View Poll Results: Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?

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  • Yes

    9 25.71%
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    16 45.71%
  • Somewhere in between

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  • Not sure, but I'm interested in what others have to say

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Thread: Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?

  1. #1
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    Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?

    This link is also posted in the immigration forum, but that thread is intended for the immigration aspects. This thread and poll is intended for a different sub-topic that is contained within the story. I have also seen this sub-topic mentioned in other news stories as well, so it's not exactly a rare issue.

    Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?

    Tattoo Checks Trip Up Visas - Yahoo! Finance

    Quote from article: Some critics say U.S. officials are making decisions that derail people's lives and encroach on their rights. "They cast too wide a net and border dangerously on violating first amendment freedom of speech and expression," said Jeff Joseph, a Denver immigration lawyer.
    The question isn't how things are done now. We may be doing them correct, or we may be doing them incorrect. The question is: What do YOU think should apply to non-citizens regarding specifically Constitutional rights and protections?

    Should something like the 1st Amendment right to free speech and expression apply to non-citizens (who are in this country)?
    Last edited by radcen; 07-12-12 at 06:56 PM.
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
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    Re: Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?

    Well, for example, if the 1st amendment applied to non-citizens, wouldn't we be obligated to enforce that throughout the world?
    "I have never understood why it is "greed" to want to keep the money you have earned but not greed to want to take somebody else's money." -Thomas Sowell

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    Re: Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?

    All men are created equal, endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights.

    Maybe one day all men will mean everyone in the world, whether or not they are citizens of a democracy. While progress has been made over the past couple of centuries, we've still got a long way to go to achieve such an ideal.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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    Re: Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?

    If they are here legally, sure. If they are here illegally, their rights should only exist to the point that we get them shipped back home in a just manner.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
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    Re: Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    This link is also posted in the immigration forum, but that thread is intended for the immigration aspects. This thread and poll is intended for a different sub-topic that is contained within the story. I have also seen this sub-topic mentioned in other news stories as well, so it's not exactly a rare issue.

    Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?


    The question isn't how things are done now. We may be doing them correct, or we may be doing them incorrect. The question is: What do YOU think should apply to non-citizens regarding specifically Constitutional rights and protections?

    Should something like the 1st Amendment right to free speech and expression apply to non-citizens (who are in this country)?
    The US Constitution should apply to anyone in the US, citizen or not. We have no jurisdiction in other nations. As far as military engagements in foreign territory, we should adhere to the Geneva Convention regarding combatants, as well as ethical behavior regarding non-combatants.
    I love the NSA. It's like having a secret fan-base you will never see, but they're there, watching everything you write and it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that I may be some person's only form of unconstitutional entertainment one night.

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    Re: Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?

    To me, the issue isn't black-and-white. On the one hand, I don't think non-citizens should automatically be granted the right to bear arms. On the other hand, I think they should be protected from unreasonable search and seizure.
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

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    Re: Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    This link is also posted in the immigration forum, but that thread is intended for the immigration aspects. This thread and poll is intended for a different sub-topic that is contained within the story. I have also seen this sub-topic mentioned in other news stories as well, so it's not exactly a rare issue.

    Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?


    The question isn't how things are done now. We may be doing them correct, or we may be doing them incorrect. The question is: What do YOU think should apply to non-citizens regarding specifically Constitutional rights and protections?

    Should something like the 1st Amendment right to free speech and expression apply to non-citizens (who are in this country)?

    Where in the Constitution does it say one has to be a citizen to get the protections? Hint: It doesn't the protections extend to everyone within our borders whether they are a citizen or not.


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    Re: Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?

    I voted for somewhere in between. Specifically, IMHO, the constitution is MEANT to apply to citizens and legal residents within our states and territories. In order to be "under the jusisdiction thereof" you can not be an invading foriegn soldier, an enemy of the state or an illegal alien simply having "dropped in". Under the jurisdiction may be streatched to citizens committing "normal" crimes but once they actively seek to overthrow the gov't or make war in general (civil or otherwise) then that is where I would draw the line.

    In other words, an illegal alien has only the right to be tossed out humanely, the nonsense that allows "anchor babies" has been invented, and illogically streatched to include ILLEGAL entry (or born after the mother overstayed a legal temporary entry) being considered "under the jurisdiction" of the U.S. law which they have obviously violated, or they would not be "illegal" merely by their presense. No other country, except Canada, now does this. The SCOTUS has not addressed this issue since the U.S. vs. Wong Kim Ark case in 1898, and in that case, the parents were both here legally at the time of the birth.
    Last edited by ttwtt78640; 07-12-12 at 08:01 PM.
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    Re: Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    I voted for somewhere in between. Specifically, IMHO, the constitution is MEANT to apply to citizens and legal residents within our states and territories. In order to be "under the jusisdiction thereof" you can not be an invading foriegn soldier, an enemy of the state or an illegal alien simply having "dropped in". Under the jurisdiction may be streatched to citizens comitting "normal" crimes but once they actively seek to overthrow the gov't or make war in general (civil or otherwise) then that is where I would draw the line.

    In other words, an illegal alien has only the right to be tossed out humanely, the nonsense that allows "anchor babies" has been invented, and illogically streatched to include ILLEGAL entry (or born after the mother overstayed a legal temporary entry) being considered "under the jurisdiction" of the U.S. law which they have obviously violated, or they would not be "illegal" merely by their presense. No other country, except Canada, now does this. THe SCOTUS has not addressed this issue since the U.S. vs. Wong Kim Ark case in 1898, and in that case, the parents were both here legally at the time of the birth.
    This. I have no problem extending constitutional protection to those who enter legally, whether they are on a visa or decide to stay permanently they absolutely fall under the jurisdiction of our constitution. People who enter illegally or enter with the intent to commit attrocities against the U.S. enjoy no protection.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

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    Re: Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    This link is also posted in the immigration forum, but that thread is intended for the immigration aspects. This thread and poll is intended for a different sub-topic that is contained within the story. I have also seen this sub-topic mentioned in other news stories as well, so it's not exactly a rare issue.

    Should Constitutional rights extend to non-citizens?


    The question isn't how things are done now. We may be doing them correct, or we may be doing them incorrect. The question is: What do YOU think should apply to non-citizens regarding specifically Constitutional rights and protections?

    Should something like the 1st Amendment right to free speech and expression apply to non-citizens (who are in this country)?
    Constitutional rights are limitations upon government power. If the government doesn't have the power, then it doesn't matter if one is a "non-citizen" or not; it doesn't have the power to infringe.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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