View Poll Results: What level of influence does a Chief Executive have over the economy?

Voters
31. You may not vote on this poll
  • The CE is "the man". He steers it all.

    1 3.23%
  • The CE may not be a dictator, but still desreves the bulk of the blame/credit.

    4 12.90%
  • The CE sets "the tone", but has little actual influence.

    17 54.84%
  • The CE has virtually no influence whatsoever.

    3 9.68%
  • Other?

    6 19.35%
Page 8 of 9 FirstFirst ... 6789 LastLast
Results 71 to 80 of 86

Thread: What level of influence does a Chief Executive have over the economy?

  1. #71
    Student Airborne375's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Charleston, SC
    Last Seen
    10-21-12 @ 11:09 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    276

    Re: What level of influence does a Chief Executive have over the economy?

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Oh Look. Cpwill wrong again (this should surprise absolutely no one ever).

    Unless you want to argue that Reagan was a tried and true liberal when he stimulated the economy with a massive arms build up.
    Or that the All GOP Bush Years was a bunch of liberals in Republican clothing when they engaged in some of the largest government spending binges in US history.
    Reagan had a very good reason for arms build up. Namely he broke the back of the USSR without needing to fire a single shot. That's an impressive accomplishment in anyone's book.
    If there's a new way, I'll be the first in line.. But, it better work this time. - Dave Mustaine
    It's a damn poor mind that can only think of one way to spell a word. - Andrew Jackson
    Sue Sponte - Motto

  2. #72
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:43 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,107

    Re: What level of influence does a Chief Executive have over the economy?

    Well, it's not accurate that the Ryan Plan ignores entitlements. It is that it only addresses Medicare / Medicaid.

  3. #73
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:43 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,107

    Re: What level of influence does a Chief Executive have over the economy?

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    I was betting you'd do that. You got your ass kicked and rather than actually attempt to refute something you know you can't do ever, you just throw out dumb frat boy comments like that.

    You are wrong. I'm smarter than you. Game over.
    Nah. You're just emotionally needy yet educated. You had to resort to a non-falsifiable thesis in order to continue to defend your position. If you're going to argue it as an a priori position, then fine, but identify it as such rather than pretending that you arrived at your conclusion through any sort of application of the scientific method.

    As predicted, you do not have the courage to actually answer this.
    which branch of service did you serve in the infantry with, again? man, it takes precisely zero courage whatsoever to take part in an online debate forum - what's going to happen to me if I lose a debate? nothing? Anywho, here your reply is self-defeating, as you go on to respond to the answer I actually gave you.

    Have you ever studied group dynamics? What you describe is very different then what is happening now. I prove I'm smarter than you are.
    You do realize that "I have stated X" is not the same as "I have proven X"?

    But please, continue with your pointless penis game Girls love a guy who tries to chest-bump on the internet. What an alpha-male you are. Regular grey-back f'ing gorilla.

    As a recession hits, and if a particularly bad recession hits, you think the GOP will just stand and there do nothing as aggregate demand goes off a cliff?
    Not at all. I simply think that they are more likely to respond with attempts to lower marginal (particularly business) tax rates and reduce the regulatory burden (supply side) than they are to provide some kind of demand-side stimulus.

    You do realize that Bush's tax cuts in 2008 did absolutely nothing no? Oh wait. You don't.
    Actually I have argued they made the situation worse - and I was arguing that at the time as well. Similar to argument that you have made, I argued that Bush's stimulus wouldn't stimulate anything, and would instead only add debt.

    Bush's tax credits (which function the same as transfer payments) had no better effect in 2008 than they did in 2001. 1. Because you cannot magically increase demand by having the government take people's money and then give it back to them, and 2. Because even then, windfall income in times of economic instability tend to go towards savings and paying down debt.

    It does not matter if they think it will work or not.
    your argument is premised upon the assumption that they will. You are arguing specifically that members of the GOP will take actions that they believe will save the economy from falling off a cliff despite the strong and fervent ideological opposition of their base, as they will see a "saved economy" as their ticket to reelection. However, if they didn't believe that the actions you describe will stop an economy from sliding off that cliff then - and, this is important - they have no incentive to vote for that measure.

    You have this notion that they will enact policies that don't work, such as tax cuts as proven by both Bush (twice actually,
    once in 2001 and again in 2008
    That is very specifically incorrect, which, if you would have been paying attention to this thread, you would have been aware of. See: cpwill v kandahar.

    Correction. Reagan wasn't a Conservative.
    No, that is not correct. Reagan was indeed a conservative - he wasn't perfectly so, and in his workings with the Democrat Congress he sometimes gave and sometimes got (and, in the case of I'll-raise-taxes-if-you-cut-spending, he got taken).

    If you apply the criteria objectively and refuse to worship at his Cult Alter.
    No worship here - I only worship one Man and Reagan wasn't Him. He was an excellent President, all things considered, and his supply-side driven recovery puts this demand-side driven one to shame; but that doesn't mean that everything he did is for some reason sacrosanct.

