View Poll Results: Support a constitutional amendment guaranteeing full auto assault weapon ownership?

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    12 29.27%
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Thread: constitutional amendment guaranteeing full auto assault weapon ownership

  1. #91
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    Re: constitutional amendment guaranteeing full auto assault weapon ownership

    Quote Originally Posted by notquiteright View Post
    TurtleDude-
    still waiting to hear what kind of deer rifle you have seen shoot to 800 yards and score a first round hit.

    Also think it is a fantasy scenario to think a man seizes power AND leaves so many 800 yard 30 ought owners free. The fight will be as the enforcer arm of the dictator moves through society collecting those 800 yard rifles. The odds of anyone getting a shot at the dictator is very low. But nice fantasy to run through your mind as you clean your pistol...

    It is a hot mess when discussing how many times a felon repeats. One problem is a felon is labeled just that and the simplest backround check flags him. If two guys apply and one is a felon, guess who gets hired. I'd rather see a non violent felon get his record exsponged after serving his time.

    If he is a repeater it will show soon enough and will be dealt with anyway. But a strong incentive to have fully restored rights will help with non violent first time offenders.

    There are alot more felons out there than drug dealers and murderers.
    look I realize that statists like you want more and more government crackdowns on liberty.

    Winchester Model 70, Leopold Scope. 30-06 caliber. same rifle and caliber used by one MSgt Carlos Hathcock (google him). better scope than the Unertl he used 45 years ago. Your rants about gun owners are pathetic. as to felons-I don't disagree with your claims.

  2. #92
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    Re: constitutional amendment guaranteeing full auto assault weapon ownership

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    Discourse has done more to create and protect our rights than weapons ever could. Words are often the tool to topple violent oppressors, who use their weapons to enslave others. If all the gun owners in this country fight the US army, it wouldn't end terribly well for the citizens of this land. It wasn't weapons that brought legal equality among races in this country, nor the rights of women. The people of India drove out the British, the mightiest empire in the world, without taking up arms. Violence doesn't change the world for the better. Even the revolution that forged this country would have been meaningless if not for the words that went along with it. American freedom and democracy weren't created with guns, but with a pen and parchment.
    I said "emergency" insurance policy. As for American freedom and democracy/ pen and parchment, you are technically correct, but without the fight, none of it would have mattered.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
    -C G Jung

  3. #93
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    Re: constitutional amendment guaranteeing full auto assault weapon ownership

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    Is there anyone who actually believes that the commerce clause is a proper delegation of power to the federal government to regulate small arms in violation of the 2nd and Tenth Amendments? because if you believe the federal government should so regulate you will have to make that argument

    I would think the 9th amendment would mean that the government has no business trying to use the commerce clause to **** on the 2nd amendment.

    The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  4. #94
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    Re: constitutional amendment guaranteeing full auto assault weapon ownership

    Oh I know the Gunny Sir,

    Now lets be clear, the model 70 used was NOT a deer rifle (they have varmint barrels, MUCH heavier) nor did The Gunny score a first round hit at 800 yards. It is bull bunk to claim there are many Gunny's out there. He was literally one in a million, all claims to how many scoped 30 oughts there are out there.

    Fact is YOU have NO, I say again ZERO idea on how anyone hits a man over 800 yards away with the first round, you would know a modern deer rifle wont do it and there is sooooo much more to it than the gear.

    Clueless drivel.

    The Marine you should have used was Steve Suttles, he was my Instructor and will quickly tell you he did his shot after much practice when the target wasn't around.

    So all the overblown rhetoric about a nation of riflemen, perhaps that is so, but riflemen are not snipers. Hell former military officers opine in gun rags that you need a magnum caliber to hunt game at 200 yards! (My best was 486yards, 308, NOT a deer rifle, buck through his heart, next a coyote at 340 yards but doped the wind wrong and she needed a second round) But I won't claim I can hit a man at 800 yards first round unless conditions are VERY good, and I am no Fudd!

    I am first and foremost a realist. YOU may have some Fred Appleseed fantasy about fighting back against a dictator, YOU may think the 'dictators' out there worry about Fudds with 'guns', but that aint happening. The number of men who have a shot, so's to speak, at that 800 yard shot are easy enough to roundup, their names are posted everywhere there is a LR/Bench/F-class/Hipower match.

    And if you think a dictator WON'T send his minions to roundup those with the skills and bring the fight TO the People you are crazy. The fight will be against professional soldiers with a lot more firepower than a bolt gun, not snapping off a shot at the dictator all hollywood like.

    But makes good ranting for an NRA meeting....

  5. #95
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    Re: constitutional amendment guaranteeing full auto assault weapon ownership

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    And what do you think those "incentive structures" are?
    Promotion Pay Recognition Reelection and Fame.


    We reward our bureaucrats for putting new regulatory burdens into place, not for lifting old ones. Politicians get to put their names on new laws, not on the repeal of outdated or unneeded ones. The result is a federal registrar and tax code beyond anyones comprehension and a regulatory climate where every single small business owner is a criminal of one kind or another.

  6. #96
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    Re: constitutional amendment guaranteeing full auto assault weapon ownership

    False argument-
    A small business doesn't need to know the ENTIRE Register or tax code. Just the parts that apply to that particular business.

    I don't need to know the regulations on fuel distribution, or cough syrup manufacturer, don't need to know the rules for taxis or buses.

    I don't need to understand tax regulations for hedge funds, for lobster fishing, nor forestry, or what taxes a medical service has to pay.

