View Poll Results: Free Trade or Protectionism?

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  • Free Trade

    29 61.70%
  • Protectionism

    18 38.30%
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Thread: "Free Trade" OR "Protectionism"

  1. #131
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    Re: "Free Trade" OR "Protectionism"

    Quote Originally Posted by TNAR View Post
    Until America figures it out? Who is America if not the consumers within? How can an arbitrary political construct "figure" anything out? Can you not see that America, from an economic perspective, is nothing more than the aggregation of millions of individuals? If a mafia of 546 dictate to the remaining 300 million serfs how the "problems" will be solved then how do you expect anyone to be free? How do you expect 546 individuals to determine the best way for 300,000,000 individuals to live their own lives? Your logic baffles me.
    Nothing you said has anything to do with imposing tariffs to promote American production and industry. This outsourcing and imbalanced trade crap is destroying our economy. The market is saturated with cheap **** made in China, we have the means to produce, we do produce, but the consumer will always buy the cheaper product. Tariffs make the foreign product more expensive than the domestic. There's nothing baffling about it.
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  2. #132
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    Re: "Free Trade" OR "Protectionism"

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Foley View Post
    Or you're a 9 year old, they love emotes and going "LMAO" allot. Children are hopelessly institutionalized, won't be able to think for themselves to they hit 40.
    Sometimes not even then.
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  3. #133
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    Re: "Free Trade" OR "Protectionism"

    Quote Originally Posted by Lokiate View Post
    Nothing you said has anything to do with imposing tariffs to promote American production and industry. This outsourcing and imbalanced trade crap is destroying our economy. The market is saturated with cheap **** made in China, we have the means to produce, we do produce, but the consumer will always buy the cheaper product. Tariffs make the foreign product more expensive than the domestic. There's nothing baffling about it.
    so you are in favor of making it harder for poor people to provide for themselves in order to benefit upper-middle class union members?

  4. #134
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    Re: "Free Trade" OR "Protectionism"

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    so you are in favor of making it harder for poor people to provide for themselves in order to benefit upper-middle class union members?
    Unions don't have anything to do with outsourcing. Companies outsource because they can Chinese workers next to nothing,require them to work for 80 hours a week for that next to nothing pay and not have to worry about any worker and environmental safety laws. If unions were the problem then these companies would have moved to right to work states.


    It could be argued that since you favor uncontrolled outsourcing that you favor helping communist and that you favor helping to fund the Chinese army. Amazing how die hard party-tard republicans claim to be patriotic and used to bash communist but now are globalist pieces of **** who support funding a communist government and military.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

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  5. #135
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    Re: "Free Trade" OR "Protectionism"

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Unions don't have anything to do with outsourcing.

    Companies outsource because they can Chinese workers next to nothing,require them to work for 80 hours a week for that next to nothing pay and not have to worry about any worker and environmental safety laws. If unions were the problem then these companies would have moved to right to work states.


    It could be argued that since you favor uncontrolled outsourcing that you favor helping communist and that you favor helping to fund the Chinese army. Amazing how die hard party-tard republicans claim to be patriotic and used to bash communist but now are globalist pieces of **** who support funding a communist government and military.
    They've done more than their fair share to demonize free trade.

    Companies outsource because the price of employing only U.S workers would be far too great to justify maintaining the current prices at which their products currently reside. Increased labor output leads to higher prices, which leads to decreased sales and lessened ability to expand (or retain for that matter) their workforce and consumer base alike. Forcing companies to remain stagnant would be highly detrimental to companies which happen to preside in fields with competitors on the global scale (i.e. all of them.) The idea of utilizing only American labor is an wonderful notion, but unfortunately it is both highly unrealistic and counterproductive.

    If we had placed ideologically founded restrictions on trade in the past on a large scale as you suggest, a large chunk of the countries that currently purchase large amounts of our debt and consumer goods alike presently would likely still be quasi third world civilizations with infinitely lower standards of living.
    Last edited by a351; 07-07-12 at 11:36 AM.

  6. #136
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    Re: "Free Trade" OR "Protectionism"

    Quote Originally Posted by Hare View Post
    They've done more than their fair share to demonize free trade.
    Seeing how unrestricted free trade in only used to pay people next to nothing and exploit the fact there is little to no enviromental and employee protection laws the unions didn't really have to do an demonizing of free trade.
    Companies outsource because the price of employing only U.S workers would be far too great to justify maintaining the current prices at which their products currently reside.
    The main reason for outsourcing would be exploit the fact you can pay a worker next to nothing,require that employee to work 80 hour work weeks and exploit the fact there are little to no employee and environmental laws.

