View Poll Results: Do you own yourself (self ownership)? Should or shouldnt you own yourself?

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  • Yes (should)

    37 74.00%
  • Yes (shouldn't)

    0 0%
  • No (should)

    4 8.00%
  • No (shouldn't)

    9 18.00%
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Thread: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

  1. #91
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    MoSurveyor's Avatar
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mach View Post
    Suicide is not a normal circumstance. You didn't meet that criteria. Please try again if you think you have an argument, I'd be happy to take another look. It's not a cop-out, we should discuss normal circumstances because it makes sense to, because that's primarily what our laws are about. Of a meteor is going to hit tomorrow, all that **** goes out the window...I know that, you know what, so let's not debate the emergency exceptions because they cannot tell us about normal circumstnaces that we actually want to operate within.

    For arguments sake though, yes, the Catholic church does have some unethical rules! Notice in this case, a person can voluntarily choose to join and obey catholic rules, or not. Thus, right to life is preserved by the individual and relative to catholic ethics, it may indeed by unethical relative to catholics to break the rule you voluntarily agreed to. It happens so much they have a word for that too... "sin"

    Notice how it would be unethical if the catholic church claimed everyone must follow their rules *even if they don't agree to them*. What that would imply is that the catcholic church has the right to your life, and THEY may choose to loan it to you, or not. Which of course, is obviously unethical.
    Then your use of the term "normal circumstances" has contradicted the basic premise that ownership is an "exclusive right to use". Obviously, you've made it a conditional right to use.
    Mt. Rushmore: Three surveyors and some other guy.
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  2. #92
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    If you had such a thing then you would have proof of it...proof that you have it please! Don't forget the pictures and video of them carrying their pot-o-gold!

    Of course if you had such a thing then it still wouldn't mean that "lack of evidence =/= does not exist" is not correct.

    This didn't help you much now did it?
    There's no proof it doesn't exist therefore why not assume it does, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I've never denied my own hackish tendencies
    Quote Originally Posted by Pin dÁr View Post
    scientific by itself isn't enough of course.
    Quote Originally Posted by blaxshep View Post
    Not all Nazis were bad people

  3. #93
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    There's no proof it doesn't exist therefore why not assume it does, right?
    After all, he can't tell you it isn't real, can he?
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  4. #94
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Very true, but lack of evidence means absolutely no credible reason to think that it does.

    Or do you believe in absolutely ever cockamamie idea that comes down the pike because it just might possibly exist?
    Actually I do believe that anything is possible. Even if it is unlikely. But then again being possible =/= real either. So in the end lets just say that I sit on the fence for most things.

    For example if you had said that unicorns do not exist on this planet then I would have definitely agreed with you. But I would still consider the possibility that they do exist on another planet.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

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  5. #95
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    After all, he can't tell you it isn't real, can he?
    Thank you.
    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I've never denied my own hackish tendencies
    Quote Originally Posted by Pin dÁr View Post
    scientific by itself isn't enough of course.
    Quote Originally Posted by blaxshep View Post
    Not all Nazis were bad people

  6. #96
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    There's no proof it doesn't exist therefore why not assume it does, right?
    Ah but if you say that you have one I can request proof of it.

    See there is a difference between stating something as fact and stating something as a belief. When one states something as fact then requesting proof of the stated fact is acceptable. When one states something as a belief then no proof is necessary or required as it is based off of nothing more than ones own opinion. Ones opinion =/= fact.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

  7. #97
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Ah but if you say that you have one I can request proof of it.

    See there is a difference between stating something as fact and stating something as a belief. When one states something as fact then requesting proof of the stated fact is acceptable. When one states something as a belief then no proof is necessary or required as it is based off of nothing more than ones own opinion. Ones opinion =/= fact.
    What're beliefs based upon? Facts. Facts which have been questioned and have turned up rather empty. If your beliefs are based on facts which have been invalidated, is your belief not invalidated?
    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I've never denied my own hackish tendencies
    Quote Originally Posted by Pin dÁr View Post
    scientific by itself isn't enough of course.
    Quote Originally Posted by blaxshep View Post
    Not all Nazis were bad people

  8. #98
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    What're beliefs based upon? Facts.
    That would be science, not "belief"/"faith". When it comes to facts, science will always trump faith.
    Last edited by MoSurveyor; 06-18-12 at 02:12 PM.
    Mt. Rushmore: Three surveyors and some other guy.
    Life goes on within you and without you. -Harrison
    Hear the echoes of the centuries, Power isn't all that money buys. -Peart
    After you learn quantum mechanics you're never really the same again. -Weinberg

  9. #99
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    That would be science, not "belief"/"faith". When it comes to facts, science will always trump faith.
    Ken Ham and his flock would disagree.
    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I've never denied my own hackish tendencies
    Quote Originally Posted by Pin dÁr View Post
    scientific by itself isn't enough of course.
    Quote Originally Posted by blaxshep View Post
    Not all Nazis were bad people

  10. #100
    Only Losers H8 Capitalism
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    Re: Do you own yourself (self ownership)?

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    There's no proof it doesn't exist therefore why not assume it does, right?
    Because there is no such thing as proof that something doesn't exist, and by that standard you'd have to assume that everything for which there is no proof it doesn't exist, exists. Even the demonstrably false; which makes it a terrible standard for belief.
    Haymarket's "support" of the 2nd Amendment, a right he believes we never had.
    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    no. You cannot lose rights you do not have in the first place. There is no such thing as the right to have any weapon of your choice regardless of any other consideration. It simply does not exist.

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