View Poll Results: Who should PUBLIC tax payer funded school teacher evaluations be released to?

Voters
27. You may not vote on this poll
  • Anyone regardless where they live can get evaluations just by requesting them.

    6 22.22%
  • Anyone who lives in school district can get evaluations just by requesting them.

    3 11.11%
  • Anybody living school district. But has to schedule an appointment get evaluations.

    0 0%
  • Anyone regardless where they live.But has to schedule an appointment get evaluations.

    0 0%
  • Parents regardless where they live can get evaluations just by requesting them.

    1 3.70%
  • Parents who live in school district can get evaluations just by requesting them.

    1 3.70%
  • Parents living in school district. But has to schedule an appointment get evaluations.

    2 7.41%
  • Parents regardless where they live.But has to schedule an appointment get evaluations

    0 0%
  • Public tax payer funded teachers should not have their evaluations released to anyone

    9 33.33%
  • other/I do not know.

    5 18.52%
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Thread: Who should PUBLIC tax payer funded school teacher evaluations be released to?

  1. #61
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    Re: Who should PUBLIC tax payer funded school teacher evaluations be released to?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    I don't care about turnover.

    And with that one comment, you lose the debate.

    Let me explain something to you. Teacher turnover is a SERIOUS problem. Serious enough that it significantly hurts teacher turnover (see a very recent study here.) Serious enough that teacher turnover costs, according to Forbes, $7.3 BILLION per year. As if schools needed any more problem, the conditions that encourage them to leave are KILLING are educational system, FAR more than this so-called "bad teacher problem" does. But armchair critics will never acknowledge this (lest they cease to BE armchair critics).
    "A man you can bait with a tweet is not a man we can trust with nuclear weapons." --Hillary Rodham Clinton
    "Innocent until proven guilty is for criminal convictions, not elections." --Mitt Romney

  2. #62
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    Re: Who should PUBLIC tax payer funded school teacher evaluations be released to?

    If you're a servant of the public, why shouldn't the public be able to evaluate you?

    Make it convenient. Put it all onto an official website, neatly organized.

    Isn't transparency a virtue?

  3. #63
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    Re: Who should PUBLIC tax payer funded school teacher evaluations be released to?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wake View Post
    Isn't transparency a virtue?
    It can be. It can also be a problem, since people like to take things out of context to generate political issues.
    I love the NSA. It's like having a secret fan-base you will never see, but they're there, watching everything you write and it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that I may be some person's only form of unconstitutional entertainment one night.

  4. #64
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    Re: Who should PUBLIC tax payer funded school teacher evaluations be released to?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lokiate View Post
    It can be. It can also be a problem, since people like to take things out of context to generate political issues.
    But if the literal evaluations are shown themselves, there'd be no problem?

  5. #65
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    Re: Who should PUBLIC tax payer funded school teacher evaluations be released to?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Employers have the right to see the evaluations of their employees. Releasing employee evaluations to their employers will not reduce teacher turnover. T
    Let's play a little game, shall we? Let's say that you are a bright, promising math student at a state college. It's your second semester of your freshman year, and you've got your major down to one of two options: Math Education, or simply Math. You're taking courses that count for both majors, but by the start of your sophomore year, you're going to need to make a choice. So which one are you going to choose? Well, you decide that it comes down to what the career options are. You way your options, and this is what you find:

    Career in Mathematics
    -Starting Salary: $50,000-$100,000, give or take, with plenty of room to grow
    -Opportunities for significant career advancement
    -Potential for developing brand-new inventions or ideas
    -Only have to deal with management and other professionals
    -Can always rely on support, so long as the work is done
    -Always in demand
    -Almost always respected in the corporate environment
    -Usually work at-will

    Career in Teaching Math
    -Starting Salary: $25,000-35,000, give or take, with a fixed, very slow rate of annual growth that may not even surpass inflation
    -Limited opportunities for career advancement
    -Has to submit to a host of standards and regulations, as well as the whims of the current school administration
    -Has to deal with disrespectful students and parents
    -Support is wildly inconsistent and often independent of actual performance
    -Always in demand, but politicians may choose to not let that demand be fulfilled
    -May often be disrespected in the work and the political environments
    -Hard to fire, but can be transferred or endlessly harassed for poor performance

    You tell me: If you were that student, which career choice would you make?

    And you wonder why we have "bad" teachers? Really? It's because schools get the leftovers. The best and brightest minds know better than to waste their potential teaching a bunch of brats that often don't want to learn, serving administrators that often don't support them, talking to parents that often despise them, and vulnerable to politicians that kick them around like soccer balls. And yet, somehow, someway, those "leftovers" actually pull themselves up by the bootstraps and get stuff done. Yeah, if there were ever a segment of society that has learned the hard way how to pull themselves up by the bootstraps, it ain't the superrich. It's the teachers. The fact that we have any education at ALL, however little you think we have, is almost entirely because of the iron will of the teachers. Were it not for them, we would have been gone a LONG time ago.