    Increased labor output leads to higher prices, which leads to decreased sales and lessened ability to expand (or retain for that matter) their workforce and consumer base alike.
    That's only true when American companies have to compete with foreign companies. You remove that foreign competition or even the competition between American and forign companies then it won't lead to decreases sales and lessened ability to expand.


    Forcing companies to remain stagnant would be highly detrimental to companies which happen to preside in fields with competitors on the global scale (i.e. all of them.)
    I am not worried about foreign companies.Companies that outsource are no longer American.

    The idea of utilizing only American labor is an wonderful notion, but unfortunately it is both highly unrealistic and counterproductive.
    No one is saying that all trade has to be stopped.Just that if those companies in those countries don't adhere to the same standards we have to adhere to then tariffs should be imposed. Allowing companies to leave the US is not a good idea.Sending jobs to a country like China is a ****en idiotic idea, unless you want a communist country to succeed and grow its military at the expense of American jobs.

    If we had placed ideologically founded restrictions on trade in the past on a large scale as you suggest, a large chunk of the countries that currently purchase large amounts of our debt and consumer goods alike presently would likely still be quasi third world civilizations with infinitely lower standards of living.
    I am not worried about those other countries.Other countries should not be uplifted at the expense of American jobs.If you want to uplift China,Mexico or some other country then do so at your own expense.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  7. #137
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    Re: "Free Trade" OR "Protectionism"

    The problem with tariffs and the like is that it will drive up the price (in our country) of whatever has a tariff on it.

    The plus side being that businesses who try to make that item here in the US (thus paying more for wages, meeting regulations, and taxes) can compete at the same level, for the smaller market (due to higher prices). Is that a plus side?
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  8. #138
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    Re: "Free Trade" OR "Protectionism"

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    so you are in favor of making it harder for poor people to provide for themselves in order to benefit upper-middle class union members?
    The status quo of our heavily imbalanced trade with foreign nations creates more poverty by giving American jobs to the Chinese, instead of using our own domestic resources and people. Cheaper production is stealing American jobs, not creating them, and only benefits the corporate heads and large business owners. Maintaining this status quo is ****ing the lower classes over by reducing the amount of jobs and opportunities available to them.

    Furthermore, I'm tired of all these bull**** appeals to the poor, as though the people who use these hollow attempts really give two ****s about the lower classes. It's no different than the political squabbles and chest beating politicians do to declare who supports the troops the most. It's ****ing gay.
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  9. #139
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    Re: "Free Trade" OR "Protectionism"

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Unions don't have anything to do with outsourcing.
    Outsourcing is when companies purchase non-core functions. For example, the office I work in outsources its' coffee production to
    Starbucks.

    Companies outsource because they can Chinese workers next to nothing,require them to work for 80 hours a week for that next to nothing pay and not have to worry about any worker and environmental safety laws. If unions were the problem then these companies would have moved to right to work states.
    many of them did - that's why the right to work states have added jobs while the unionized states have lost them.

    It could be argued that since you favor uncontrolled outsourcing that you favor helping communist and that you favor helping to fund the Chinese army
    not really. that's why I favor balancing the budget - it is our interest payments that are going to fund the PLAN.

    Amazing how die hard party-tard republicans claim to be patriotic and used to bash communist but now are globalist pieces of **** who support funding a communist government and military.

  10. #140
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    Re: "Free Trade" OR "Protectionism"

    Quote Originally Posted by Lokiate View Post
    The status quo of our heavily imbalanced trade with foreign nations creates more poverty by giving American jobs to the Chinese, instead of using our own domestic resources and people. Cheaper production is stealing American jobs, not creating them, and only benefits the corporate heads and large business owners. Maintaining this status quo is ****ing the lower classes over by reducing the amount of jobs and opportunities available to them.
    That is incorrect. Cheaper production lowers the cost of living helping consumers, and most helping those who consume the largest portion of their income (the poor). By lowering the cost of living, consumers have increased disposable wealth, which leads to increased job formation. Those who claim that trade decreases wealth are forgetting the forest for the fallen tree.

    Furthermore, I'm tired of all these bull**** appeals to the poor, as though the people who use these hollow attempts really give two ****s about the lower classes. It's no different than the political squabbles and chest beating politicians do to declare who supports the troops the most. It's ****ing gay.
    it's just worth pointing out that your proposed solution actually ****s over the people you claim to want to help.

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