View Poll Results: Last two years beginning of a downward slide for Public Sector Unions?

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  • Yes, their power has waxed and now it shall wane.

    44 60.27%
  • Unions will respond and their power will grow.

    14 19.18%
  • It depends on November.

    15 20.55%
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Thread: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

  1. #141
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by lpast View Post
    Yeah your right the entire federal deficit and all the states woes are ALL the fault of public sector unions....CPwill heres the TRUTH the rich have raped public sector workers and put it all right in their pocket....the rich literally HATE that they cant control public worker unions and steal from them...so they started this class warfare between public and private sector workers...and in the end the private sector workers are going to get even Less then they are now...MORONS...they will wake up but it will be too late for them, they will have been stripped of everything especially their dignity.
    All the proof of that is right in front of t heir eyes...they'd just rather believe koch Brother super pac attack ads...
    I wonder who they'll blame when the Unions are gone and there's still deficits? Oh wait, I know who it'll be...


    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    This issue has been plowed more times than Paris Hilton.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oborosen View Post
    Too bad we have to observe human rights.

  2. #142
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Centinel View Post
    Regarding the bolded above, why does this have to be? Each contract with an employer could simply apply to those covered under the contract, with other employees being covered under their own employment contracts.
    I don't know why it has to be, but that it is. Perhaps it is because it is easier for the employer. But I really don't know.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  3. #143
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I don't know why it has to be, but that it is. Perhaps it is because it is easier for the employer. But I really don't know.
    It is because of the National Labor Relations Act signed by FDR. It lays out the rights of unions and such, but includes rights for all employees. Basically, you can't discriminate against an employee who is not in a union. In many cases certain employees/positions of certain organizations are not allowed/invited/eligible to join a union. If that's the case the employer is not allowed to terminate or withhold benefits they grant to other employees simply because they are not in the union. This is applies whether it is by choice or not. However, in many cases such as teacher's unions, opting out of the union doesn't mean you can opt out of paying your dues. In many cases you still legally have to pay 85-90% of the union dues anyway and you lose the added benefits. For example, if your union dues are $1000 annually and you opt out of the union the State will still garnish your pay and give $850 to the union anyway. But if you need representation for unlawful termination or some other employment disagreement the union will not support you. They will simply take your money and leave you high and dry. It's also interesting to note that in most school districts the union leaders have "teacher contracts," but they do not teach. The taxpayers are paying them a full teacher's salary to simply manage union business. The union collects dues which they spend on lawyers, marketers, lobbyists, political donations, etc, but they do not pay for their employees to run their union. The taxpayers are typically on the hook to pay teachers to not teach. A VERY small amount of the dues collected actually go to political funds. If you look at top political donors in America public unions, specifically teacher's unions are the largest donors of funds.

    Top All-Time Donors, 1989-2012 | OpenSecrets

    If you add up just the National Education Association (NEA) and American Federation of Teachers (AFT) it adds up to more than any other donor in the nation. This is how they receive such preferential treatment in our nation. These are private political organizations who have managed to coerce the state government to garnish the wages of public employees and fund their political engine. Imagine if to become a garbage collector you had to be a card carrying member of the NRA and the state garnished your pay $1,000 annually and handed it over to that private political group. The idea would likely sound insane, but that is exactly what happens with public unions. The fact that so many people are up in arms over the idea of giving employees the freedom to choose whether they want to be associated with a political organization is ridiculous as far as I'm concerned. In the name of "employee rights" they are trampling on a basic human/American right of freedom of association. It has been going on for so long that people don't even realize what it is they're doing.

  4. #144
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by rocket88 View Post
    The problem is that it's then the same as no unions. Unions only work if the workers are united. That's why the "Divided Auto Workers" doesn't have any power at all.
    So those workers who wish to have power will join a union, and those who don't won't. Or they'll join a better union. Choice is good, no?

  5. #145
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I don't know why it has to be, but that it is. Perhaps it is because it is easier for the employer. But I really don't know.
    I don't either. It bears looking into.

  6. #146
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    The notion that the richest country in the world can't afford to pay working class people normal wages, while we give hundreds of billions or even trillions in tax giveaways to the super rich, is just disgusting. Some people just plain don't have the basic moral values that we should be able to take for granted.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

  7. #147
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    The notion that the richest country in the world can't afford to pay working class people normal wages, while we give hundreds of billions or even trillions in tax giveaways to the super rich, is just disgusting. Some people just plain don't have the basic moral values that we should be able to take for granted.

    more idiotic class envy nonsense. We don't GIVE the super rich anything. They pay more taxes in a month than all the union members do in a year. We cannot afford to pay 40 dollars an hour for labor when equally skilled Indians, Chinese, or Sri Lankians can do the same job for 15 an hour. Companies that pay overpriced wages lose to those that do not

  8. #148
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    more idiotic class envy nonsense. We don't GIVE the super rich anything.
    Of course we do lol. Where did you think they got that money from? They skim off other people's labor or purchases. Obviously you already understood that...

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    We cannot afford to pay 40 dollars an hour for labor when equally skilled Indians, Chinese, or Sri Lankians can do the same job for 15 an hour. Companies that pay overpriced wages lose to those that do not
    Fundamentally TD, you just are not on the same team as the American people.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

  9. #149
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    Of course we do lol. Where did you think they got that money from? They skim off other people's labor or purchases. Obviously you already understood that...



    Fundamentally TD, you just are not on the same team as the American people.
    AH more marxist idiocy. You contract with someone, pay them an agreed wage and if you profit you somehow rip them off.

    I am on the team of reality. Your short term solutions are long term disasters.

  10. #150
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    AH more marxist idiocy. You contract with someone, pay them an agreed wage and if you profit you somehow rip them off.
    I didn't say anything about ripping anybody off. Obviously you understand that rich people get their money from society, so I'm not really sure what we're debating here.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

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