View Poll Results: Can you be a slave owner and a libertarian at the same time?

Voters
30. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    13 43.33%
  • No

    17 56.67%
Page 21 of 23 FirstFirst ... 111920212223 LastLast
Results 201 to 210 of 225

Thread: Can you be a slave owner and a libertarian at the same time?

  1. #201
    Basketball Nerd
    StillBallin75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Vilseck, Germany
    Last Seen
    12-10-17 @ 07:52 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    21,896

    Re: Can you be a slave owner and a libertarian at the same time?

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    I am very familiar with the history. At no time did we intervene into the sovereign affair of foreign nations in regards to this issue.
    Sailing into territorial waters and capturing a city in foreign territory in order to gain leverage to extract a trade treaty in our favor. I'd say that's violating another nation's territorial integrity and national sovereignty. I've already made my case. The Barbary Wars went beyond simple territorial self-defense for the reasons mentioned above and as a result, I don't believe they constitute a case of non-interventionism.

    Your example of native tribes is a better example in that we could be considered the aggressor, but many will argue it was somewhat a policy of self preservation (albeit a weak one)
    Guess we simply disagree on the definition of "non-intervention" then. Because since before we became a nation we were engaging in an activist foreign policy, including westward expansion. That's patently non-libertarian in my opinion.

    Ron Paul is correct, and nobody of any significance really argues it. Nonintervention was absolutely the overriding philosophy in our early years, we simply didn’t view Indian tribes as states holding any form of sovereignty.
    Well I guess you could make the case that the Founding Fathers were "non-interventionists" if you also take into account the possibility that they were hypocrites. Same way they believed that "all men were created equal," but some weren't equal enough to warrant being freed from slavery.
    Last edited by StillBallin75; 06-26-12 at 05:00 PM.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  2. #202
    cookies crumble
    ARealConservative's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Seen
    04-21-17 @ 09:41 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    14,518

    Re: Can you be a slave owner and a libertarian at the same time?

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Sailing into territorial waters and capturing a city in foreign territory.
    This happened after they became the aggressor

    I'd say that's violating another nation's territorial integrity and national sovereignty.
    I’d say you are wrong.

    I've already made my case.
    A weak one that historians largely agree was not an example of interventionism

    Guess we simply disagree on the definition of "non-intervention" then. Because since before we became a nation we were engaging in an activist foreign policy, including westward expansion. That's patently non-libertarian in my opinion.
    Most people quickly understand that our views on foreign policy were radically different pre WW1 then post WW2. That you can find examples involving Indian tribes or us meddling in disputes between Texas and Mexico does not make the overall policy of non-interventionism a pretend one.

  3. #203
    Sage
    Somerville's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    On an island. Not that one!
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:45 AM
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    9,824

    Re: Can you be a slave owner and a libertarian at the same time?

    "Non-intervention was American policy until the 20th C"

    I do not think you have read your history.

    Texas and New Mexico - the Mexican American War (1846-1848), California (1846), Hawaii (1893) Cuba (1898) - nope, no intervention there by Americans.
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
    ~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

  4. #204
    Professor

    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Last Seen
    03-23-13 @ 02:33 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    1,265

    Re: Can you be a slave owner and a libertarian at the same time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    that defies logic.
    Okay if that defies logic, then I'm going to assume you drive a car, if you do then you must not care about pollution.... correct ??

  5. #205
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    The greatest city on Earth
    Last Seen
    08-04-12 @ 04:27 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    31,089

    Re: Can you be a slave owner and a libertarian at the same time?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbarian View Post
    Okay if that defies logic, then I'm going to assume you drive a car, if you do then you must not care about pollution.... correct ??
    my car is rated ELEV...."extreme low-emissions vehicle"

  6. #206
    Professor

    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Last Seen
    03-23-13 @ 02:33 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    1,265

    Re: Can you be a slave owner and a libertarian at the same time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    my car is rated ELEV...."extreme low-emissions vehicle"
    So then we would have to look back and find out how many slaves each founding father owned , if it was under the national average, they could then be against slavery ???

  7. #207
    Death2Globalists Matt Foley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    ExecuteTheTraitors
    Last Seen
    11-24-12 @ 12:17 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    5,574

    Re: Can you be a slave owner and a libertarian at the same time?

    Dixiecrat economics and Libertarianism economics is exactly the same thing.
    Globalist = Free Trade, Open Borders, Multiculturalist, Anti-White Racist, Hypocrite, Sophist, Deceiver, Manipulator, Warmonger, Vulgar Culture, Morally Depraved......Enemy

    Death to Globalists

  8. #208
    Student
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Louisiana
    Last Seen
    07-28-12 @ 01:44 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    203

    Re: Can you be a slave owner and a libertarian at the same time?

    No way lol... Jefferson owned slaves, he had libertarian philosophies but, you also have to look at the morality of the time. Even the beloved Abraham Lincoln said this:

    "There is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race."

    Did everyone like Lincoln's support of the exportation of slaves back to Africa?

    Lysander Spooner is more of a libertarian than Jefferson. Ron Paul is more paleoconservative than libertarian in my eyes.

    Edit:

    I only read a little of the first page and had to post I'll start reading the rest since its not to long of a thread.
    Last edited by LibertyBurns; 06-29-12 at 06:26 PM.

  9. #209
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    The greatest city on Earth
    Last Seen
    08-04-12 @ 04:27 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    31,089

    Re: Can you be a slave owner and a libertarian at the same time?

    if one can be a Libertarian AND a slave-owner, then Libertarians don't give a damn about human freedom or liberty...and only care about their own fortune.

  10. #210
    Student
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Louisiana
    Last Seen
    07-28-12 @ 01:44 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    203

    Re: Can you be a slave owner and a libertarian at the same time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    if one can be a Libertarian AND a slave-owner, then Libertarians don't give a damn about human freedom or liberty...and only care about their own fortune.
    Don't listen to this scarecrow, he hasn't seen the wizard yet.

    Who is a slave owner and a libertarian anyway? I've yet to meet one.

Page 21 of 23 FirstFirst ... 111920212223 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •