View Poll Results: Should same-sex marriage be left to the States?

Voters
71. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    23 32.39%
  • No

    47 66.20%
  • I'm really not sure

    1 1.41%
  • What's marriage?

    0 0%
Page 13 of 21 FirstFirst ... 31112131415 ... LastLast
Results 121 to 130 of 206

Thread: Should same-sex marriage be left to the States?

  1. #121
    Sometimes wrong

    ttwtt78640's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Uhland, Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:12 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    34,640

    Re: Should same-sex marriage be left to the States?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiggen View Post
    Sorry, but that's a lame argument. Separate restroom and prison cells exist for the purposes of personal privacy. Dumb, dumb argument.

    As far as the military is concerned, yeah we ought to strike any gender only restrictions. If women can do the job, they ought to be allowed to do it.
    It's really not that complicated. Unless, of course, you believe that female is the inferior gender and there are certain jobs only men should be allowed to do.
    I am glad that you, yet sadly not congress, agree that separate, gender specific, physical requirements should not apply to the military. You left out title 9 entirely (equal number of althetic opportunities for men and women, yet not for races or ethnic groups). Just what 'personal privacy' applies to gender yet not to sexual preference? What, other than sexual preference being predominantly heterosexual, denies privacy based only on gender (whoops, that might be simply tradition, like marraige is now based on)? Different does not mean superior or inferior, simply different. It makes sense to have physical and mental test standards for many jobs, even if that means that the results are not equal for both genders and all races. We all have equal opportunity for an NBA spot, even though mostly tall, black males get those jobs (yet nobody has sued), yet when mostly white males get firefighting or police jobs, that seems (to many) to indicate gender/race discrimination has somehow occured (and many lawsuits have resulted). My simple point is that gender is accepted as a reason to have legal differences only until someone feels 'slighted' then they zoom in on one area (marraige) and say that there is no 'compelling state interest' for only a man and woman to be allowed to marry, but that two is the only correct number of 'partners' in a marraige without regard to any 'compelling state interest' at all. Business partnerships (state contracts) have no such limit on the number of partners (nor their genders) and we seem to survive quite well that way. The reason that I included the title 9 federal rules, is that they specify that for every male athelete, at that school, that their must be one female athlete, they can not count it any other way, just as state marraige law now says that one spouse must be male and the other female, with no 'substitutions' allowed.
    Last edited by ttwtt78640; 05-28-12 at 04:37 PM.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  2. #122
    Advisor Lightning's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Last Seen
    07-14-13 @ 12:16 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    342

    Re: Should same-sex marriage be left to the States?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Marriage has already been ruled to fall under the 14th Amendment as far as equal protection goes. Since this is true, the federal government has a right, generally through the SC, to enforce the 14th Amendment on state laws regarding marriage.
    Uhmmm...no it hasn't. Again roguenuke, you have no understanding of legal precedents. You're trying to use a limited precedent set to destroy the discrimination of interracial marriages, and apply it to sexual tastes...again.
    Last edited by Lightning; 05-28-12 at 04:59 PM.

  3. #123
    Sometimes wrong

    ttwtt78640's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Uhland, Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:12 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    34,640

    Re: Should same-sex marriage be left to the States?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Nope, any more than slavery should be a state issue. As the Constitution guarantees full faith and credit, any marriage that is legal in one state must be viewed as legal in all of them, thus even if you make it illegal in one state, they still have to recognize the marriage that moves in from another state where it's legal.

    People, especially the religious retards, need to get the hell over themselves.
    I agree and that also goes for polygamy, should a state decide to add that as a legal form of marraige. The only disagreement, that I have with some here, is that a federal standard is OK because they think it fair, even if the constituion does not give the federal gov't the power to define marraige. Some have used the SCOTUS denying of state racial mix restrictions on marraige to imply that a federal (court?) power over state marraige gender restrictions exists as well, in effect, forcing all states to drop it and making SSM a nationwide "right" if the SCOTUS thinks it "fair".
    Last edited by ttwtt78640; 05-28-12 at 05:03 PM.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  4. #124
    Advisor Lightning's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Last Seen
    07-14-13 @ 12:16 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    342

    Re: Should same-sex marriage be left to the States?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Sorry but "tradition" is not a valid reason to deny a fundemental right. Do I really have to go through a list of traditions that have been overturned because they were bad traditions? Besides, appealing to tradition would not work very well for you. Polygamy use to be tradition long before monogamy came into the picture.

    And we are not adding a "special" class of protected citizens. We are just acknowledgeing that the fundemental right to marry should be applied to everyone and not just one class of people.
    I'd like for you to point out where in our Constitution there is a clause that says marriage is a right...thought so.

