View Poll Results: Who Was the Best US President?

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  • Abraham Lincoln

    15 14.15%
  • Franklin Roosevelt

    26 24.53%
  • George Washington

    10 9.43%
  • Thomas Jefferson

    9 8.49%
  • Theodore Roosevelt

    6 5.66%
  • Woodrow Wilson

    1 0.94%
  • Andrew Jackson

    2 1.89%
  • Harry Truman

    0 0%
  • Lyndon Johnson

    2 1.89%
  • Other (please list below)

    35 33.02%
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Thread: Best US President

  1. #231
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    Re: Best US President

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    yeah and the poor need plasma tvs cell phones etc that we pay for
    And corporations profit from........

  2. #232
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    Re: Best US President

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    Pardon me? I'm sure that's much of a counter argument.
    Well, many, maybe even most, folks on the right seem to have trouble dealing with concepts that are not simplistic absolutes. What you did there, for example, was heard redistribution of wealth and you assumed that must mean to absolutely equalize all wealth, which of course would be absurd. What we're actually talking about in the US in terms of poverty amelioration is less than half of one percent of our GDP. The countries that have essentially managed to eliminate poverty spend about 1% of their GDP on it. Nothing remotely like totally evening out all the money so everybody makes the same of course. But because you approached it in binary mode, you jumped to that assumption (if it isn't 0, it must be 1), and then reacted to that absurd notion instead of the actual concept we're discussing. Anyways, that is a longwinded explanation, but it happens all the time. Literally many times every single day. It is, by far, the biggest difficulty conservatives on a whole struggle with in debating these issues. If the right could just get over that one problem the whole world would take a massive step forwards. The end of bumperstickerism!
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

  3. #233
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Best US President

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    And corporations profit from........
    ask most corporate shareholders what they want-high taxes taken from THEM so the dems can buy votes of the poor and that the poor can buy stuff with our money, or a society where there are less dependents, less suckers of the public teat and less pimps in office

  4. #234
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    zgoldsmith23's Avatar
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    Re: Best US President

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    Well, many, maybe even most, folks on the right seem to have trouble dealing with concepts that are not simplistic absolutes. What you did there, for example, was heard redistribution of wealth and you assumed that must mean to absolutely equalize all wealth, which of course would be absurd. What we're actually talking about in the US in terms of poverty amelioration is less than half of one percent of our GDP. The countries that have essentially managed to eliminate poverty spend about 1% of their GDP on it. Nothing remotely like totally evening out all the money so everybody makes the same of course. But because you approached it in binary mode, you jumped to that assumption (if it isn't 0, it must be 1), and then reacted to that absurd notion instead of the actual concept we're discussing. Anyways, that is a longwinded explanation, but it happens all the time. Literally many times every single day. It is, by far, the biggest difficulty conservatives on a whole struggle with in debating these issues. If the right could just get over that one problem the whole world would take a massive step forwards. The end of bumperstickerism!
    If everybody is rich, nobody is rich.
    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I've never denied my own hackish tendencies
    Quote Originally Posted by Pin dÁr View Post
    scientific by itself isn't enough of course.
    Quote Originally Posted by blaxshep View Post
    Not all Nazis were bad people

  5. #235
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Best US President

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    Well, many, maybe even most, folks on the right seem to have trouble dealing with concepts that are not simplistic absolutes. What you did there, for example, was heard redistribution of wealth and you assumed that must mean to absolutely equalize all wealth, which of course would be absurd. What we're actually talking about in the US in terms of poverty amelioration is less than half of one percent of our GDP. The countries that have essentially managed to eliminate poverty spend about 1% of their GDP on it. Nothing remotely like totally evening out all the money so everybody makes the same of course. But because you approached it in binary mode, you jumped to that assumption (if it isn't 0, it must be 1), and then reacted to that absurd notion instead of the actual concept we're discussing. Anyways, that is a longwinded explanation, but it happens all the time. Literally many times every single day. It is, by far, the biggest difficulty conservatives on a whole struggle with in debating these issues. If the right could just get over that one problem the whole world would take a massive step forwards. The end of bumperstickerism!
    nothing gets older than those who constantly demand more government and more wealth redistribution assuming airs that those of us who don't buy into your assumptions and welfare socialist cravings are somehow less intelligent than you are.

    I realize that part of the myth that liberalism depends on is that elite libs are so much smarter than the masses that the elite must be given the power to run the lives of the benighted.

    You can call this crap poverty amelioration but the fact remains we spend a lot more than 1 percent on handouts and that includes all the crap that the indolent middle class has come to expect-such as paying artificially low federal income taxes for the stuff they demand.

    the fact is, we have too much government

    we have too many people who expect too much from government

    and far too many people who expect others to pay for what they want from government

  6. #236
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    Re: Best US President

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    ask most corporate shareholders what they want-high taxes taken from THEM so the dems can buy votes of the poor and that the poor can buy stuff with our money, or a society where there are less dependents, less suckers of the public teat and less pimps in office

    Or you ask them if they want to see profits decline

  7. #237
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    Re: Best US President

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    Or you ask them if they want to see profits decline
    Well, the problem is we won't even ask them. The government decides for them. (Hint: PROBLEM!)
    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I've never denied my own hackish tendencies
    Quote Originally Posted by Pin dÁr View Post
    scientific by itself isn't enough of course.
    Quote Originally Posted by blaxshep View Post
    Not all Nazis were bad people

  8. #238
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Best US President

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    Or you ask them if they want to see profits decline
    profits would be better if we had far less government interference

  9. #239
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    Re: Best US President

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    You can call this crap poverty amelioration but the fact remains we spend a lot more than 1 percent on handouts and that includes all the crap that the indolent middle class has come to expect-such as paying artificially low federal income taxes for the stuff they demand.
    And just exactly what stuff is that TD?

  10. #240
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    Re: Best US President

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    Well, the problem is we won't even ask them. The government decides for them. (Hint: PROBLEM!)
    Government decides what shareholders want?

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