View Poll Results: Do you own yourself (self ownership)? Should or shouldnt you own yourself?

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  • Yes (should)

    37 74.00%
  • Yes (shouldn't)

    0 0%
  • No (should)

    4 8.00%
  • No (shouldn't)

    9 18.00%
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Thread: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

  1. #161
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    We also have dolts that argue in favor of social contracts while ignoring the understanding those agreeing to the initial social contract had to say about inalienable rights.
    And then we have dolts who think that just because someone believed something, that makes it so.

    You're wrong. Who cares what they had to say about inalienable rights? I care what they (and you) can prove.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    it seems rather then admit the obvious, they are essentially arguing for no ownership, meaning anybody with the power to control you, owns you from a practical standpoint.
    Is this like when people (usually libertarians) claim that natural rights are "obvious," but they really aren't?

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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lokiate View Post
    Of course I own myself. What man has such authority that he can own me, or any other person?
    Throughout history, people have owned each other commonly. Even today, there are millions of people who are owned by other people.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lokiate View Post
    Authority does not equate to ownership. Even if it did, authority is solely based on one granting another authority over them.
    This exactly. In this country, people are not property. I also do not believe that people are inherently property. Consequently, I do not believe that it is possible to own oneself. Therefore, when people have power or authority over others, they merely have power/authority, but never ownership. Therefore, to claim that believing in "no ownership" equates to allowing anyone to own you is false.

  5. #165
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    From what I gather, people cant be owned because people arent property. As a result it is impossible to own yourself? I do not have my own body, because my body cannot be mine, nor can it be anyone elses? I do not posses my own body or thoughts? How can this be the case?

  6. #166
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyBurns View Post
    From what I gather, people cant be owned because people arent property. As a result it is impossible to own yourself? I do not have my own body, because my body cannot be mine, nor can it be anyone elses? I do not posses my own body or thoughts? How can this be the case?
    As I said earlier:

    Do I own myself as far as being my own property? No, because I am not property.

    Do I own myself as far as having control/power over myself? I have as much control and power over myself as I think a human being can in a universe where autonomy is impossible.

    It depends on the definition of "own." If you're talking property, no ownership. If you're talking about possessing your own thoughts, yes.

  7. #167
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Throughout history, people have owned each other commonly. Even today, there are millions of people who are owned by other people.
    Human trafficking has no claim to authority since it's illegal.
    I love the NSA. It's like having a secret fan-base you will never see, but they're there, watching everything you write and it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that I may be some person's only form of unconstitutional entertainment one night.

  8. #168
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    As I said earlier:

    Do I own myself as far as being my own property? No, because I am not property.

    Do I own myself as far as having control/power over myself? I have as much control and power over myself as I think a human being can in a universe where autonomy is impossible.

    It depends on the definition of "own." If you're talking property, no ownership. If you're talking about possessing your own thoughts, yes.
    Or do your thoughts (e.g. your consciousness) "possess" your body?
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  9. #169
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    This exactly. In this country, people are not property. I also do not believe that people are inherently property. Consequently, I do not believe that it is possible to own oneself. Therefore, when people have power or authority over others, they merely have power/authority, but never ownership. Therefore, to claim that believing in "no ownership" equates to allowing anyone to own you is false.
    Self ownership is an archaic term based on 18-19th century sociopolitical philosophy. I take it to mean ownership of the person as an entity, not property by todays standards. By that I mean one can physically own a person (via slavery, indentured servitude, and/or contractual obligation, such as military service), but they cannot own what makes the person a [wo]man, and not an animated piece of meat. The mind, the intellect, the wants, etc of the individual. For example, the Army owned my physical self for four years, but they did not own "me". I was still my own person, subject to tell whoever to eat a dick at any time.
    I love the NSA. It's like having a secret fan-base you will never see, but they're there, watching everything you write and it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that I may be some person's only form of unconstitutional entertainment one night.

  10. #170
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    And then we have dolts who think that just because someone believed something, that makes it so.
    in a matter of contract law, the understanding of what they agreed to is what makes it so., perception is reality

    You're wrong. Who cares what they had to say about inalienable rights? I care what they (and you) can prove.
    we are dealing with contracts, not math theory.

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