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The Need for Regulation: Fighting the Obesity Epidemic

What do you think we should do about the Obesity Epidemic?


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You say that you lack empathy for those that choose to destroy their lives. Ok. What about those that don't choose to destroy their lives?
Give an example, and I'll tell you what I think.

And you may have a responsibility as an American to make your opinion known and oppose or support a political issue. But you don't have a responsibility or a right to tell people what they can put in their own mouths.
Show me where I did. They can eat whatever the hell they want, just don't expect me to support government footing the bill for bailing them out. If they don't want to be fat anymore, they know what to do.
 
Missed that by Wake, but I don't believe the Constitution is at play here. When what you do ultimately leads to costs picked up by others, a user few is appropriate. In this regard, cost, it is govenment's interests, both state and federal.

Really...Lets put this shoe on the other foot. How about we charge people that are active and out doing things an extra tax for mountain climbing? Bungee jumping? Swimming? Running? Riding a bike? All of those can cause the government to spend money in medical bills, emergency response bills, etc etc. After all...they're using peoples tax dollars for their stupidity!
 
Missed that by Wake, but I don't believe the Constitution is at play here. When what you do ultimately leads to costs picked up by others, a user few is appropriate. In this regard, cost, it is govenment's interests, both state and federal.

The Constitution is always at play when the government exercises any aspect of its power.

The solution is to have those who engage in acts that have costs on others is for them to pay for that and not to have a situation in which the government charges some sort of blanket cost on every one who uses some product even when it is not abused by others.
 
Give an example, and I'll tell you what I think.

If you actually knew how obesity works you would know this already. Believe it or not there are lots of obese people that DO exercise, that DO watch their calorie intake. That do eat healthy foods. But still cannot lose weight. The only way that they can lose weight is via surgery.

Show me where I did. They can eat whatever the hell they want, just don't expect me to support government footing the bill for bailing them out. If they don't want to be fat anymore, they know what to do.

Do you or do you not support restricting certain foods or increaseing taxes on certain foods to reduce obeseity? If you answer yes then you are attempting to tell a person what they can put in their own mouths.
 
The Constitution is always at play when the government exercises any aspect of its power.

The solution is to have those who engage in acts that have costs on others is for them to pay for that and not to have a situation in which the government charges some sort of blanket cost on every one who uses some product even when it is not abused by others.

By not playing a role, I mean it is not being violated.

It is not reasonable to expect that people who so abuse their bodies, be it eating or smoking or both or any other such abuse will be in a position to pay. So, we will have to turn them away, and as a country we have refused to do that. So, we can scream about them paying for it while we pick up the tap, or we can make a change of some sort. I would suggest we think practically here.
 
If you actually knew how obesity works you would know this already. Believe it or not there are lots of obese people that DO exercise, that DO watch their calorie intake. That do eat healthy foods. But still cannot lose weight. The only way that they can lose weight is via surgery.
And I've seen grossly overweight people, one of them well over 300 lbs, lose a lot in just two months in Basic Training. The real problem with obesity is the psychological aspect. They decide they want to change their ways, their habits, etc. It's not easy because they're reversing everything they've done for years. On top of that, they get discouraged, because the results don't happen as fast as they would like it to, people they know bring them down, etc. It's no different than getting a junkie off smack. It can totally be done, but it's not easy. the instances you're talking about, involving glandular, and genetic defects are not the norm like bleeding hearts want everyone to think.

The worst thing for the obese is telling them that it's not their fault. It is their fault. It is completely, 100% their fault that they got that way. That being said, they are completely, 100% capable of undoing it to themselves. Coddling accomplishes nothing but complacency and acceptance. When they just lay back and accept it, they lose.

Do you or do you not support restricting certain foods or increaseing taxes on certain foods to reduce obeseity? If you answer yes then you are attempting to tell a person what they can put in their own mouths.
Where the hell did you get the idea that I support a food ban? I want zero government involvement on this issue. It's an issue for the individual, not the whole.
 