    First of all, the notion that massive military spending did not boost the economy is entirely bat****.
    Not really. At least spending on roads enables other wealth-creation. Spending money on tanks involves taking alot of resources and pouring them into utterly non-productive venues. Hell, we might as well credit George Bush with saving us from Depression by invading Iraq, if military spending is stimulative.

    I never argued that Reagan was Kenysian. I merely pointed out that stimulus spending during Reagan worked to stimulate the economy. It does not matter if he thought the economic success was in-spite.
    here is the conversation that took place:

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child
    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill
    Since conservatives believe that government stimulative spending in fact is a drag on the economy, I strongly suspect that you are mirror-imaging.
    Oh Look. Cpwill wrong again (this should surprise absolutely no one ever).

    Unless you want to argue that Reagan was a tried and true liberal when he stimulated the economy with a massive arms build up...
    There you are, very much indeed impugning that Reagan believed that a massive arms build up would stimulate the economy.

    It's amusing how you switch from "economic data does not exist in a vacuum" to "economic data exists in a vacuum" when it suits your agenda.
    Not really. You made a foolish argument, I demonstrated that it was false. I do not argue that economic data exists in a vacuum, which is why I prefer to be guided by case studies (such as this one) that include larger data samples, such as the entire OECD, than econometric models that assume magical multipliers and/or static scoring.

    I'm getting extremely abusive to you because you don't ever bother to ditch your ideology and come into the real world.
    Nah. You're being an asshole because that's what you always do when you feel your position is weak.
    Last edited by cpwill; 07-08-12 at 09:27 AM.

  4. #74
    Tavern Bartender
    Constitutionalist
    American's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:03 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    76,301

    Re: What level of influence does a Chief Executive have over the economy?

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    He has about the same amount of influence as he does over gas prices.

    Interesting to note the "I Hate Obama" crowd isn't voting here.
    It would have been interesting to see this poll when Bush was president. It would indeed.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  5. #75
    Sage
    lpast's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Fla
    Last Seen
    05-21-16 @ 10:12 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    13,565

    Re: What level of influence does a Chief Executive have over the economy?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    The problem being that this is a broken-window fallacy. That money that went to pay the public employees came from somewhere, and funneling it through public employees doesn't improve the economy any more than moving money from your money market account into cash in your wallet makes you wealthier.



    you have a real hard-on for these guys. what did successful people ever do to you?



    ....





    The Federal Registrar is beyond human comprehension. The States are almost as bad if not worse (depending on the state). According to the Small Business Association, the annual cost of the regulatory burden is $1.7 Trillion. We desperately need to start stripping regulation, assign clearer borders of responsibility between the different levels of governance, and reduce that burden. In addition, we need to provide some form of a "loser pays" incentive structure into the regulatory court system to incentivize regulators not to become abusive.



    they are? do you have any support for this?



    You are right, I am missing it. Link it, please, so I can stop missing it.



    and you still have yet to answer my question about how you can support Obama when his plan cuts more from Medicare, and starts cutting for current seniors at that.





    Ah im glad you finally admitted it....its the same with that broken window BS story of trickle down..the only difference is theres definitive PROOF there is no trickle down...just look at CEO pay and worker pay....the pigs have gotten fabulously richer stealing from the working class.


    Successful people as YOU label them have done nothing to me...all things considered Im relatively successful more than the average person....the Pigs <your successful> have sucked most of the life out of this country....now they want whats left. They have left vast areas of nothing...<unemployment> where there used to opportunity and sent them to china out of greed so the pigs can get even more.
    Theyve stripped workers of benefits and pensions..WHILE they just TOOK more for themselves....and lastly CP.
    What have regular everyday americans ever done to make you what you are...how can you day after day profess taking everything off of working people and even COMBAT TROOPS to give more to the 1% that have it all as it is......I dont understand you one iota marine...I really dont....and please dont give me the I dont understand economics bs ok...I dont have to be an economist to see the rape of america being perpetrated by the teaparty types.....You people have attacked everything in america that was good about it......this isnt about the size of govt...this is about Obama and greed....where were all these deficit hawks. before obama got elected. Sleezy PHONY scum like Boehner who ALL OF A SUDDEN is a teatard and the rest of the gop.....know why they turned CP...not out of conviction, not out of what they the teartards are doing is right...for the BIG PAC CASH that Koch bros and Adelsen are throwing around to BUY THEM....so they and the rest of the pigs can pick the rest of our bones clean.
    Last edited by lpast; 07-08-12 at 10:09 AM.

  6. #76
    Tavern Bartender
    Constitutionalist
    American's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:03 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    76,301

    Re: What level of influence does a Chief Executive have over the economy?

    Quote Originally Posted by lpast View Post
    Ah im glad you finally admitted it....its the same with that broken window BS story of trickle down..the only difference is theres definitive PROOF there is no trickle down...just look at CEO pay and worker pay....the pigs have gotten fabulously richer stealing from the working class.


