View Poll Results: Should Uninformed Citizens Vote?

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  • No

    44 75.86%
  • Yes

    14 24.14%
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Thread: Should Uninformed Citizens Vote?

  1. #71
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    Re: Should Uninformed Citizens Vote?

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    People who advocate tying voting to property ownership are really only trying to artificially skew the results in their favor. For the most part, they know that property owners are more likely to be and think like them, and that they'd get what they want as a result.

    Not really surprising if you understand base human nature, but still intellectually dishonest.
    It's not dishonest. Those with property are most concerned with preserving the value of that property, whether it be land, capital, etc. In this way, those with land are trying to preserve the production apparatus of this country. Those without property do not care, and so can vote to dismantle that property (and pretty much have done so what with the income tax, capital gains tax, corporate tax, Federal Reserve, etc.). In the best interest of wealth, you want to preserve production, and if you must allow voting, you must only allow those to vote whom you know will preserve that productive capacity.
    ...will vote like you. Thank you for confirming my point.
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    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

  2. #72
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    Re: Should Uninformed Citizens Vote?

    Of course they should. We can't have an election with only four voters.
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

  3. #73
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    Re: Should Uninformed Citizens Vote?

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnWOlin View Post
    Honestly no. Here is what I believe in all sincerity. You should be able to look at a questionaire and answer three simply questions:

    -Which of these a, b, c answers is the "Pledge of Allegiance"
    -Which of these a, b, c answers is the current president?
    -Which of these a, b, c answers is how many states are in the union?

    If you cannot answer all those questions you should not get to vote.
    I have said basically the same thing should apply here where I live. Ridiculously easy questions that anyone should be able to answer and failure to do so indicates you care too little about your country to know the most basic facts about it.
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  4. #74
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    Re: Should Uninformed Citizens Vote?

    Americans should have a licence to vote.

    We recognize that a moving vehicle is dangerous. It can cause damage to property and kill. Therefore, we force sixteen year olds to study and pass a test in order to appreciate the privelege. We ensure that there is at least a minimum amount of time is spent establishing the notion that society is trusting this individual.

    We recognize that a gun is dangerous. It can be used to torture and kill. Therefore we force permit holders to attend a class. They are forced to appreciate the power they hold in their hands and we establish a minimum training requirement with background checks. Even hunters teach their young sons what end the pellets come out of.

    However, we have a twisted attitude about voting. We assume to give the dumbest individual between Hawaii and Main the right to vote for simply having an eighteenth birthday and breathing oxygen. Internally, the governor, senator, etc. dictates policy and guides society. He/she assumes to be the voice for the masses. He/she spends legally stolen money out of our hard earned pay checks (tax dollars) on projects that may or may not benefit anybody. Externally, the American president leads the free world. The entire world hinges on his speeches and our allies constantly look to us for guidance. We have the power to lead the world into war and peace as we see fit. We have the power to elect individuals who provide just the right promise (or bull****) that takes global events in opposite directions.

    We can acknowledge all the power that "we the people" have......yet provide no basis of testing that would ensure society that the individual in the booth even knows the difference between a Democrat and a Republican. Too many of our young voters know nothing about what he/she believes in, but they can tell you all about what their parents think and how cool their University professors are.

    It seems to me that voting is far more a dangerous game than driving a car. Perhaps we would have far fewer dip****s in Washington if we had far fewer dip****s in booths.
    Last edited by MSgt; 06-04-12 at 05:27 PM.

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  5. #75
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    Re: Should Uninformed Citizens Vote?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Which goes back to my earlier point, how would we construct an objective measurement? Especially given that political issues are always changing.
    2 Simple questions.

    Is Obama a Kenyan Muslim?
    Does Mitt Romney hate poor people?

    Answering yes, to either of these questions, would disqualify you from voting.
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  6. #76
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    Re: Should Uninformed Citizens Vote?

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    As if we don't have an oligarchy now whereby those with wealth and power solidify their position through the government? Well, I shouldn't be so general, as there is a difference between those who earned their wealth and those who abused government to do it.
    Which is why voting should be more populist, not less.

    And why I advocate a method to pass federal law via referendum.

    Let the people themselves the chance to write legisalation so that we can get laws in place that won't be blocked by wealthy people paying campaign contributions to our Congressmen.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

  7. #77
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    Re: Should Uninformed Citizens Vote?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    The term issues of the day certainly morphs from one person to the next but it always exists.
    And still doesn't change anything, because it doesn't matter.



    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    This is not how intelligence works.
    There you go, doing it again.
    Your answer does not follow.
    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    You do realize that raw intelligence and applied intelligence are different concepts, right?
    You do realize that both can be tested right?
    If a person doesn't have reasoning skills, they aren't going to be able to reason out who is best to vote for.
    This is not how intelligence works.
    I have already indicated that applied intelligence does not matter.
    Reasoning does.
    Even though both can be tested (yes, it does work that way), reasoning is what matters.

    As indicated from my previous answer.

    You do realize that both can be tested right?
    If a person doesn't have reasoning skills, they aren't going to be able to reason out who is best to vote for.



    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    People will always use subjective measures of value in determining these things, which goes back to my original question.

    Whats the standard?
    Why are you asking a question when the information was already provided?
    It is like you purposely engage in a circular thought process.
    "... they could require a certain score/combined even, from something like the Military ASVAB, ACT or SAT."



    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Than you should study human behavior, because this is not how people work in large groups.
    My favorite introductory course material was the "Social Animal". I even got my mother to read it.
    But your point is nonsense. This is about setting a standard and what standards they would be.

  8. #78
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    Re: Should Uninformed Citizens Vote?

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    It's not dishonest. Those with property are most concerned with preserving the value of that property, whether it be land, capital, etc. In this way, those with land are trying to preserve the production apparatus of this country. Those without property do not care, and so can vote to dismantle that property (and pretty much have done so what with the income tax, capital gains tax, corporate tax, Federal Reserve, etc.). In the best interest of wealth, you want to preserve production, and if you must allow voting, you must only allow those to vote whom you know will preserve that productive capacity.
    Except a government's sole concern is not production - rather, it also includes the well-being of its citizenry. And shareholders in a company are not inherently concerned with the well-being of the people. Rather, corporations are more concerned with generating profit - even at the cost it incurs to their employees and consumers.

    Which is why it is totally unethical to develop a government system based on corporations.

    After all, that was how the Republic of Rome was organized and it suffered civil war after civil war.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

  9. #79
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    Re: Should Uninformed Citizens Vote?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    Which is why voting should be more populist, not less.

    And why I advocate a method to pass federal law via referendum.

    Let the people themselves the chance to write legisalation so that we can get laws in place that won't be blocked by wealthy people paying campaign contributions to our Congressmen.
    No. Oh, God, please no.

    Referendum is such an attractive idea on paper, but then you look at places like California and you realize that a great majority of their deep problems are precisely due to referendum.
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

  10. #80
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    Re: Should Uninformed Citizens Vote?

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    Americans should have a licence to vote.

    We recognize that a moving vehicle is dangerous. It can cause damage to property and kill. Therefore, we force sixteen year olds to study and pass a test in order to appreciate the privelege. We ensure that there is at least a minimum amount of time is spent establishing the notion that society is trusting this individual.

    We recognize that a gun is dangerous. It can be used to torture and kill. Therefore we force permit holders to attend a class. They are forced to appreciate the power they hold in their hands and we establish a minimum training requirement with background checks. Even hunters teach their young sons what end the pellets come out of.

    However, we have a twisted attitude about voting. We assume to give the dumbest individual between Hawaii and Main the right to vote for simply having an eighteenth birthday and breathing oxygen. Internally, the governor, senator, etc. dictates policy and guides society. He/she assumes to be the voice for the masses. He/she spends legally stolen money out of our hard earned pay checks (tax dollars) on projects that may or may not benefit anybody. Externally, the American president leads the free world. The entire world hinges on his speeches and our allies constantly look to us for guidance. We have the power to lead the world into war and peace as we see fit. We have the power to elect individuals who provide just the right promise (or bull****) that takes global events in opposite directions.

    We can acknowledge all the power that "we the people" have......yet provide no basis of testing that would ensure society that the individual in the booth even knows the difference between a Democrat and a Republican. Too many of our young voters know nothing about what he/she believes in, but they can tell you all about what their parents think and how cool their University professors are.

    It seems to me that voting is far more a dangerous game than driving a car. Perhaps we would have far fewer dip****s in Washington if we had far fewer dip****s in booths.
    If we're going to require licenses to vote, then I also want a license to be a parent, because I think that's the most dangerous thing in this world for a person to do.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

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