View Poll Results: Do you own yourself (self ownership)? Should or shouldnt you own yourself?

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  • Yes (should)

    37 74.00%
  • Yes (shouldn't)

    0 0%
  • No (should)

    4 8.00%
  • No (shouldn't)

    9 18.00%
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Thread: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

  1. #81
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    Mach's Avatar
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    In many groups, for example the Catholic Church, it is immoral to even take your own life. That doesn't sound like "exclusive right to use" to me.
    Suicide is not a normal circumstance. You didn't meet that criteria. Please try again if you think you have an argument, I'd be happy to take another look. It's not a cop-out, we should discuss normal circumstances because it makes sense to, because that's primarily what our laws are about. Of a meteor is going to hit tomorrow, all that **** goes out the window...I know that, you know what, so let's not debate the emergency exceptions because they cannot tell us about normal circumstnaces that we actually want to operate within.

    For arguments sake though, yes, the Catholic church does have some unethical rules! Notice in this case, a person can voluntarily choose to join and obey catholic rules, or not. Thus, right to life is preserved by the individual and relative to catholic ethics, it may indeed by unethical relative to catholics to break the rule you voluntarily agreed to. It happens so much they have a word for that too... "sin"

    Notice how it would be unethical if the catholic church claimed everyone must follow their rules *even if they don't agree to them*. What that would imply is that the catcholic church has the right to your life, and THEY may choose to loan it to you, or not. Which of course, is obviously unethical.

  2. #82
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    There is no creator, there are no inalienable rights. Try again.
    Prove it. When you state something in such a factual way then you must have proof. So prove it.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

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  3. #83
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    We don't want to be killed, therefore we recognize
    Yes, we recognize them! Then we "define them". Then, in some cases, we codify them. You contradict what you wrote earlier, that exist because society grants them.
    That's illogical...how would we recognized "observe" them, if they didn't already exist prior to society claiming they granted them?

    Lunch, more later.

  4. #84
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Prove it. When you state something in such a factual way then you must have proof. So prove it.
    Zero evidence to support either. There are no unicorns either.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

    Blog me! YouTube me! VidMe me!

  5. #85
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mach View Post
    That's absurd Cephus. For what reason would these individuals, who in your estimation are considered a "society", draw up such a "legal right" as right to life?
    You're not accepting that there is a reason why such a right is recognized, you're just stating that the legal right is granted by society.
    Mostly on account none of them want to get backshot any more than most of us do. Makes it hard to plan your day.

  6. #86
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mach View Post
    Yes, we recognize them! Then we "define them". Then, in some cases, we codify them. You contradict what you wrote earlier, that exist because society grants them.
    That's illogical...how would we recognized "observe" them, if they didn't already exist prior to society claiming they granted them?
    I never said we recognized rights, I said we recognized reciprocal responsibility. We don't want to be killed, therefore we don't kill others. Enlightened self-interest.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

    Blog me! YouTube me! VidMe me!

  7. #87
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Zero evidence to support either. There are no unicorns either.
    Lack of evidence =/= does not exist.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

  8. #88
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Lack of evidence =/= does not exist.
    I have a leprechaun farm I'd like to sell you.
    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I've never denied my own hackish tendencies
    Quote Originally Posted by Pin dÁr View Post
    scientific by itself isn't enough of course.
    Quote Originally Posted by blaxshep View Post
    Not all Nazis were bad people

  9. #89
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Lack of evidence =/= does not exist.
    Very true, but lack of evidence means absolutely no credible reason to think that it does.

    Or do you believe in absolutely ever cockamamie idea that comes down the pike because it just might possibly exist?
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  10. #90
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    I have a leprechaun farm I'd like to sell you.
    If you had such a thing then you would have proof of it...proof that you have it please! Don't forget the pictures and video of them carrying their pot-o-gold!

    Of course if you had such a thing then it still wouldn't mean that "lack of evidence =/= does not exist" is not correct.

    This didn't help you much now did it?
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

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