View Poll Results: For Veterans and Military personnel only.

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  • Obama

    35 54.69%
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    29 45.31%
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Thread: For Veterans and Military personnel only.[W:651]

  1. #321
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    Re: For Veterans and Military personnel only.

    Quote Originally Posted by MarineTpartier View Post
    Maybe? Come on man. You know better. We get that end of the stick with everything when dealing with the Navy. The Navy holds on to their stupid traditions like the "Chief's Mess" and the "Officer's Mess". Meanwhile, Marine E-7's and above and officers are sitting with their guys. They have an elitist mind set between their seniors and junior guys. If you aren't a Chief or above, you're just another peon on the blue side. Marines are lower than that to them. Funny part is, they really have no role other than supporting us anymore. Battleships are going away, carriers aren't being built anymore, when's the last time a sub shot something? Yep, that leaves delivering Marines to the battlefield and providing a deck for our pilots to use. The only thing they have left is enforcing no fly zones. Have fun with that. Oh, and a Marine MEU could do that too but we're too busy hooking and jabbing on land.
    Carriers aren't being built anymore? Bull! We are currently building the Ford class carrier, which is a much better designed carrier than the Nimitz class. Due to be finished in 2014/2015.

    And your pilots aren't the main ones flying off Navy carriers to provide air support, ours are.
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  2. #322
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    Re: For Veterans and Military personnel only.

    Quote Originally Posted by MarineTpartier View Post
    Maybe? Come on man. You know better. We get that end of the stick with everything when dealing with the Navy. The Navy holds on to their stupid traditions like the "Chief's Mess" and the "Officer's Mess". Meanwhile, Marine E-7's and above and officers are sitting with their guys. They have an elitist mind set between their seniors and junior guys. If you aren't a Chief or above, you're just another peon on the blue side. Marines are lower than that to them. Funny part is, they really have no role other than supporting us anymore. Battleships are going away, carriers aren't being built anymore, when's the last time a sub shot something? Yep, that leaves delivering Marines to the battlefield and providing a deck for our pilots to use. The only thing they have left is enforcing no fly zones. Have fun with that. Oh, and a Marine MEU could do that too but we're too busy hooking and jabbing on land.
    When was the last time subs shot something? Does last year's shooting of Tomahawk missiles at targets in Libya count? How about during the opening of Operation Iraqi Freedom?

  3. #323
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    Re: For Veterans and Military personnel only.

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    There you are mistaken. The politically pressure in 2006 / 2007 was to begin a phased withdrawal, not Surge troops and take the fight out to the streets. You will recall you were an opponent of the Surge then, and you may even recall (I sure do) you touting Harry Reid saying it was a failure before it even began. The withdrawal from Iraq was only driven by political events at the very end, when the current administration proved itself incompetent enough that it couldn't even negotiate a simple SOFA treaty.

    In contrast, when the ISAF commander asked Obama to allow him to surge troops, Obama dithered for 6 months, and then gave him less than the minimum number of necessary troops, while tying it to a politically determined withdrawal timeline, divorced from events on the ground. The instant Obama put out a timeline, every Taliban member on the ground knew they only had to wait until a certain date, and every Afghan farmer knew it too. That's death to a counterinsurgency effort, where the high ground is the populace.
    You might want to review how the Generals largely changed tactics without the President being fully aware. read The Gamble.

    The event that turend things around in Iraq was what the Iraqis did, not the surge. I know it is hard for you to wrap your mind around this, but the Awaking was the major event, and that was Iraqi born and bred. And it was Lt. Gen. Raymond T. Odierno who largely help by changing the harsher tactics and got more intel with more reasonable approaches.

    Obama was wrong in Afghanistan, but you fail to consider what he was told. The Generals said you could give us everythign we want, and we could still fail. Think about that for a minute, to waste that much, to have nothing that could be any way assured?

    Now, you ask that we choose between the reckless and forgetful (as in forgettng about Afghanistan) and someone who moved a little slower than you liked? Well, call me silly, but I don't see that as a hard choice. Bush spent a lot for next to nothing. Some don't want to see it that way because they are emotionally vested, and admitting the truth means accepting a that their loss was wasted. But truth is truth.

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  4. #324
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    Re: For Veterans and Military personnel only.

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    if that is correct, how can Obama take credit for pulling troops out of iraq? all he did was not **** up something bush and the iraqis set in motion
    Take credit? I think it is the politicians nature to take credit for what they didn't do. They all take credit for the economy when it is good and someone elses fault when it's not, though no president controls the enconmy and largely hs anyting to do with it. However, it was an issue Obama fought for, but Bush agreed with the Iraqis before the election. And before the election, Obama stated he'd accept that. Again, what is is.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  5. #325
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    Re: For Veterans and Military personnel only.

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Carriers aren't being built anymore? Bull! We are currently building the Ford class carrier, which is a much better designed carrier than the Nimitz class. Due to be finished in 2014/2015.

    And your pilots aren't the main ones flying off Navy carriers to provide air support, ours are.
    Negative squidy. Our pilots provide all air support for us in theater. What air support are your guys providing? Where is this happening?
    “Mr. Speaker, I once again find myself compelled to vote against the annual budget resolution for a very simple reason: it makes government bigger.” ― Ron Paul
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  6. #326
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    Re: For Veterans and Military personnel only.

    Quote Originally Posted by Porchev View Post
    When was the last time subs shot something? Does last year's shooting of Tomahawk missiles at targets in Libya count? How about during the opening of Operation Iraqi Freedom?
    Nope, those don't count
    “Mr. Speaker, I once again find myself compelled to vote against the annual budget resolution for a very simple reason: it makes government bigger.” ― Ron Paul
    Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of Liberty. – Thomas Jefferson

  7. #327
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    Re: For Veterans and Military personnel only.

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I really don't want a return to the draft, but I do want everyone connected to the wars we fight. It's too easy to support something you send others to do. We should all share the burden, and the responsibility making sure this is a war we need to fight.
    would help to raise taxes in advance, or as soon as possible, to pay for the war and the consequences of the war....
    If congress had to vote in a pay raise for Iraq, Saddam might still be in power.....
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  8. #328
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    Re: For Veterans and Military personnel only.

    Quote Originally Posted by MarineTpartier View Post
    Negative squidy. Our pilots provide all air support for us in theater. What air support are your guys providing? Where is this happening?
    Bull crap. My husband even told while he was out that some Navy jets provided air support for them in Iraq and Afghanistan. It wasn't a lot, but it did happen. Plus, you claimed we were flying you guys in. That is not true when it comes to most carriers. We never had marines aboard my carrier but we sure flew a lot of missions into both Iraq and Afghanistan.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

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  9. #329
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    Re: For Veterans and Military personnel only.

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    would help to raise taxes in advance, or as soon as possible, to pay for the war and the consequences of the war....
    If congress had to vote in a pay raise for Iraq, Saddam might still be in power.....
    I think so. While I don't care about Saddam at all, I do think to say we can fight two wars and cut taxes is just plain silly.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  10. #330
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    Re: For Veterans and Military personnel only.

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I think so. While I don't care about Saddam at all, I do think to say we can fight two wars and cut taxes is just plain silly.
    The IRAQ wars were not fought so we in the USA can live free, they were fought so we could live well....as in cheap oil.
    Sad, even tragic, how so many of our youth had to die for cheap oil, and we didn't even get cheap oil.
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