View Poll Results: Is using a taser to arrest a noncoperative but nonviolent person "excessive force"

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  • Yes, always

    15 26.79%
  • Depends, sometimes yes, sometimes no

    26 46.43%
  • No, tasers are acceptable if a person is not cooperating

    13 23.21%
  • Don't know

    2 3.57%
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Thread: Taser Use

  1. #41
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    Re: Taser Use

    Quote Originally Posted by lpast View Post
    Look there is no doubt that there are moron cops that use excessive force...no one denies that...and there are bad cops and there are cops that make honest errors in judgement...that is all true but the lionshare of cops do a good job and just do it...cops have forever been the recipients of disdain...because humans have a natural aversion of being told what to do...we know that...but we still have to do the job and get it done..
    I think you might have replied to the wrong person...?

    But I do agree with you. Look, I know the cops aren't my friends and they don't have MY best interests necessarily at heart, but I always give them the benefit of the doubt. I've been screwed by police. I got a DUID when I was sober. I got picked up for a warrant I didn't know I had because the cops lied and said I was a suspect at a burglary of an unoccupied frat house. I've got reasons for not liking cops. But I still give them all the benefit of the doubt and know that corrupt or violent cops are the exception, not the rule.

  2. #42
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    Re: Taser Use

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    No, the line is not drawn at compliance. If a cop comes to my house and tells me to let him in, I am going to say no unless he has paperwork. If he tasers me for saying no, I am going to make some money off the police. If you had read the article I linked, you would see that so far, the courts have agreed that in this case, the cops acted improperly.
    If a cop comes to your house without a warrant and asks you to let him in and he tasers you...hes going to jail after he loses his job.

  3. #43
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    Re: Taser Use

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    I take exception to the bolded portion...

    sure, you guys are free to ask for any information that you believe is pertinent... but the other side of the coin has the civilians with the right to remain silent if he believes the information is not relevant.
    You do, IIRC, have to give information that is nessecary, but not details. You can't sit there like a stone statue and refuse everything the cops asks you. That is not covered by the right of silence.

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    Re: Taser Use

    Quote Originally Posted by lpast View Post
    Ok im not getting your point though...She was inside the vehicle..she was told to sign the summons she refused...she was told to exit the vehicle she refused...she was told she was under arrest and she continued to refuse..

    Now whats ironic unless I missed it no one has mentioned where the original cop screwed up and caused this entire thing...
    I and we as police force never asked for you to sign our summons...we wrote it and handed it to you...no sig necessary...and if any dept required that you ask for the sig and she refuses...you merely put in the sig line...driver refused to sign and initial it...case closed everyone goes on their merry way
    I understand you feel tasering in this situation is appropriate. That is the small questions. The big question is where is the line drawn between acceptable and unacceptable. You said noncompliance, which would include some one simply sitting down. Is it acceptable to taser people sitting down in the open? When is it unacceptable to taser, when acceptable?
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  5. #45
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    Re: Taser Use

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    I take exception to the bolded portion...

    sure, you guys are free to ask for any information that you believe is pertinent... but the other side of the coin has the civilians with the right to remain silent if he believes the information is not relevant.
    Sure you do...no argument, then the cop gets to decide to ask you come to the precinct and if you refuse he can arrest you IF the situation merits that action...were doing a hypothetical thing here

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    Re: Taser Use

    Quote Originally Posted by lpast View Post
    If a cop comes to your house without a warrant and asks you to let him in and he tasers you...hes going to jail after he loses his job.
    But I have been nonclompliant, which you claimed made tasering acceptable. See the problem?

    Note: I do not have good answers on this, which is why I made this thread. The story made me think, and realize I don't have a good answet for where the line should be drawn, nor even whether the police where justified in this particular case. I am not trying to be difficult(well, not entirely), but I think there are some really good questions in stuff like thist and the comnversation can be interesting.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  7. #47
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    Re: Taser Use

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    I understand you feel tasering in this situation is appropriate. That is the small questions. The big question is where is the line drawn between acceptable and unacceptable. You said noncompliance, which would include some one simply sitting down. Is it acceptable to taser people sitting down in the open? When is it unacceptable to taser, when acceptable?
    Redress there is no answer to the question where is the line drawn...the answer is the line is drawn at the time the incident is in progress and the cop makes the decision on the fly what his course of action is....
    All depts are different...so im on the spot here...I can only speak from my experience based on my depts sop...I cant speak for other depts that have differing SOPs that the operate under...thats where alot of confusion comes in with caine and I when in these kinds of threads...
    There is no cookie cutter answers most of the time...your dealing with SITUATIONAL decision making...not cut and dried rules and regulations...each decision is based on a set of rules with the final decsion being made by the actions of the moment....I hope that made sense

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    Re: Taser Use

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    But I have been nonclompliant, which you claimed made tasering acceptable. See the problem?

    Note: I do not have good answers on this, which is why I made this thread. The story made me think, and realize I don't have a good answet for where the line should be drawn, nor even whether the police where justified in this particular case. I am not trying to be difficult(well, not entirely), but I think there are some really good questions in stuff like thist and the comnversation can be interesting.
    I know this sounds harsh and PEOPLE HATE THESE WORDS...I know that...but you have to comply, you dont have a choice and we wont give you one, once your placed under arrest...

  9. #49
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    Re: Taser Use

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Taser Pain May Be Considered by Supreme Court as Excessive Force - Yahoo! News



    She sued the cops, and right now has won the suit, however the cops where granted immunity due to the law being considered too vague. Thursday SCOTUS meets to decide whether to hear the case.

    So, now the question: the woman was no threat and was simply refusing to comply. In that type situation, is the inflicting of intense pain a violation of the constitution? A further question that does not translate well to a poll so just type out an answer...where does the line get drawn? When are police justified in using a taser, and when is it excessive?
    Violent means should not be used on non-violent individuals. So yeah, it was execessive force.

    At one point if I recall correctly the electric chair was considered cruel and inhumane and as such could no longer be used, because of the pain that it inflicted. So besides the difference of death (though tasers can cause death it is mainly accidental when used by police)...just what IS the difference? If we're not allowed to use electricity on the condemned why would it be acceptable to use it on someone that is intended to live?
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    Re: Taser Use

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    I understand you feel tasering in this situation is appropriate. That is the small questions. The big question is where is the line drawn between acceptable and unacceptable. You said noncompliance, which would include some one simply sitting down. Is it acceptable to taser people sitting down in the open? When is it unacceptable to taser, when acceptable?
    If you're talking about a protest where people refuse to disperse when told, the preferred method is for 2 officers to pick up the limp body and toss it in the paddy wagon. That's not always possible or practical, but that's the preferred method. I've personally not heard of leo's walking down a group of protestors tasing them one by one. Mace, yes, tear gas, yes... Tasing, no.

    In this particular case, in the closed quarters of a car mace is not a good option because it lasts a looong time, and blows back in the officer's faces. She was under arrest; therefore, they had to take her in.

    In my mind, this woman created the problem, escalated the problem, and showed zero concern for the well-being of her unborn child by forcing the officers to take strong measures in order to secure a person who was now under arrest.

    Anyway, no sense me saying the same thing ten ways, lol. I say the whole thing is the woman's fault. If I'd been on the jury, she wouldn't be getting a cushy payday, that's for sure.

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