    Successful people as YOU label them have done nothing to me...all things considered Im relatively successful more than the average person....the Pigs <your successful> have sucked most of the life out of this country....now they want whats left. They have left vast areas of nothing...<unemployment> where there used to opportunity and sent them to china out of greed so the pigs can get even more.
    Theyve stripped workers of benefits and pensions..WHILE they just TOOK more for themselves....and lastly CP.
    What have regular everyday americans ever done to make you what you are...how can you day after day profess taking everything off of working people and even COMBAT TROOPS to give more to the 1% that have it all as it is......I dont understand you one iota marine...I really dont....and please dont give me the I dont understand economics bs ok...I dont have to be an economist to see the rape of america being perpetrated by the teaparty types.....You people have attacked everything in america that was good about it......this isnt about the size of govt...this is about Obama and greed....where were all these deficit hawks. before obama got elected. Sleezy PHONY scum like Boehner who ALL OF A SUDDEN is a teatard and the rest of the gop.....know why they turned CP...not out of conviction, not out of what they the teartards are doing is right...for the BIG PAC CASH that Koch bros and Adelsen are throwing around to BUY THEM....so they and the rest of the pigs can pick the rest of our bones clean.
    When you can prove that poor people make you prosperous, then we'll listen to your inane moutfoaming.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  7. #77
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:43 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,107

    Re: What level of influence does a Chief Executive have over the economy?

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    It would have been interesting to see this poll when Bush was president. It would indeed.
    As I recall from the price-of-gas polls, there has been a pretty entertaining swing

  8. #78
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:43 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,107

    Re: What level of influence does a Chief Executive have over the economy?

    Quote Originally Posted by lpast View Post
    Ah im glad you finally admitted it....its the same with that broken window BS story of trickle down..the only difference is theres definitive PROOF there is no trickle down...just look at CEO pay and worker pay....the pigs have gotten fabulously richer stealing from the working class.
    all income quintiles have increased. intellectual labor has simply increased faster.

    Successful people as YOU label them have done nothing to me...all things considered Im relatively successful more than the average person....the Pigs <your successful> have sucked most of the life out of this country....now they want whats left. They have left vast areas of nothing...<unemployment> where there used to opportunity and sent them to china out of greed so the pigs can get even more.
    Theyve stripped workers of benefits and pensions..WHILE they just TOOK more for themselves....and lastly CP.
    What have regular everyday americans ever done to make you what you are...how can you day after day profess taking everything off of working people and even COMBAT TROOPS to give more to the 1% that have it all as it is......I dont understand you one iota marine...I really dont....and please dont give me the I dont understand economics bs ok...I dont have to be an economist to see the rape of america being perpetrated by the teaparty types.....You people have attacked everything in america that was good about it......this isnt about the size of govt...this is about Obama and greed....where were all these deficit hawks. before obama got elected. Sleezy PHONY scum like Boehner who ALL OF A SUDDEN is a teatard and the rest of the gop.....know why they turned CP...not out of conviction, not out of what they the teartards are doing is right...for the BIG PAC CASH that Koch bros and Adelsen are throwing around to BUY THEM....so they and the rest of the pigs can pick the rest of our bones clean.
    I call BS. My uncle is a multimillionaire and has provided for upwards of 70ish families directly, not counting the value-added to society. The wealthy aren't any more greedy than any one else; it's just more convenient to blame them.

  9. #79
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Where I am now
    Last Seen
    09-11-17 @ 03:00 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    16,386

    Re: What level of influence does a Chief Executive have over the economy?

    The POTUS can make the economy far worse - he/she can do little to make it better, other then staying out of it's way.

  10. #80
    Sage


    MaggieD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Chicago Area
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    43,243
    Blog Entries
    43

    Re: What level of influence does a Chief Executive have over the economy?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    What level of influence does a Chief Executive have over the economy? "Chief Executive" (CE), for this debate, is meant to be President of the United States, and/or the governor of a state.

    Using the current national economy as an example, though the same concept could apply to a state government as well...

    Is the state of the current economy Obama's fault? His supporters claim he's doing a good job, yet when it's pointed out the economy still sucks his supporters blame Congress (specifically Republicans and filibusters) for thwarting his moves. Hold on... doesn't that mean that the CE does not have the influence necessary to steer the economy? I mean, if Obama's so good, the economy would be better by now, in spite of Congress, wouldn't it?

    This begs the question: Is President Obama the man in charge and with the influence necessary to steer the economy, or not?

    If it is Congress and not the CE, then doesn't this let Bush II off the hook as well? After all, it's Congress, not the CE that has the influence, right?

    If it is Congress that wields the power and influence, then how much does it matter *who* the President is?

    Bottom line: If you want to blame Bush II for getting us in this mess, fine, but then Obama is also to blame for keeping us in this mess. If you want to absolve Obama of blame due to an uncooperative Congress, ok, but then Bush II is absolved of blame as well. Where's the the consistency in assessing blame and/or taking credit?
    In my lifetime, I have never seen a President exert the power of his office more effectively --and ruthlessly -- than Obama. Obamacare was pushed down the throats of the American people with absolutely no regard for compromise...only lipservice input from Republicans in Congress...and a partisanship so strong as to be even a bit scarey.

    When the President has a majority in both houses, he is a dictator. When he doesn't? Notsomuch.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

Page 8 of 9 FirstFirst ... 6789 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •