View Poll Results: Are all black men brainwashed?

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  • Yes

    5 8.33%
  • No

    51 85.00%
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Thread: Are all black men brainwashed? (Read Warning: post #540)

  1. #451
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    tacomancer's Avatar
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    Re: Are all black men brainwashed?

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    I've just GOT to stop with the hyperbole.
    Societal problems are very complex and people tend to like simple solutions. This is part of the reason we are in the mess we are in, I think. Conservatives like solutions that fit their world view and so do liberals. However, both philosophies have a grain of truth to them and the solution, being that it is complex, is going to require we treat this thing like its a buffet and take what we need from whatever plate on the basis that it works in some measurable manner.

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    Re: Are all black men brainwashed?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Yes TPD, I am quite aware of different learning styles, teaching methods, etc. Thats not going to help everyone. Yes, you will get the kids who want to learn but don't have someone to teach them on their level and that is great, but also there is no reason why small school a isn't primarily auditory while subschool b is primarily kinesthetic. There would be enough flexibility to do that.
    Perhaps you should read my post again because it appears that you have missed my point. I'll repeat it again.

    It is illogical to conclude that certain students "will not drink" if they have not been properly led to the water. This is what you have done. You have concluded that since certain students have not been successful in two systems that have the same ultimate problems, then the students cannot be helped. That's an illogical argument. It does not make sense and it is contrary to evidence.

  3. #453
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    Re: Are all black men brainwashed?

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Perhaps you should read my post again because it appears that you have missed my point. I'll repeat it again.

    It is illogical to conclude that certain students "will not drink" if they have not been properly led to the water. This is what you have done. You have concluded that since certain students have not been successful in two systems that have the same ultimate problems, then the students cannot be helped. That's an illogical argument. It does not make sense and it is contrary to evidence.
    Not at all. The basis of my belief lies outside of the educational system itself. So changing the educational system one way or another, will not do anything if the person they are trying to reach doesn't care.

    Your solution is for kids that want to learn but have not found a system that works well for them.

    These are two different groups of people. However, they can appear the same to the outside observer.

  4. #454
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    Re: Are all black men brainwashed?

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Perhaps you should read my post again because it appears that you have missed my point. I'll repeat it again.

    It is illogical to conclude that certain students "will not drink" if they have not been properly led to the water. This is what you have done. You have concluded that since certain students have not been successful in two systems that have the same ultimate problems, then the students cannot be helped. That's an illogical argument. It does not make sense and it is contrary to evidence.
    what can actually be done for the student who does not value education
    for the student who will not do the work to achieve an education
    what system will educate that student who prefers ignorance, often because it is the easier path
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: Are all black men brainwashed?

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    while i agree with much of your post, the reality is some students WILL be left behind when it comes to achieving an education
    some can't get it, others don't want it
    no one, other than themselves, can make them do the work to attain it
    doesn't matter what system they are in

    but that reality does not mean that our educational system is not ripe for a complete overhaul
    Sure some students will be left behind. This is true for rich kids and poor kids. There are some people in the best schools from the best families who just do poorly at school. I'm not talking about those people.

    I'm talking about all the kids who can be helped with methods that already have academic backing, but that aren't implemented for political and financial reasons or just out of plain ignorance on the part of policymakers. I have a HUGE problem with people concluding that certain kids are beyond help when they haven't even been given proper resources. That's a bad conclusion to make for them and for our entire country.

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    Re: Are all black men brainwashed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    Um, the problem as always is JOBS, there are not enough JOBS that match the skill set present.
    true. and it is excellent that the discussion has therefore turned to our failed educational system, which is not a little bit responsible for that.

    If your argument is that they need to increase their skill sets, sure, but to what
    well, for example, we currently have a shortage of plumbers in this nation. electricians, too. neither of those jobs exactly require a college degree. average total compensation for a plumber is about $59,000, though to be fair their base pay is closer to $40K.

    what we don't need is more fools who spent a leisurely half-decade at State U getting a General Studies Degree with an emphasis in Public Drunkenness.

    yet we as a society support and we as a government fund people pursuing the second more than the former.

    and how does one do that while being un/under/employed? Good paying low-mid level jobs (manufacturing, municipal) have been decimated through off-shoring, automation and reduced state spending. The middle class is being divided where some have been able to push upwards while most are dropping down.
    you are correct that the Middle Class is bifurcating. But you are incorrect when you seek to draw out the main drivers of that trend.

    If I can suggest some quick reading. The main drivers, you will find, are behavioral.

    Of course, most of your argument is based on the premise that "welfare" still exists at levels of the past. Did you skip the 90's?
    i'll admit, I'm not really sure what you are trying to get at here. I'm not against some public support, I just think we should do it more intelligently.

  7. #457
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    Re: Are all black men brainwashed?

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    what can actually be done for the student who does not value education
    for the student who will not do the work to achieve an education
    what system will educate that student who prefers ignorance, often because it is the easier path
    You can keep all the students who want to learn, who crave an education in the seats next to them so they can all fail while "we try to fix this thing." That's sarcasm, by the way.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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    Re: Are all black men brainwashed?

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    what can actually be done for the student who does not value education
    not much, except to stop making it easier for them not to do so, let them experience the results of their poor decision and hopefully respond accordingly.

    for the student who will not do the work to achieve an education
    not much, except to not subsidize sloth, and let them experience the results of their poor decision and hopefully respond accordingly

    What system will educate that student who prefers ignorance, often because it is the easier path
    not much indeed. except to eventually let the child touch the hot stove and learn why it is you don't do that.

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    Re: Are all black men brainwashed?

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    what can actually be done for the student who does not value education
    for the student who will not do the work to achieve an education
    what system will educate that student who prefers ignorance, often because it is the easier path
    It depends on which kids your talking about. Are you talking about kids who aren't interested in anything on the planet or kids who have interests that aren't tapped into at school?

  10. #460
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    Re: Are all black men brainwashed?

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    You can keep all the students who want to learn, who crave an education in the seats next to them so they can all fail while "we try to fix this thing." That's sarcasm, by the way.
    I wish it was, but sadly, that seems at current to actually be The Plan .

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