And I've seen grossly overweight people, one of them well over 300 lbs, lose a lot in just two months in Basic Training. The real problem with obesity is the psychological aspect. They decide they want to change their ways, their habits, etc. It's not easy because they're reversing everything they've done for years. On top of that, they get discouraged, because the results don't happen as fast as they would like it to, people they know bring them down, etc. It's no different than getting a junkie off smack. It can totally be done, but it's not easy. the instances you're talking about, involving glandular, and genetic defects are not the norm like bleeding hearts want everyone to think.

The worst thing for the obese is telling them that it's not their fault. It is their fault. It is completely, 100% their fault that they got that way. That being said, they are completely, 100% capable of undoing it to themselves. Coddling accomplishes nothing but complacency and acceptance. When they just lay back and accept it, they lose.


Where the hell did you get the idea that I support a food ban? I want zero government involvement on this issue. It's an issue for the individual, not the whole.

Allow me to add: I too lost a lot of weight when I was in basic. It came back with a vengence. They whole dieting thing is a trap. The more you diet, the less you can eat without gaining. You have to be careful and realize anything you do is for life, espeically with huge weight loss.
 
And I've seen grossly overweight people, one of them well over 300 lbs, lose a lot in just two months in Basic Training. The real problem with obesity is the psychological aspect. They decide they want to change their ways, their habits, etc. It's not easy because they're reversing everything they've done for years. On top of that, they get discouraged, because the results don't happen as fast as they would like it to, people they know bring them down, etc. It's no different than getting a junkie off smack. It can totally be done, but it's not easy. the instances you're talking about, involving glandular, and genetic defects are not the norm like bleeding hearts want everyone to think.

The worst thing for the obese is telling them that it's not their fault. It is their fault. It is completely, 100% their fault that they got that way. That being said, they are completely, 100% capable of undoing it to themselves. Coddling accomplishes nothing but complacency and acceptance. When they just lay back and accept it, they lose.

So you admit that there are times when obese people are obese through no fault of their own (even though you try and down play it) and yet due to some philosophy of yours you still want to put 100% of the blame on them?

....Whatever you're smoking keep it away from me please!


Where the hell did you get the idea that I support a food ban? I want zero government involvement on this issue. It's an issue for the individual, not the whole.

Ok...so why the hell are you even in this thread denouncing obese people? Or any thread talking about restricting or banning certain foods?
 
Allow me to add: I too lost a lot of weight when I was in basic. It came back with a vengence. They whole dieting thing is a trap. The more you diet, the less you can eat without gaining. You have to be careful and realize anything you do is for life, espeically with huge weight loss.

Which is why I stated it's just like recovering from heroin addiction. You don't just kick the habit, and everything is fine after that.
 
Which is why I stated it's just like recovering from heroin addiction. You don't just kick the habit, and everything is fine after that.

I wasn't arguing with you too much, I was merely adding. However, while I agree with your analogy, the difference is this addict has to confront his drug daily.
 
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I'd like to say that our Constitution is capable of being modified. If it can be changed, then it can change on this issue as well.

No, no way. I do not need the state or government in general to tell me what I can or cannot eat or how much. It i not illegal to kill one's self but don't let us catch you eating McDonald's, lol.

We need the government to stop trying to force people to live the way they see fit. Has to do with the whole "pursuit of happiness" thing.

What is the point of pursuing your own legal interests when the government makes it even more costly!

I feel that if the problem begins to get well out of control, as seen in 2/3 of all U.S. adults being obese, then I thnk drastic measures need to take place. If not, what are you going to do when the obesity rates reach 80% or higher? There needs to be a point where we the American people say enough is enough, and start taking to task these people who lack the ability to control themselves. You're a taxpayer. As of this very moment your taxes are higher than they would be if these fat people controlled themselves. If the obesity epidemic festers and grows, your taxes will increase, I think. Automobiles and gas prices as linked to in the OP have gone up significantly. There are articles on how these obese people place a larger fuel burden on airlines. Insurance iirc is affected for all based on the unhealthy lifestyles of these people.

Think of your children. Will you be there to effectively prevent them from becoming obese? 1/4 of all children now are obese. That will increase years from now.

The government should have every right to sever the growing tumor on its back. It should be able to enforce some sort of regulation, some sort of tax, anything, anthing, to reign in this metastasizing problem.

1) Oh sure...make prices of things even more expensive. :roll: If you tax one thing then corporations will just find an excuse to raise the prices on other things. Or will just do it incrementally so people don't notice.
2) Why?
3) Are you trying to suggest that people have no choice in what they eat?
4) I do support the rights of others...whether you consider them "bad" rights is just opinion. I also support the cost of those rights.

1) Increase the prices of truly unhealthy foods like fried chicken, doughnuts, eclairs, onion rings, etc. While corporations would likely raise the prices on other things, it really depends. I doubt Wal-Mart would increase the prices of vegetables like celeray and carrots if their fatty foods like fried chicken were further taxed. Instead of taxing salt and sugar which would place a burden on all, instead, like a scalpel, target the truly bad pre-made foods.

2) I don't see why not. If we tax people for being overweight, our government will gain a lot of revenue, while also affecting to some extent the obesit epidiemic. To keep it real and fair people who are heavy due to acquired mucle mass should be excluded.

3) Not sure I said that. I'm saying corporations need to stop targetting and brainwashing our impressionable children. These corporations try to hook our little ones with childish cartoons for cereals loaded with sugar, fast food loaded with salt and fat, and many other foods of that nature. How many of you parents have had a child that suffered with a toothache? It's possible said corporations had some involvement in those results by influeincing your child into wanting those sweets, persistently wanting them and others, and then eating them and winding up with tooth decay among other things.

Personally I'd like to see soda, koolaid, and other nasty sweet beverages banned from the hands of young children up to the age of, hn, 12. Children don't need to be consuming soda and candy. It's not good for your health or your teeth. There was a documentary I've seen regarding children living in the Tennessee mountains that drank excess amounts of Mountain Dew. Their little teeth were nothing but nubs. I WAS PISSED.

4) I don't support all rights. Rights are only a man-made hypothetical structure. Every day you people on the Right and Left seek to alter the rights of people. If rights can change, then this can change. I feel those who lift up the rights of those to condemn themselves to obesity-related deaths should also take more responsibility in paying through taxes the medical costs associated through obesity. It is the height of evil imo with one side of your mouth praising a person's right to kill themselves, and yet with the other saying that you will do nothing while that erson suffers and eventually dies.


I read through the posts and I believe the war on obesity will fail, or have no great impact. Smoking was controlled only by cost, taxing it till it was unaffordable for many, thats why it was effective in reducing the amount of smokers considerably.
You cant tax through the roof all fattening foods...EVERYTHING makes you fat if you eat too much of it....this utter sillyness of banning 64oz soda and soda in machines in school not going to reduce the obesity epidemic one bit...you tax McDs through the roof...you still have burger king wendys arbies and the colonel popeyes that all peddle mostly ****...
You can try and educated kids starting in elementary school but what good is that if mommy and daddy feed them garbage everyday.
Its a noble endeavor and I would really hope it could work...but I dont see it working much at all

You may think that if you want. Perhaps truly unhealthy foods should have their prices raised immensely. That, and exclude them from government food programs like FoodShare and Food Stamps. My mother told me a few days ago that the cost of a pack of cigarettes in WI is at $8. Great. Awesome! Jack it up further and do the same to alcohol. Do it with truly unhealthy foods like fried chicken as well. I'm so sick and tired of seeing obese parents with their poor children also being obese. There is no reason for that. Parents should be prosecuted for letting their young children become obese imo.

