View Poll Results: Texas secession?

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  • Anytime they want

    69 60.00%
  • Bad times only

    2 1.74%
  • No way

    41 35.65%
  • I don't know

    0 0%
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    3 2.61%
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Thread: Texas secession?

  1. #311
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    Re: Texas secession?

    Quote Originally Posted by dabateman View Post
    The Preamble isn't law, it's just ideas. The law comes from the Articles and Amendments.
    So the Preamble is part of the Official US Constitution but its not really an important part of the Constitution because it simply tells us WHY it was WRITTEN and what the scope and duty of Government is?
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  2. #312
    Educator / Liar Champion ab9924's Avatar
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    Re: Texas secession?

    Texas has always been a foreign country within the US. (And so is California.) The US civil war did prove that leaving the union is not permitted, but the US constitution allows for it. So, legally, Texas could leave, and it would show to the world that the USA is indeed the fairest country of the world in the 21st century. But this will never happen, because most of the US federal infrastructure is in Texas, e.g. the energy grid/distribution. So this will definitely lead to the next civil war.

  3. #313
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    Re: Texas secession?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Lol, and the legal obligations are the problem and you know it. You know perfectly well it is to keep people here so they DON'T leave. Your dishonestly is outstanding.
    Again, this is impossible to discuss this with you because
    1- you will not clearly state why anybody leaving should be paid, and
    2- for what it is that they are being paid for

    Are you really advocating that people NOT satisfy their legal obligations?
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  4. #314
    Educator Quantrill's Avatar
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    Re: Texas secession?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    So your quote from one person IS NOT IN THE CONSTITUTION. Thank you.
    The quote comes from one of the framers of the Constitution who explained who 'we the people' were. The people of the states. And in explaining he noted the sovereignty of the 13 states.

    And, your ignoring the ratification process. Who was it by? The people of the Nation? Or the people of the States? Answer: States.

    States did not lose their sovereignty.

    Quantrill

  5. #315
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    Re: Texas secession?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Again, this is impossible to discuss this with you because
    1- you will not clearly state why anybody leaving should be paid, and
    2- for what it is that they are being paid for

    Are you really advocating that people NOT satisfy their legal obligations?
    I'm arguing that people should be allowed to leave whenever they damn well please without having to pay the government.

    You and I also know that it is a punishment on the rich since it only APPLIES to the rich.

    You can cram your little pay the obligations to the government bit since that clearly doesn't apply.
    Last edited by Henrin; 05-20-12 at 07:59 AM.

  6. #316
    Educator Quantrill's Avatar
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    Re: Texas secession?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    So the Preamble is part of the Official US Constitution but its not really an important part of the Constitution because it simply tells us WHY it was WRITTEN and what the scope and duty of Government is?
    Its an important part. Which is why Madison had to explain 'we the people' is 'we the people of the States' in their sovereignty.

    Which your ignoring.

    Quantrill

  7. #317
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    Re: Texas secession?

    Quote Originally Posted by Quantrill View Post
    The quote comes from one of the framers of the Constitution who explained who 'we the people' were. The people of the states. And in explaining he noted the sovereignty of the 13 states.



    Quantrill
    Again, your quote from one individual is NOT IN THE CONSTITUTION. Thank you.
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    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

  8. #318
    Advisor dabateman's Avatar
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    Re: Texas secession?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    So the Preamble is part of the Official US Constitution but its not really an important part of the Constitution because it simply tells us WHY it was WRITTEN and what the scope and duty of Government is?
    So do the Articles of Confederation, but they're not law either. Neither are Jefferson's papers or any of the like. The law, the actual substance, begins with Article I. Besides. I didn't say it wasn't important. I said it wasn't the law.

    But go ahead and try to ignore that...

  9. #319
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    Re: Texas secession?

    Quote Originally Posted by Quantrill View Post
    Its an important part. Which is why Madison had to explain 'we the people' is 'we the people of the States' in their sovereignty.

    Which your ignoring.

    Quantrill
    So it is an important part when you want it to be an important part. But others on your side in this same thread see it it as just a bunch of ideas when they don't want it to be an important part.

    Got it.
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  10. #320
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    Re: Texas secession?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    I see this as a case of the constitution being flawed. It should have addressed this question specifically and because it didn't we are stuck debating this topic that has no real legal answer. It could equally be yes or no.
    Article I, Sec. 9 contains the restrictions placed upon the states. Leaving the union is not among these restrictions.

    Also, amendment 10 reserves the powers not delegated to the united states to the states themselves, or the people. There is no delegated power over the rules of exit, so it seems that the power to exit is reserved to the states.

    Also, as someone pointed out earlier, I believe it was Quantrill, there were states that, in their ratification documents, made it clear that they were delegating some of their authority to the union, and that they would take back this authority when they wished.

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