View Poll Results: Last two years beginning of a downward slide for Public Sector Unions?

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  • Yes, their power has waxed and now it shall wane.

    44 60.27%
  • Unions will respond and their power will grow.

    14 19.18%
  • It depends on November.

    15 20.55%
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Thread: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

  1. #1121
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    ASSERTIONS!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

    Are you denying the reality of the US Department of Labor statistics?
    No - explicitly I am saying let's take them as true. Is there a particular reason you are avoiding the follow-on question?

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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    No - explicitly I am saying let's take them as true. Is there a particular reason you are avoiding the follow-on question?
    Are they true or are they not true?

    Do I need a tenth grade Econ text which tells me the theory of supply and demand to answer that or are you going to present real world facts and figures which further your point?
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    I would just like to hear what you think the answer is. When price increases, what happens to demand?

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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    I would just like to hear what you think the answer is. When price increases, what happens to demand?
    I imagine it would depend greatly upon many other factors.
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    There is nothing to wonder about, its because the GOP doesn't want to end the tax breaks for outsourcing.
    What, exactly, are these supposed tax breaks? When were they crafted? And why werent they ended when dems ran the congress?

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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Forget about you and forget about me. The facts are simple and undeniable:

    1- Workers in unionized states earn more money than workers in non union RTW states.

    2- Workers in unionized states have better insurance benefit coverage that workers in non RTW union states.

    3- Workers in unionized states have better pension coverage levels that workers in non union RTW states.
    1. Not if you adjust for costs, then RTW states earns more, which is my point.

    2 and 3. True, but it doesn't surprise me really. I mean Mississippi would have been broken no matter if they had right to work or not. However, non-RTW sates are mostly historically successful states, such as California, and states in New England.

    Call me all the silly names you feel you need to. It makes no difference to me as none of that grade school nonsense changes those three facts.
    Except I never denied those facts. If you want to discuss if RTW benefits a state or not, I have no problem with that.

    But we did not discuss that. We were discussing my point, that RTW states earn more adjusted for costs. Then you posted a study that you were unable to defend, but still demanded me to accept all its findings. When I said no, you need to defend it. Then you got mad, and even start lying about what you did, like in the last post.

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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Forget about you and forget about me. The facts are simple and undeniable:

    1- Workers in unionized states earn more money than workers in non union RTW states.

    2- Workers in unionized states have better insurance benefit coverage that workers in non RTW union states.

    3- Workers in unionized states have better pension coverage levels that workers in non union RTW states.

    Call me all the silly names you feel you need to. It makes no difference to me as none of that grade school nonsense changes those three facts.

    You do NOT need the Dr. Lafer study to be informed about reality. The information is available from the official US government figures as well:
    You are associating wealth and financial well-being with income when wealth is really more closely associated with what things cost than what you earn. The minimum wage, for example has more than doubled since when I first earned it back in the late '70s. I could afford more with the $2.65 per hour I earned back then than a person could today making $7.25. Inflation is what has destroyed buying power and weakened the middle class. And inflation is the result of government policy, not evil industry.

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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Camlon View Post
    1. Not if you adjust for costs, then RTW states earns more, which is my point.
    WAIT A DING DONG MINUTE!!!!!

    You - you - not me - you are the one who does not want to make any adjustments or considerations for any variables. You get all bent out of shape and start calling names when a study does indeed attempt to make adjustments for real world differences.

    It seems you both want your cake and eat it to.
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    I imagine it would depend greatly upon many other factors.
    we'll think meta here. All other factors being equal.

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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    WAIT A DING DONG MINUTE!!!!!

    You - you - not me - you are the one who does not want to make any adjustments or considerations for any variables. You get all bent out of shape and start calling names when a study does indeed attempt to make adjustments for real world differences.

    It seems you both want your cake and eat it to.
    No, that is just your dumb misunderstanding of what I want.

    What I do is to specify an aim, and do what is required to reach that aim. I want to compare what the average wage is adjusted for costs. That means, living standards. I am not interested in checking what an equivalent worker would earn in each state.

    How many times do I have to tell you this before it penetrates your thick skull.

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