  5. #125
    Sometimes wrong

    ttwtt78640's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Uhland, Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:12 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    34,640

    Re: Should same-sex marriage be left to the States?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightning View Post
    Uhmmm...no it hasn't. Again roguenuke, you have no understanding of legal precedents. You're trying to use a limited precedent set to destroy the discrimination of interracial marriages, and apply it to sexual tastes...again.
    I agree, that case involved marraige, as an aside, but the central objection was to mix-race sex laws spearate from the marraige law, as the marraige involved was from out of state.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  6. #126
    Sometimes wrong

    ttwtt78640's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Uhland, Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:12 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    34,640

    Re: Should same-sex marriage be left to the States?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightning View Post
    I'd like for you to point out where in our Constitution there is a clause that says marriage is a right...thought so.
    I agree. Too many want the constitutional "interpretation" by a SCOTUS decision to essentially replace the need for any constitutional amendment. Why constitutional amendment to outlaw poll taxes (via the 24th amendment) was required, yet not for voter "literacy" tests is beyond me. Perhaps that is why "gun permits" or "CCW permits" are somehow deemed constitutional (what part of "shall not be infringed" does not apply to a state renting your constitutional right, to keep and bear arms, back to you for a fee?) yet showing a state issued photo ID to vote (only once and only as yourself) is legal, only in certain states, without advance approval from the federl gov't based on the "voting rights act" in the "bad" states, but perfectly acceptable in the "good" states (is that equal protection under the law?).
    Last edited by ttwtt78640; 05-28-12 at 05:31 PM.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  7. #127
    Sage
    roguenuke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Last Seen
    05-17-17 @ 05:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,935

    Re: Should same-sex marriage be left to the States?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightning View Post
    Uhmmm...no it hasn't. Again roguenuke, you have no understanding of legal precedents. You're trying to use a limited precedent set to destroy the discrimination of interracial marriages, and apply it to sexual tastes...again.
    Sexuality is not about sex. It is about intimate relationships, just as interracial marriage is.

    Marriage was ruled to be a constitutional right. Even if it wasn't, being a government endorsed institution means that it has to conform to the EPC of the 14th. I guarantee that the 14th and/or the EPC will be mentioned in the SC ruling that overturns same sex marriage bans.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  8. #128
    Sage
    Cephus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    CA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 07:41 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    29,793

    Re: Should same-sex marriage be left to the States?

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    I agree and that also goes for polygamy, should a state decide to add that as a legal form of marraige. The only disagreement, that I have with some here, is that a federal standard is OK because they think it fair, even if the constituion does not give the federal gov't the power to define marraige. Some have used the SCOTUS denying of state racial mix restrictions on marraige to imply that a federal (court?) power over state marraige gender restrictions exists as well, in effect, forcing all states to drop it and making SSM a nationwide "right" if the SCOTUS thinks it "fair".
    Well, yes and no. The only legitimate concern that government has with marriage are the legal questions, such as property rights, inheritance rights, etc. Gay marriage requires no changes in the existing laws to institute. Polygamy, however, does require massive changes and as such, before we institute polygamy, we need to consider the legal ramifications. I've got no problem with polygamy, I just don't want to see the courts clogged up with polygamist divorces, etc. before we've had a chance to consider how to handle it.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

    Blog me! YouTube me! VidMe me!

  9. #129
    Sometimes wrong

    ttwtt78640's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Uhland, Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:12 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    34,640

    Re: Should same-sex marriage be left to the States?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Sexuality is not about sex. It is about intimate relationships, just as interracial marriage is.

    Marriage was ruled to be a constitutional right. Even if it wasn't, being a government endorsed institution means that it has to conform to the EPC of the 14th. I guarantee that the 14th and/or the EPC will be mentioned in the SC ruling that overturns same sex marriage bans.
    If that is the case then what is so sacred about marraige applying to only two partners? Polygamy preceeded same sex marraige and is much more popular among many religions. Is it not prohibiting the free exercise of religion to restrict marraige to only one spouse? You seem to imply that a law that simply does not include something is, in effect, a ban on it. Using that logic polygamy is banned as well. It is very different to strike down a law as unconstitional, than to require adding provisions to it. SSM, like polygamy, simply not being a privilege granted by a given state is not the same as a ban on it. If MS would not accept a SSM granted legally in VT then that may be a constituional issue, but MS is not violating the rights of anyone by not offering SSM in their state. Many states have differing laws, simply because CA allows medical marijuana does not mean that TX must also do so. Even though federal prohibition of alcohol was repealed does not compel every state, county and city to allow it.
    Last edited by ttwtt78640; 05-28-12 at 05:56 PM.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  10. #130
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    The greatest city on Earth
    Last Seen
    08-04-12 @ 04:27 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    31,089

    Re: Should same-sex marriage be left to the States?

    let's say that we had a Conservative administration and a solidly Conservative SCOTUS.

    with that situation, would you STILL want SSM to be left to the Feds?

    cause if we did, the Feds might strike down SSM.

Page 13 of 21 FirstFirst ... 31112131415 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •