clean up and toss out the mess and start over with some new eggs. Right? It’s just that some of us see a value in the broken eggs. But, golly, the effort in dealing with the broken eggs isn’t worth it to you is it?
 
Yup, when you break some eggs in your effort to make an omelet you clean up and toss out the mess and start over with some new eggs. Right? It’s just that some of us see a value in the broken eggs. But, golly, the effort in dealing with the broken eggs isn’t worth it to you is it?

You're right.... In a lot of cases it's not worth the effort to deal with the broken eggs. Probably won't be tomorrow or the next day either.
 
Yup, when you break some eggs in your effort to make an omelet you clean up and toss out the mess and start over with some new eggs. Right? It’s just that some of us see a value in the broken eggs. But, golly, the effort in dealing with the broken eggs isn’t worth it to you is it?

but you have to break eggs in order to make an omelet
 
Course if more 'conservatives' are like Tigger then the Liberals won't have to be willing to shoot their fellow humans to enforce some New World Order. Those 'patriots' will shoot themselves! It is like raising fainting goats... :lol:

One of my wife's favorite movies is "Office Space" where some mumbling little worm of a guy is degraded further and further all the while mutter dark little threats. It is difficult for me to understand someone who talks such a stark game of hardline choices all the while claiming to be already heading out the door (hope the new country lets you keep that shiny pistol) or ready to suck a bullet out of that shiny 45 if their own scenario turns on them.

Talk of a One World Order with vast isolation areas for a slow 'wear them down' final solution all the while suicide as the answer if it all goes wrong.

It is as if "Mien Kampf's" sequel is "Dummkopf"
 
For me Americas greatest sin is the invention of fast food, this started a chain reaction in the worlds food industry in which saw the West move away from local organic produce and begin to use factories to produce our meats, milk, eggs etc. Not saying America is the only country to blame but she def got the ball moving and lead the way.

I didn't think about that one. I would have definitely tucked that in had I thought about it on time. :)
 
This thread is ridiculous!

"America's greatest sin" -- what a joke!

None of those items on that list are a "sin". How naive can a person be?!

[skip]

Naive as American, I hope. :) Wow, that was one hell of a rant.
May the gentleman suggest more appropriate term to substitute "sin"?
 
Greed.

There are only seven deadly sins and America is greedy. We want more than me need.
 
I would say the writing of the Constitution was America's original greatest sin. It put a collective bunch of slave owners, womanizers, genocidal murderers, drunks and religious zealots on a pedestal where they'd be forever worshiped. You can't make that kind of stuff up folks.
 
I picked the way we treated our Native Americans. We gave up slavery long before we stopped mistreating the "Indians." Some tribes were exterminated; the buffalo were nearly exterminated to deliberately cut off the main food source for plains tribes. Treaties were broken. The Cherokees were rounded up and herded through several states in the dead of winter (Trail of Tears). The Nez Perce (of Oregon/Idaho) ran for Canada and were pursued by the US Calvary for many months. Most of the tribe surrendered in Montana, 40 miles from the Canadian border. They were placed in Indian Territory (now Oklahoma). All but a few of their famous Appaloosa horses were destroyed at that time. For years Indian children were taken away from their families and tribes (in attempts to civilize the heathens) and placed in government schools (where any parts of their tribal culture and language were discouraged). Countless misdeeds and persecution of tribes continued for many years. There are still a few Indian schools open today, although tribal cultural aspects are now encouraged.
 
In terms of this Universal Morality debate... the person who's advocating them wants to 'break a few eggs'... Isn't that ironic?

That point is interesting though. I do believe that, ultimately, all humans will agree on a very basic moral code. That is democracy, free press, etc, and the UN Convention on Human Rights (no genocide, political prisoners, etc). Pretty much every rich-world country currently follows that, even if they differ in other respects (eg Japan, South Korea...), and I believe the others will follow.
 
Here's the difference......

When something horrific happens in a Capitalist society, they don't turn to France or England to fix the problem. However, when a Tsunami hits Japan or Mexico City falls down in an earthquake, they expect the US to be there 20 minutes later to fix the problem. Part of the problem is that we don't send these countries the bill afterwards. Just like we released all the nations of their debt for rebuilding after WWII.

Two points:

1. Everyone turns up to help, it's just your media gives you the impression that only the US are there. A bit like Hollywood trotting out the old myth that the US won WWII virtually single-handed. As a good example, EU-sourced aid to Haiti amounted to a lot more than US aid did. Something like $400m to $220m.

2. Where do you get the idea that the US released nations from their post-WWII debts? Post-war reconstruction loans were repaid in full, with interest. Marshall Plan grants were just that, grants, not loans and let's not forget that all goods purchased with US money had to be from US suppliers, so equally benefitting US interests.
 
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