    The Register and tax code is a false flag waved by AM Talk Radio.

  7. #97
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    Re: constitutional amendment guaranteeing full auto assault weapon ownership

    Quote Originally Posted by notquiteright View Post
    Oh I know the Gunny Sir,

    Now lets be clear, the model 70 used was NOT a deer rifle (they have varmint barrels, MUCH heavier) nor did The Gunny score a first round hit at 800 yards. It is bull bunk to claim there are many Gunny's out there. He was literally one in a million, all claims to how many scoped 30 oughts there are out there.

    Fact is YOU have NO, I say again ZERO idea on how anyone hits a man over 800 yards away with the first round, you would know a modern deer rifle wont do it and there is sooooo much more to it than the gear.

    Clueless drivel.

    The Marine you should have used was Steve Suttles, he was my Instructor and will quickly tell you he did his shot after much practice when the target wasn't around.

    So all the overblown rhetoric about a nation of riflemen, perhaps that is so, but riflemen are not snipers. Hell former military officers opine in gun rags that you need a magnum caliber to hunt game at 200 yards! (My best was 486yards, 308, NOT a deer rifle, buck through his heart, next a coyote at 340 yards but doped the wind wrong and she needed a second round) But I won't claim I can hit a man at 800 yards first round unless conditions are VERY good, and I am no Fudd!

    I am first and foremost a realist. YOU may have some Fred Appleseed fantasy about fighting back against a dictator, YOU may think the 'dictators' out there worry about Fudds with 'guns', but that aint happening. The number of men who have a shot, so's to speak, at that 800 yard shot are easy enough to roundup, their names are posted everywhere there is a LR/Bench/F-class/Hipower match.

    And if you think a dictator WON'T send his minions to roundup those with the skills and bring the fight TO the People you are crazy. The fight will be against professional soldiers with a lot more firepower than a bolt gun, not snapping off a shot at the dictator all hollywood like.

    But makes good ranting for an NRA meeting....


    welll let me educate you on a few things

    the 30-06 is the "king of big game" calibers in the USA. Lanny and Larry Benoit-the most famous deer hunters in the USA in the 70s swore by that cartridge. Its the most popular deer cartridge in the USA over the last 70 years with the 30-30 and 308 probably right behind it. Me. I shot a Grant's Gazelle in Kenya at 650M with a Browning Belgium Made copy of the 70 in 30-06. Redfield scope, 3-12 power, Winchester 180 Grain bullet. 1976. I was 17. My brother, then 16 took an Impala at 450M with the same rifle. Of course when I was still a teenager I shot the military rifle course with a M1 Garand and qualified "Expert". At the USOTC where I was there for a summer as a shotgun athlete, I played around with 300M free rifles. Ray Carter was the current world champion and a coach. Did Ok with those too and made NRA D.E. in air rifle. I don't think you'd be much competition for me in a rifle shoot.

    You think most soldiers would support such a dicatator? apparently those who are of your political bent might. My nephew-Currently a captain in the US SF stationed in Fort Lewis-no chance.

  8. #98
    Klattu Verata Nicto
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    Re: constitutional amendment guaranteeing full auto assault weapon ownership

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    Think about the government problems you have now then look up how those laws and agencies came about in the first place.
    I know about your regulatory argument, most of the initial problems were caused by some idiot in government in the first place, that or a niche group. Their regs made it worse, let's get back on topic now.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

  9. #99
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    Re: constitutional amendment guaranteeing full auto assault weapon ownership

    Quote Originally Posted by notquiteright View Post
    Oh I know the Gunny Sir,

    Now lets be clear, the model 70 used was NOT a deer rifle (they have varmint barrels, MUCH heavier) nor did The Gunny score a first round hit at 800 yards. It is bull bunk to claim there are many Gunny's out there. He was literally one in a million, all claims to how many scoped 30 oughts there are out there.

    Fact is YOU have NO, I say again ZERO idea on how anyone hits a man over 800 yards away with the first round, you would know a modern deer rifle wont do it and there is sooooo much more to it than the gear.
    I think you might be exaggerating a good bit here. I've been through the Army Sniper School at Benning, and did a deployment in afghanistan with the 173rd. I was certainly not the best shot in our group, but even I could pretty consistently hit a nonmoving target with a first round from 600-800 meters about 70+% of the time. (95% for second round with a correction.) My furthest shot was 1000 meters. This was all with the Remington M24 7.62mm. One of my teammates hit a guy at 2.2 km with a Barrett 50 cal, which I told him was luck, he however swore was mad skills.

    The point I'm trying to make is, although it's difficult to hit a target 800 meters and further with a first shot, it is not as irregular as you suggest. My comrades and I were not extraordinary snipers, and we didn't have much of a problem with it.
    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    I've got to say that it is shadenfreudalicious to see the rich and famous fucquewads on the coast suffering from the fires.

  10. #100
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    Re: constitutional amendment guaranteeing full auto assault weapon ownership

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    look I realize that statists like you want more and more government crackdowns on liberty.

    Winchester Model 70, Leopold Scope. 30-06 caliber. same rifle and caliber used by one MSgt Carlos Hathcock (google him). better scope than the Unertl he used 45 years ago. Your rants about gun owners are pathetic. as to felons-I don't disagree with your claims.
    That man is one of my biggest heroes. I read his book marine sniper and am still to this day baffled at how such a myth of a man could've existed.
    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    I've got to say that it is shadenfreudalicious to see the rich and famous fucquewads on the coast suffering from the fires.

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