View Poll Results: Is Venezuela's Chavez a threat to American National Security?

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Thread: Is Venezuela's Chavez a threat to American National Security?

  1. #111
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    Re: Is Venezuela's Chavez a threat to American National Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    The USA is the greatest supporter of terror networks. Our work in Iraq is terrorism. Terrorism in Latin America, South America, Iran, Syria, Libya,Venezuela, etc. Sometimes when one's head is stuck in the sand, it is hard to find reality, easy to find sand, I guess. Or not, eh?
    Indeed. FARC in fact arose in opposition to US-backed and US-funded military attacks against suspected leftist peasants in Colombia. And people wonder why we are so hated in so many places.

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    Re: Is Venezuela's Chavez a threat to American National Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal Fang View Post
    Then the number of Americans killed in World War II was not significant either.
    The significance of people dying compared to people getting foreign money to pay for heating fuel is no where near related.


    Fail. The program has been in existence for seven years. Your link is to ONE of many local distributors having participated in the program over the years. Didn't know? Didn't care? Doesn't matter. You're pushing a fraud.
    It doesnt matter how long that foreign money has been influencing Americans. What matters is that the Hugo Chavez is not giving fuel oil out of the kindness of his heart, it is a political tool and the form of bribes to try to fix his bad image and to be able to use it as propaganda against the US.

  3. #113
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    Re: Is Venezuela's Chavez a threat to American National Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    The significance of people dying compared to people getting foreign money to pay for heating fuel is no where near related.
    The question is over how big a group of people has to be before it becomes significant You've opined that 400,000 low-income American households isn't nearly enough. Now it seems you want to eat those words.

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    It doesnt matter how long that foreign money has been influencing Americans. What matters is that the Hugo Chavez is not giving fuel oil out of the kindness of his heart, it is a political tool and the form of bribes to try to fix his bad image and to be able to use it as propaganda against the US.
    It matters because you claimed that these were once-in-a-lifetime deliveries of just 100 gallons. You unfortunately based those claims on information for one year from a single participating local distributor. You stand corrected yet again.

  4. #114
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    Re: Is Venezuela's Chavez a threat to American National Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal Fang View Post
    The question is over how big a group of people has to be before it becomes significant You've opined that 400,000 low-income American households isn't nearly enough. Now it seems you want to eat those words.
    Ok the nationally owned oil company has been using their wealth to influence Americans and a lot of them at that. Meanwhile Venezuelan citizens are not being helped because Venezuela is not really so rich that they can pay for both.


    It matters because you claimed that these were once-in-a-lifetime deliveries of just 100 gallons. You unfortunately based those claims on information for one year from a single participating local distributor. You stand corrected yet again.
    In its Seventh Year, CITGO-Venezuela Heating Oil Program Helps 400,000 Needy Americans « Embassy of the Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela in the U.S. CITGO, based in Houston, is a refiner, transporter and marketer of transportation fuels, lubricants, petrochemicals and other industrial products. The company is owned by PDV America, Inc., an indirect wholly owned subsidiary of Petróleos de Venezuela, S.A., the national oil company of the Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela. For more information visit Home page

    Beginning in 1979 with oil-trading ventures in Latin America and Africa, Citizens Energy has used revenues from commercial enterprises to channel millions of dollars into charitable programs in the U.S. and abroad. Whether heating the homes of the elderly and the poor, lowering the cost of prescription drugs for millions of Americans, or starting solar heating projects in Jamaica and Venezuela, Citizens creates social ventures as innovative as the businesses that finance them. For more information, visit CITIZENS ENERGY | HOME.


    It should be noted that Hugo Chavez is working through Corporations to deliver his help to low income families. Am I the only one that finds that to be a tad bit hypocritical?

  5. #115
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    Re: Is Venezuela's Chavez a threat to American National Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    Ok the nationally owned oil company has been using their wealth to influence Americans and a lot of them at that.
    Actually, such wealth has been used to provide free home heating oil to hundreds of thousands of low-income American households, as was originally claimed. CITGO is also the largest single contributor to the Muscular Dystrophy Association. How do you explain that?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    Meanwhile Venezuelan citizens are not being helped because Venezuela is not really so rich that they can pay for both.
    Election returns over the years would suggest that clear majorities of the Venezuelan people hold an opinion quite different from yours. Then again, they live there, and you just read stupid right-wing corporate propaganda, so that might account for much of the difference.

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    It should be noted that Hugo Chavez is working through Corporations to deliver his help to low income families. Am I the only one that finds that to be a tad bit hypocritical?
    LOL! Why would that be hypocritical? Do you seriously see Venezuela as some sort of hard-left bulwark of communism or something? Perhaps you should recognize that there are thousands of corporations in Venezuela, ranging from privately-owned to government-owned and including many co-ops in between. What does the US picture look like?

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    Re: Is Venezuela's Chavez a threat to American National Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal Fang View Post
    Actually, such wealth has been used to provide free home heating oil to hundreds of thousands of low-income American households, as was originally claimed. CITGO is also the largest single contributor to the Muscular Dystrophy Association. How do you explain that?
    BTW it is called actually Citgo Petroleum Corporation. And most Corporation's have charities. Its called Corporate social responsibility.


    Election returns over the years would suggest that clear majorities of the Venezuelan people hold an opinion quite different from yours. Then again, they live there, and you just read stupid right-wing corporate propaganda, so that might account for much of the difference.
    LMAO I do not buy into Right wing propaganda haha. Nice try but good luck proving your claim here.


    LOL! Why would that be hypocritical? Do you seriously see Venezuela as some sort of hard-left bulwark of communism or something? Perhaps you should recognize that there are thousands of corporations in Venezuela, ranging from privately-owned to government-owned and including many co-ops in between. What does the US picture look like?
    Well yes I know that and that was my point. But no I never have thought that Venezuela is a Communist nation, in fact that strawman is ridiculous. Do I think that Chavez wants to turn Venezuela into a Cuba like nation? Yes. Of course that wont happen though since Chavez has his own flavor that differs from his hero Castro. But the deciding factor is that the people do not want to join in on the Cuban insanity. How do I know? Well the internet is awesome! I actually talk to people in Venezuela. And I am not comparing the US with Venezuela that would be another ridiculous strawman argument.

    But one has to wonder how come Hugo Chavez is worth 1 billion? Did the military pay him millions? Hugo Chavez Net Worth 2012 | Get Net Worth

    Hugo Chavez's Net Worth | RichButBroke

    Wouldnt that make Chavez a villain stealing his wealth from his people? I mean how does one spend 17 years in the military then go into politics and end up a billionaire? Wouldnt that also make Hugo Chavez a top percent'er?

  7. #117
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    Re: Is Venezuela's Chavez a threat to American National Security?

    [QUOTE=FreedomFromAll;1060737810]
    LMAO I do not buy into Right wing propaganda haha. Nice try but good luck proving your claim here.
    QUOTE]

    I certainly disagree. You are a veritable fountain of right wing disinformation. That belief stuff is a wonderful thing, don't you think?

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    Re: Is Venezuela's Chavez a threat to American National Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    BTW it is called actually Citgo Petroleum Corporation. And most Corporation's have charities. Its called Corporate social responsibility.
    Ah, so the home heating oil program has actually been an example of social repsonsibility. See, I understood you to be saying that it was all just some sort of self-serving trick by Chavez to fool people into thinking he was a man of the people or some such.

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    LMAO I do not buy into Right wing propaganda haha. Nice try but good luck proving your claim here.
    I defer to you in the provision of such proof. You've been doing just fine at it on your own.

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    Well yes I know that and that was my point.
    Actually, your point was that it was somehow "hypocritical" for Chavez to work through corporations. You even capitalized it. What was the basis for that?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    But the deciding factor is that the people do not want to join in on the Cuban insanity. How do I know? Well the internet is awesome! I actually talk to people in Venezuela.
    No, you don't.

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    But one has to wonder how come Hugo Chavez is worth 1 billion?
    LOL! One has to wonder how entertainment sites would suddenly become legitimate sources. Do you realize that your site pegs the net worth of Saddam Hussein at $2 billion???

  9. #119
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    Re: Is Venezuela's Chavez a threat to American National Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    I certainly disagree. You are a veritable fountain of right wing disinformation. That belief stuff is a wonderful thing, don't you think?
    Lmao What?

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    Re: Is Venezuela's Chavez a threat to American National Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal Fang View Post
    Ah, so the home heating oil program has actually been an example of social repsonsibility. See, I understood you to be saying that it was all just some sort of self-serving trick by Chavez to fool people into thinking he was a man of the people or some such.
    Corporate social responsibility = Propaganda to hide the fact that you are doing something bad.


    I defer to you in the provision of such proof. You've been doing just fine at it on your own.
    Just because I am against a Leftist I must be a Right winger? I am also anti-Christian Right does that make me a Left winger too?


    Actually, your point was that it was somehow "hypocritical" for Chavez to work through corporations. You even capitalized it. What was the basis for that?
    My basis is the ten hour long speeches that Hugo Chavez has made describing Corporations as the most vile things on Earth.

    No, you don't.
    What do you have surveillance equipment on my PC? Or do you believe that only Venezuelan state media are the only ones telling the truth? Think about that the media is either controlled by CHavista's or the opposition? If you believe either group you are buying into their propaganda. Social media and blogs though are in this case much more reliable. But go on believe Hugo propaganda machine if you want.

    LOL! One has to wonder how entertainment sites would suddenly become legitimate sources. Do you realize that your site pegs the net worth of Saddam Hussein at $2 billion???
    Ok then prove me wrong show me what Hugo Chavez is worth?

    Accusations of corruption hit Chavez clan - Houston Chronicle

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