    And you don't think their work is visible enough. TROLOLOLOLOL! How 'bout you stop hunting and start LOOKING at what they've been doing all along!
    "A man you can bait with a tweet is not a man we can trust with nuclear weapons." --Hillary Rodham Clinton
    "Innocent until proven guilty is for criminal convictions, not elections." --Mitt Romney

  6. #66
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    Re: Who should PUBLIC tax payer funded school teacher evaluations be released to?

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    Let's play a little game...
    You've uncovered one of the least recognized major problems in American public education here. Until teaching becomes an appealing profession, there will be no incentive for anyone with the potential to be a great teacher to pursue a teaching career. Publicly visible performance reviews can only make that situation worse.
    "The enemy isnít conservatism. The enemy isnít liberalism. The enemy is bulls**t."

  7. #67
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    Re: Who should PUBLIC tax payer funded school teacher evaluations be released to?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wake View Post
    But if the literal evaluations are shown themselves, there'd be no problem?
    I've thought on this for a bit, and I've come to the conclusion that these evaluations should be open to relevant parties. School staff, district management, the parents of students who have legitimate concerns, so on, and so forth. Making these evaluations open to the public is of no benefit, and would likely cost the state more money.
    I love the NSA. It's like having a secret fan-base you will never see, but they're there, watching everything you write and it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that I may be some person's only form of unconstitutional entertainment one night.

  8. #68
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    Re: Who should PUBLIC tax payer funded school teacher evaluations be released to?

    That's a lot of options. I don't think it matters though. If they get terrible evals who will you replace them with? Who's going to evaluate them, the students who walk around telling each other how to vote? Or the admin that sits in on 1-2 classes a year? Until teachers are compensated comparably to the financial sector, don't expect our best and brightest to pursue teaching. Michelle Rhee tried to make some progress on getting the unions to give up tenure *for better pay* (unlike the douche in WI), but that one district doing so will not make a dent.

    This was different back when women could basically only teach if they wanted to enter the work force, but nowadays it's pretty much the case that a few students in every class would be more effective. Those same kids would be better off learning at home.

  9. #69
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    Re: Who should PUBLIC tax payer funded school teacher evaluations be released to?

    Being a public employee doesnt mean you give up all your rights to privacy or other privledges that ALL other americans enjoy.
    If Im a paying customer buying a product and SUPPORTING that company, should I have a right to all employee records I pay for them as much as any single tax payer pays for a public worker providing a service.
    The public doesnt have the right to ride roughshod over public employees because their tax payers....our money collectively is keeping ALL companies afloat and their employees....this ownership thing of public employees has gotten way out of control

  10. #70
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    Re: Who should PUBLIC tax payer funded school teacher evaluations be released to?

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    Let's play a little game, shall we? Let's say that you are a bright, promising math student at a state college. It's your second semester of your freshman year, and you've got your major down to one of two options: Math Education, or simply Math. You're taking courses that count for both majors, but by the start of your sophomore year, you're going to need to make a choice. So which one are you going to choose? Well, you decide that it comes down to what the career options are. You way your options, and this is what you find:

    Career in Mathematics
    -Starting Salary: $50,000-$100,000, give or take, with plenty of room to grow
    -Opportunities for significant career advancement
    -Potential for developing brand-new inventions or ideas
    -Only have to deal with management and other professionals
    -Can always rely on support, so long as the work is done
    -Always in demand
    -Almost always respected in the corporate environment
    -Usually work at-will

    Career in Teaching Math
    -Starting Salary: $25,000-35,000, give or take, with a fixed, very slow rate of annual growth that may not even surpass inflation
    -Limited opportunities for career advancement
    -Has to submit to a host of standards and regulations, as well as the whims of the current school administration
    -Has to deal with disrespectful students and parents
    -Support is wildly inconsistent and often independent of actual performance
    -Always in demand, but politicians may choose to not let that demand be fulfilled
    -May often be disrespected in the work and the political environments
    -Hard to fire, but can be transferred or endlessly harassed for poor performance

    You tell me: If you were that student, which career choice would you make?

    And you wonder why we have "bad" teachers? Really? It's because schools get the leftovers.
    You just made the same argument I have made many times about who we are attracting into our education majors / career fields. Let us see now if you get the same YOU MUST HATE AND LOATHE TEACHERS reaction that I do...

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