View Poll Results: Would You Rather Have Obamacare or a System of UHC?

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  • "Obamacare"

    8 14.81%
  • Universal Health Care

    46 85.19%
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Thread: "Obamacare" or UHC?

  1. #221
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    Re: "Obamacare" or UHC?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    Humans naturally have the ability to think and act and collectively carve out a more desirable living condition than what nature provides as a base.
    Voluntary action, not forced or coerced, is fine.
    Funny thing is that those on the UHC side of things have had all this time to start their own non-profit health insurer. Yet didn't be cause they knew it wasn't sustainable over the long haul unless other people where footing part of the costs. And that is what they will get now unless it is stopped.
    Make no mistake about it. Wanting someone else to provide for a person's HC is selfish and greedy.
    Stop trying to steal OPP under the guise of helping. It is bs.



    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    And humans have not only survived, but thrived, when they worked together for mutual benefit.
    Yeah, and until recently, all without UHC.
    Go figure. Huh?

    And what happens when we interfere with others, such as providing clean water, food etc...?
    We inevitably increase their suffering, because they breed more and cause an increased consumption of resources, when they barely had enough for themselves to begin with.

    And as to resources... Th worlds resources are dwindling, that isn't going to stop.
    We need to stop thinking about measures that will increase the population, and start focusing on measure that will start decreasing it.
    Unless you do not care about the mass suffering in the future that will occur if we don't.



    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    What you're suggesting is that we revert back to being simply big dumb animals.
    That is an utter ridiculous assertion, we are animals, and some are big, and or dumb.
    Healthcare is a product.
    One that is not necessary to live a natural life.

    And it has been a product for remuneration since it inception.

    I am suggesting that it remain what it is. You need it, you pay for it... all of it, or you don't get it.

    Not at someone else's forced expense.

    Voluntary action, not forced or coerced, is fine.

    You do not need it to live a natural life.

  2. #222
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    Re: "Obamacare" or UHC?

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    Voluntary action, not forced or coerced, is fine.
    Funny thing is that those on the UHC side of things have had all this time to start their own non-profit health insurer. Yet didn't be cause they knew it wasn't sustainable over the long haul unless other people where footing part of the costs. And that is what they will get now unless it is stopped.
    Make no mistake about it. Wanting someone else to provide for a person's HC is selfish and greedy.
    Stop trying to steal OPP under the guise of helping. It is bs.



    Yeah, and until recently, all without UHC.
    Go figure. Huh?

    And what happens when we interfere with others, such as providing clean water, food etc...?
    We inevitably increase their suffering, because they breed more and cause an increased consumption of resources, when they barely had enough for themselves to begin with.

    And as to resources... Th worlds resources are dwindling, that isn't going to stop.
    We need to stop thinking about measures that will increase the population, and start focusing on measure that will start decreasing it.
    Unless you do not care about the mass suffering in the future that will occur if we don't.




    That is an utter ridiculous assertion, we are animals, and some are big, and or dumb.
    Healthcare is a product.
    One that is not necessary to live a natural life.

    And it has been a product for remuneration since it inception.

    I am suggesting that it remain what it is. You need it, you pay for it... all of it, or you don't get it.

    Not at someone else's forced expense.

    Voluntary action, not forced or coerced, is fine.

    You do not need it to live a natural life.
    Do we do everything perfect? No. Can we do better? You bet. Does literally everything *need* to be improved? No.

    The mental gymnastics you use to justify your conclusion are truly impressive.
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

  3. #223
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    Re: "Obamacare" or UHC?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    Do we do everything perfect? No. Can we do better? You bet. Does literally everything *need* to be improved? No.

    The mental gymnastics you use to justify your conclusion are truly impressive.
    They aren't mental gymnastics, but more like painstaking efforts to get people to understand the non sequitur that just because cooperation works on small scales does not mean that a communistic health care system is appropriate.

    His point illustrates that 1) health care is not even a basic need, let alone a basic right, 2) that coercing all those with means to help all those with a need is morally unacceptable, and 3) that helping all those whenever they have a need distorts the risk assessment of creating more mouths to feed.

  4. #224
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    Re: "Obamacare" or UHC?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    Is it?

    Humans naturally have the ability to think and act and collectively carve out a more desirable living condition than what nature provides as a base. And humans have not only survived, but thrived, when they worked together for mutual benefit. What you're suggesting is that we revert back to being simply big dumb animals.
    The part you are missing is that working together for mutual benefit does not need to be compelled. It happens all the time voluntarily. Just as it should.
    “Tyranny is defined as that which is legal for the government but illegal for the citizenry.”
    ― Thomas Jefferson

  5. #225
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    Re: "Obamacare" or UHC?

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    And you are not going to because as you were already told Your question and premiss is false.
    Got it, there is no international health organization that makes the claim that private health care provides better outcomes for less costs.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  6. #226
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    Re: "Obamacare" or UHC?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Got it, there is no international health organization that makes the claim that private health care provides better outcomes for less costs.
    You forgot to add that it is because of their bias.

  7. #227
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    Re: "Obamacare" or UHC?

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    You forgot to add that it is because of their bias.
    Got it, all of international health care organizations in the world are biased, according to Excon.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  8. #228
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    Re: "Obamacare" or UHC?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Got it, all of international health care organizations in the world are biased, according to Excon.
    Now you are just being sad!

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