View Poll Results: On a scale of one to ten, how much does it matter?

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  • 1 (least important)

    21 32.31%
  • 2

    3 4.62%
  • 3

    3 4.62%
  • 4

    2 3.08%
  • 5

    3 4.62%
  • 6

    3 4.62%
  • 7

    7 10.77%
  • 8

    10 15.38%
  • 9

    3 4.62%
  • 10 (most important)

    10 15.38%
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Thread: How important do you consider the issue of gay marriage?

  1. #91
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    Re: How important do you consider the issue of gay marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Centinel View Post
    Thank you for explaining. I can understand how, given their interpretation, the scotus would see the federal government having authority in state marriage laws.
    It's not just marriage laws.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  2. #92
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    Re: How important do you consider the issue of gay marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    It's not just marriage laws.
    Understood. Not just marriage laws.

  3. #93
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    Re: How important do you consider the issue of gay marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Centinel View Post
    Understood. Not just marriage laws.
    I support State's rights, but I also support that all States have to adhere to the Constitution. Do you agree or disagree?

  4. #94
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    Re: How important do you consider the issue of gay marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Centinel View Post
    "No State shall...deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but this phrase doesn't appear to limit the legislative options of the people of the states. It seems to merely be saying that whatever laws are passed must be applied equally to all people and not selectively enforced or ignored.
    SCOTUS does not share this interpretation. Not only must laws be applied equally, they must treat people equally. There are legal protections and rights that are denied to same-sex couples. For example, a spouse cannot be compelled to testify against their partner. Medical power of attorney, hospital visitation, inheritance of property, child custody, it goes on and on.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
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    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: How important do you consider the issue of gay marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rising Sun View Post
    I support State's rights, but I also support that all States have to adhere to the Constitution. Do you agree or disagree?
    I agree. The constitution is the supreme law of the land.

  6. #96
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    Re: How important do you consider the issue of gay marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    SCOTUS does not share this interpretation. Not only must laws be applied equally, they must treat people equally. There are legal protections and rights that are denied to same-sex couples. For example, a spouse cannot be compelled to testify against their partner. Medical power of attorney, hospital visitation, inheritance of property, child custody, it goes on and on.
    Yes, rising sun explained to the scotus' opinion on this issue.

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    Re: How important do you consider the issue of gay marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Centinel View Post
    The constitution is the supreme law of the land.
    Agreed. This is why I rated the issue an 8 on the poll. While I think national debt/budget deficit and military involvements/WOT are higher priority, protecting the rights of American citizens is very important too. On a related issue, I'm not happy with those parts of the Patriot Act which side-step the rights of American citizens.

  8. #98
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    Re: How important do you consider the issue of gay marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Centinel View Post
    "No State shall...deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but this phrase doesn't appear to limit the legislative options of the people of the states. It seems to merely be saying that whatever laws are passed must be applied equally to all people and not selectively enforced or ignored.
    While I agree with Rougenuke's position overall, since the SCOTUS hasn't ruled on anything dealing with SSM yet, the interpretation could still be held at the lower courts, and has I believe, that per the 14th amendment that homosexuals have equal right under the law to marry the opposite gender. "Similarly situated" leaves a lot open to interpretation. Granted as she pointed out with the interracial marriage they have struck it down, but until they did that I'm willing to bet a lot of lower courts said the same thing about interracial marriage under the 14th as they are now about SSM.

  9. #99
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    Re: How important do you consider the issue of gay marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    While I agree with Rougenuke's position overall, since the SCOTUS hasn't ruled on anything dealing with SSM yet, the interpretation could still be held at the lower courts, and has I believe, that per the 14th amendment that homosexuals have equal right under the law to marry the opposite gender. "Similarly situated" leaves a lot open to interpretation. Granted as she pointed out with the interracial marriage they have struck it down, but until they did that I'm willing to bet a lot of lower courts said the same thing about interracial marriage under the 14th as they are now about SSM.
    This depends on what you are talking about when it comes to "lower court rulings", particularly in the last year or so. The lower courts have ruled in favor of denying same sex marriage as violating the 14th Amendment in the last year or so.

    And I believe the ruling on DOMA was wrong when it comes to state's rights being why the federal government can't define marriage. It is a violation of the 14th, whether it is the state governments doing it or the federal government doing it and ruling that it is a state's right to define marriage could definitely harm the ability to rule to rightfully strike down other states' same sex marriage bans. I really hope the SCOTUS rules that DOMA does in fact violate the 14th, rather than on state's rights.

    No one can deny that if the laws said "no homosexual can legally get married", then it would automatically be struck down as unconstitutional, but because the restriction is based on sex/gender, not sexual orientation, then people feel that it isn't a violation. It doesn't really make since. People in jail with no idea when they may be released were granted equal protection to marriage by the SCOTUS.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  10. #100
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    Re: How important do you consider the issue of gay marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    This depends on what you are talking about when it comes to "lower court rulings", particularly in the last year or so. The lower courts have ruled in favor of denying same sex marriage as violating the 14th Amendment in the last year or so.

    And I believe the ruling on DOMA was wrong when it comes to state's rights being why the federal government can't define marriage. It is a violation of the 14th, whether it is the state governments doing it or the federal government doing it and ruling that it is a state's right to define marriage could definitely harm the ability to rule to rightfully strike down other states' same sex marriage bans. I really hope the SCOTUS rules that DOMA does in fact violate the 14th, rather than on state's rights.

    No one can deny that if the laws said "no homosexual can legally get married", then it would automatically be struck down as unconstitutional, but because the restriction is based on sex/gender, not sexual orientation, then people feel that it isn't a violation. It doesn't really make since. People in jail with no idea when they may be released were granted equal protection to marriage by the SCOTUS.
    OK first I'm going to reword the bolded part to see if I understand you correctly because I saw at least two different way that could have been taken. Are you saying, "The lower courts have ruled that denying same sex marriage violates the 14th admendment" or are you saying that "The violation of the 14th admendment comes from the lower courts ruling in favor of denying same sex marriages"?

    Not I am admittedly not up on all the various lower court rulings, but to the best of my recollection, there have been courts that have upheld bans and ones that have struck them down. Now maybe all the ones that have cited the 14th admendment have been ones to strike the bans down, I don't know. All I am saying is that one interpertation can be, as I have heard from anti-SSM proponents, that when marriage is defined legally as the union between a man and a woman, then that definition can be applied equally to all people. That is a homosexual man is just as equally able to get married to a woman as a straight man is. And I know the argument that a woman of any type is then not able to be married to a woman. But that doesn't fit the legal definition.

    I know there is more I want to say here, and I could probably get the point I am trying to make out better in a verbal debate....but well DP is what it is. Hopefully in our back and forth I can coax it out better.

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