Wrong. You can tax through the roof all truly fattening premade foods that obese people swarm to. And no, not everything makes you fat if you eat too much of it. That's an outrageous lie and quite frankly I'd like to smack whoever originated that lie with a rolled-up newspaper. Foods like cauliflower only have about 35 calories in the whole delicious head. Carrots and celeray and other vegetables likewise have very few calories. You'd have to eat an immense, almost impossible amount of cauliflower to actually get fat/obese off of it.

The whole soda/Bloomberg mess is a sub-issue of the obesity epidemic. He enacted only part of what I'd like to see happen. Obviously there'd be outcry if he outright banned every deathly food out there. He should have banned refills and targetted milk shakes as well. Ban 32 oz sodas, and let people pay extra to try and circumvent the ban.

Mommy and Daddy need to wake up and educate their children. If they can't or won't then the government needs to make up for the loss of those parent's brain cells. It's that simple.

Something needs to give or something's going to break from the weight of this problem on our nation's economy and overally health.

I gotta ask these two questions.

Do people have the right to eat? Yes or no?

Do people have the right to choose so long as they do not infringe on other peoples rights? Yes or no?

Too simplistic.

I think people should have the right to eat healthy to moderately healthy foods. In my perfect world all deathly food would either be banned, or served in small, moderate sizes.

I'd say people are infringing on other's rights to the pursuit of happiness when they are weighed down by the taxes used to cover America's burgeoning healthcare costs stemmed in part by the obesity epidemic. We need to think about the future of our children, and that they will be at risk for obesity if we allow this problem to fester.
 
A lot of things come down to willpower hence the high divorce rate in our country due to cheating-how about we bring back laws for cheating? What is next? Honestly let peeps live their own damn lives and stay the hell outta it:(

I'm sorry Kali but those are apples and oranges, imo. Cheating and divorce are different from obesity and deathly foods.
 
I find it funny that people in this country rail on and on about how the rich are screwing the poor yet we are one of the fattest countries in the world. I'm guessing that more than just the rich are fat. Somethings not adding up............
 
I find it funny that people in this country rail on and on about how the rich are screwing the poor yet we are one of the fattest countries in the world. I'm guessing that more than just the rich are fat. Somethings not adding up............

Deathly foods are typically cheaper. Take McDonald's value menu as an example. The more deathly the food, the cheaper it becomes, or so it seems. Healthy foods like 'Mary Washington' asparagus and 'Lacinato' kale will always be far more healthy and expensive, unfortunately.

No one ever said it was only the rich that were [physically?] fat.

Why? No matter what in your eye's the obese are 100% responsible even when they are not. Its really no use debating someone with that outlook.

There are rare cases in which medical conditions cause a person to become obese. That is rare.
 
I find it funny that people in this country rail on and on about how the rich are screwing the poor yet we are one of the fattest countries in the world. I'm guessing that more than just the rich are fat. Somethings not adding up............

We have a lot of cheap unhealthy food. That doesn't mean anything concerning the gap between the rich and the poor (the screwing thing needs to be more defined).
 
We seem to be breaking down, wallowing in our debilitation and lack of willpower. There is a group of people in America that on one hand opines that we Americans should be allowed to slowly kill ourselves through unhealthy food, and on the other hand complain about increasing taxes for the costs of affording the results of said unhealthy living. You should not be able to have it both ways; either support unhealthy living and pay taxes because of it, or don't support unhealthy freedom and don't pay taxes for it.

Look, we've got problems, and people need to start caring before America develops its own heart attack, per se.



Overweight and Obesity in the U.S. « Food Research & Action Center

Supposedly 2/3 of all U.S. adults are overweight/obese. That's insane.



Obesity Costs America $4 Billion Per Year At The Pump

This directly affects the cost of our gasoline. This likely affects our airlines in some way as well.



Health Buzz: 42 Percent of Americans Will Be Obese in 2030 - US News and World Report

The supposed projection for obesity in America is that 42% of all adults will be obese by 2030, and 1/4 of that group severely obese. The next 100 years if nothing is done...?



We need to act. If sin taxes "don't work" then perhaps we need to start applying regulations, because obviously education isn't reaching enough people. Charge people through their insurance for being obese. Don't feel sorry for them, because they know what they're doing. Don't charge them obscene amounts of money; start it very gradually, and moniter those results. Incorporate a "sin" tax as effectively as possible, like a scalpel. If taxing sugar and salt doesn't work, target doughnuts and fried food. Target what this group of people is inclined to devour.

Add some sort of gradual and minute benefit to those with the foresight of healthy eating. Wean the fat man off the nipple of the taxpayer, and wake up the taxpayer who supports unhealthy behavior yet complains about rising taxes.

You may think you have the freedom to kill yourself, but you don't have the freedom to kill America's future.

If there are valid links that showcase the results of Europe's regulation of healthy living that'd be deeply appreciated.
I'm growing to hate this thread, as it's yet one more call for government to load another tax on our backs. Isn't 40+ taxes enough? Where does it end, Wake? I'd like to see a tax instituted for every single time a pro-tax comment is made.
 
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1) Increase the prices of truly unhealthy foods like fried chicken, doughnuts, eclairs, onion rings, etc. While corporations would likely raise the prices on other things, it really depends. I doubt Wal-Mart would increase the prices of vegetables like celeray and carrots if their fatty foods like fried chicken were further taxed. Instead of taxing salt and sugar which would place a burden on all, instead, like a scalpel, target the truly bad pre-made foods.

You "doubt" it. But why wouldn't they? Now I'm not sure if it was you that said it but someone said that all that corporations are out to do is make money. They don't care. I agree with that. So, why wouldn't they raise the prices on everything else?

2) I don't see why not. If we tax people for being overweight, our government will gain a lot of revenue, while also affecting to some extent the obesit epidiemic. To keep it real and fair people who are heavy due to acquired mucle mass should be excluded.

So, treat them like underclassed citizens. Somehow I truely don't think that the government would be that stupid. If we have such an obesity problem then that is ALOT of voters to be pissing off. And thats not even counting the healthy people that would be against such a thing.

3) Not sure I said that. I'm saying corporations need to stop targetting and brainwashing our impressionable children. These corporations try to hook our little ones with childish cartoons for cereals loaded with sugar, fast food loaded with salt and fat, and many other foods of that nature. How many of you parents have had a child that suffered with a toothache? It's possible said corporations had some involvement in those results by influeincing your child into wanting those sweets, persistently wanting them and others, and then eating them and winding up with tooth decay among other things.

But that is what you basically said. If a person is brainwashed then they no longer have a choice. Yeah, corporations very well may try to hook people into buying things. But hey...how else are they going to sell their product? But that doesn't mean that people can't make the choice.

As far as the children bit goes...besides that being a tired excuse....It is the parent allows the child such things. Blaming the corporations for the parents choice is kind of a cop-out isn't it? My children are constantly nagging me into buying them candy. I constantly tell them no. About the only time they really get candy is during halloween. And even then I moderate how much they of that candy they eat in a day once they have it.

Personally I'd like to see soda, koolaid, and other nasty sweet beverages banned from the hands of young children up to the age of, hn, 12. Children don't need to be consuming soda and candy. It's not good for your health or your teeth. There was a documentary I've seen regarding children living in the Tennessee mountains that drank excess amounts of Mountain Dew. Their little teeth were nothing but nubs. I WAS PISSED.

Their little teeth being nubs has nothing to do with sweet drinks or candy. That is a purely hygenic situation. You could eat sweets your entire life and if you are properly hygenic then you will always have your teeth. Again, that is the parents fault.

4) I don't support all rights. Rights are only a man-made hypothetical structure. Every day you people on the Right and Left seek to alter the rights of people. If rights can change, then this can change. I feel those who lift up the rights of those to condemn themselves to obesity-related deaths should also take more responsibility in paying through taxes the medical costs associated through obesity. It is the height of evil imo with one side of your mouth praising a person's right to kill themselves, and yet with the other saying that you will do nothing while that erson suffers and eventually dies.

Rights do not change. Ever. The only thing that changes is if people allow those rights or not.

Also I fully support a persons right to kill themselves. Even with assistance. I might think that it is totally stupid and asinine in alot of cases (not all) but hey, thats their problem. Not mine.

Too simplistic.

Is it really to simplistic? Or is it just to simplistic because it doesn't fit with what you want?

I think people should have the right to eat healthy to moderately healthy foods. In my perfect world all deathly food would either be banned, or served in small, moderate sizes.

But we don't live in your "perfect world". We live in reality. What you agree with doesn't always coincide with with what other people agree with. And visa versa. What makes your thought and ideas better than someone elses?

I'd say people are infringing on other's rights to the pursuit of happiness when they are weighed down by the taxes used to cover America's burgeoning healthcare costs stemmed in part by the obesity epidemic. We need to think about the future of our children, and that they will be at risk for obesity if we allow this problem to fester.

Wow...a double entandre. Not only did you throw out the "IT'S MY TAXES!" but you also threw out the "THINK OF THE CHILDREN!". Excuse me while I shed a tear and get angry....

It's my taxes too. And I am thinking of the childrens future. I am thinking of the rights that they will have when they become adults.

Tell me, can you take what you dish out? Are you willing to be taxed for being healthy? Are you willing to be taxed for working out? Are you willing for other healthy people to be taxed for rock climbing? Bungee jumping? Running? Jumping? Exercising? Are you willing to be taxed for anything that may make you use a medical facility that gets government funding?
 
Deathly foods are typically cheaper. Take McDonald's value menu as an example. The more deathly the food, the cheaper it becomes, or so it seems. Healthy foods like 'Mary Washington' asparagus and 'Lacinato' kale will always be far more healthy and expensive, unfortunately.
People don't have to go extreme, Whole Foods, Greenlife grocery to be healthy. For instance, a grilled chicken sandwich with fruit at McDonald's costs the same as the burger and fries. If someone wants to eat healthy, they will. They will find ways to do so.
The point of my comment still holds water. If there was such a disparity in classes as liberals would have us believe, we would have many people on the street starving to death. As it is, the country as a whole is fat. You don't get fat eating soup and sandwiches at the local rescue mission everyday.
 
Um, I sure everyone is aware that the BMI was instituted back during the 1960s as a sort of bench mark for physical fitness to determine whether a possible inductee in the military is ready and whether the country has a problem with the inductees as a whole. I do not know how much of the establishment of the BMI standards are all that scientifically based or not. I think it was established so that the inductees would have as little fat on them as possible so that they can carry around 60+ pounds of equipment for a dozen miles or so in a day.

My suspicions are that the standards are on the lean side somewhat. And of course the BMI measures fat from the bodies limbs and surface fat on the abdomen, the 'bad' fat that exists around the intestines do not come into it and is the type that causes type 2 diabetes.

My problem with the BMI is it ignores muscle weight and doesn't measure fat at all. It's a calculation based solely on height and weight. If you have a bigger frame or a lot of muscle, you will be considered overweight or obese even if you have a low body fat percentage.
 
Educate the children on eating and being healthy, let adults that want to die due to obesity related causes die. They have a right to kill themselves.
 
Obesity is not necessarily the result of individual choices. This is one of those examples where I think libertarians attribute too much cause/effect to individual agency. The truth is, even in the absence of government coercion, we're not really as free as we prefer to think we are. If it's not the government, there are other forces that are constantly influencing your behavior whether you're aware of it or not, or whether you like it or not.

Any relationship I have with a private entity is voluntary on my part. They my try to persuade me though advertising, or whatever, but they don't get to make up my mind for me or coerce me through force, as the government does.
 
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