View Poll Results: Last two years beginning of a downward slide for Public Sector Unions?

Voters
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  • Yes, their power has waxed and now it shall wane.

    44 60.27%
  • Unions will respond and their power will grow.

    14 19.18%
  • It depends on November.

    15 20.55%
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Thread: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

  1. #1111
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Centinel View Post
    What sorts of problems do you see being created by larger businesses?
    Why lower prices. Greater selection. More convenient locations. Those type of problems.

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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Centinel View Post
    What sorts of problems do you see being created by larger businesses?
    apparently small businesses are only morally acceptable so long as they aren't... you know, too successful.

  3. #1113
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Who said they would be? You are trying to create a strawman.
    No, no, no... You are removing responsibility from both the politician and the voters. the only way your senario works is if union members are a clear majority, and they come out and vote. Otherwise, it doesn't hold water. I'm trying to get you to realistically follow your own logic.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    I have been defending the study......
    Liar.

    I hope you haven't forgotten how you first choose to not respond 5 times, and to get you to respond I had to make it bold and increase the text size by 5 times. Then when you finally responded you said that you couldn't respond to the criticism of the study because you are not the professor.

    But go ahead prove me wrong. Last time you tried to get away with this lie, I asked you to quote yourself. You didn't follow up. If you have forgotten. My criticism of his study revolved around his cherrypicking of a few states and ignoring the rest, and that he said there was no correlation when his data did show a correlation.

    So I attempted to get you away from your beloved right to work and show you a different example using the grocery store but apparently you are not up to the intellectual task of being able to make that mental leap.
    I already told you why I didn't care much about your dumb grocery example. I reject your study, because I gave it criticism, and you failed to defend it. Your grocery example is based on the belief that I think your study is comparing apples to apples. Which I don't.

    Also, the reason I have to repeat myself is because you are not responding to what I write. If you state the same argument over again, then why do you expect me to give you another response?
    Last edited by Camlon; 06-16-12 at 01:05 AM.

  5. #1115
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by johnny_rebson View Post
    And you wonder why we're sending blue collar jobs to China as fast as we can.
    There is nothing to wonder about, its because the GOP doesn't want to end the tax breaks for outsourcing.

    Why should they? The rich here are the most wealthy they have been in 50 years. Things are going great for the rich. Not so much for the working class who's jobs were outsourced.
    Last edited by Catawba; 06-16-12 at 02:47 AM.
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, no, no... You are removing responsibility from both the politician and the voters. the only way your senario works is if union members are a clear majority, and they come out and vote. Otherwise, it doesn't hold water. I'm trying to get you to realistically follow your own logic.
    Exactly, I've read that only 11% of the population belongs to a union (and that includes both public and private unions). It is laughable for someone to say they are the cause of our economic problems.

    But, hey it makes a great distraction for those who focus on shiny objects.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  7. #1117
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, no, no... You are removing responsibility from both the politician and the voters
    Politicians represent who is responsible for them winning elections. Sometimes you get individuals who are willing to instead support a vague idea of "the public interest", but they tend to be replaced over time with those who more accurately recognize and serve their benefactors.

    Public Unions are lately responsible for many won and lost elections at the State and Local level. Those politicians know this, and respond accordingly.

    YOU are trying to divert to some kind of mythical theory land wherein interest groups do not exist.

    the only way your senario works is if union members are a clear majority, and they come out and vote
    Actually it works if public union members are greater than the difference in the votes. Which, if you will recall, I pointed out to you several pages back is often enough the case.


    But I find it hilarious in order to defend yourself you have to claim that public unions have no political power.

    Gosh, sure seems like they've been wasting alot of money and effort over the years .

  8. #1118
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Camlon View Post
    Liar.
    you are a simpleton.


    Forget about you and forget about me. The facts are simple and undeniable:

    1- Workers in unionized states earn more money than workers in non union RTW states.

    2- Workers in unionized states have better insurance benefit coverage that workers in non RTW union states.

    3- Workers in unionized states have better pension coverage levels that workers in non union RTW states.

    Call me all the silly names you feel you need to. It makes no difference to me as none of that grade school nonsense changes those three facts.

    You do NOT need the Dr. Lafer study to be informed about reality. The information is available from the official US government figures as well:

    The United States Department of Labor, Bureau of Labor Statistics, Occupational Employment Statistics, May 2011 Occupational Employment and Wages Estimates http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oessrcst.htm , shows median hourly wages of all 22 Right to Work States (RTW) and all 28 Collective-Bargaining States (CBS) as follows:
    CBS all occupations average $16.89
    RTW all occupations average $15.31 a difference of $1.58 an hour (-9.4%)
    Last edited by haymarket; 06-16-12 at 08:05 AM.
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  9. #1119
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Forget about you and forget about me. The facts are simple and undeniable:

    1- Workers in unionized states earn more money than workers in non union RTW states.

    2- Workers in unionized states have better insurance benefit coverage that workers in non RTW union states.

    3- Workers in unionized states have better pension coverage levels that workers in non union RTW states.

    Call me all the silly names you feel you need to. It makes no difference to me as none of that grade school nonsense changes those three facts.
    hm. well okay, for the moment let's take your assertions as true.

    When you raise the price of something, what happens to demand for it?

  10. #1120
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    Re: Beginning of the End for Public Unions?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    hm. well okay, for the moment let's take your assertions as true.
    ASSERTIONS!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

    Are you denying the reality of the US Department of Labor statistics?
    __________________________________________________ _
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