View Poll Results: Punishment or solution?

Voters
27. You may not vote on this poll
  • Punishment.

    5 18.52%
  • Solution.

    22 81.48%
Page 7 of 10 FirstFirst ... 56789 ... LastLast
Results 61 to 70 of 95

Thread: Punishment or solution?

  1. #61
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:25 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,113

    Re: Punishment or solution?

    Quote Originally Posted by earthworm View Post
    I favor the line, but the "moat" ???
    The moat protects those in their ivory towers , these people need to be booted out and exposed..
    the line is no different from the moat. you are simply artificially increasing the height of the line and creating a "no mans land" that can be utilized for ground-sensor-collection and rapid response.

    Our level of civilization is reflected on how we handle our "criminals"
    murderers and violent rapists are absolutely criminals. no quotation marks needed.

    Cp, IMO, your methods did not work in the 6th century nor the 16th century...why should they work today ????
    fascinating. you have reliable murder rate records of a non-state nature from the 6th Century?

    you need to turn those in to some good classic Midieval Archives right away. They will pay you quite handsomely for those.

    Love is more effective than hate.
    and an armed populace is more effective than either when it comes to deterring crime.



    neither love nor hate is the goal of punishing those guilty of the most heinous crimes.

  2. #62
    Mr. Professional
    Mensch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Last Seen
    08-24-17 @ 04:07 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    3,666
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Punishment or solution?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    neither is necessary and both would probably violate the Constitutional ban on cruel and unusual punishment. hanging is well within our tradition, though firing squad would work just as well.



    I wouldn't have any moral qualms with it. Much easier than the shades-of-grey decisions we faced in Iraq. It probably wouldn't pay well enough to attract me, though.
    Why do you insist on imitating the brutal acts of third world dictatorships? Hanging in the public square? What if the neck doesn't break? How does strangulation that takes anywhere from 10-20 minutes NOT cruel and unusual punishment?

  3. #63
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    New England
    Last Seen
    05-01-14 @ 03:29 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    12,879

    Re: Punishment or solution?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Time and time again we hear about some politician/s passing new laws or or attempting to pass new laws that increase punishments of those convicted of some crime or other. It is obvious, to me at least, that this line of thinking is a failure. Isn't it time that we start trying to come up with solutions instead of just adding more punishments?

    Which do you prefer?
    PUNISHMENT. The problem is that we no longer know what PUNISHMENT truly is in this society. Our prisons look more like spas than actual prisons. We fail to incarcerate a large percentage of the criminals, choosing instead to fine them or use some other form of non-punishment. We aren't even able to convict an acceptable rate of the criminals in our society. When we actually return to PUNISHMENT, things will turn around, but not until then.

  4. #64
    Mr. Professional
    Mensch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Last Seen
    08-24-17 @ 04:07 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    3,666
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Punishment or solution?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    PUNISHMENT. The problem is that we no longer know what PUNISHMENT truly is in this society. Our prisons look more like spas than actual prisons. We fail to incarcerate a large percentage of the criminals, choosing instead to fine them or use some other form of non-punishment. We aren't even able to convict an acceptable rate of the criminals in our society. When we actually return to PUNISHMENT, things will turn around, but not until then.
    Spa? Tell that to Ted Kaczynski. I've never been to a spa where they lock you up in a windowless, 7 x 12 foot concrete and metal, soundproof cell for 23 hours a day.

  5. #65
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    New England
    Last Seen
    05-01-14 @ 03:29 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    12,879

    Re: Punishment or solution?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mensch View Post
    Spa? Tell that to Ted Kaczynski. I've never been to a spa where they lock you up in a windowless, 7 x 12 foot concrete and metal, soundproof cell for 23 hours a day.
    Realizing that my personal vision of a proper prison is essentially Alcatraz, Mensch. I'm talking utter silence, almost zero contact with any other human being, no tv, no workout rooms, etc.... You may think that's cruel and inhumane but you have to consider my other alternative, immediate execution for any felony conviction. Straight from the appeals court to the gallows.

  6. #66
    Mr. Professional
    Mensch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Last Seen
    08-24-17 @ 04:07 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    3,666
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Punishment or solution?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    Realizing that my personal vision of a proper prison is essentially Alcatraz, Mensch. I'm talking utter silence, almost zero contact with any other human being, no tv, no workout rooms, etc.... You may think that's cruel and inhumane but you have to consider my other alternative, immediate execution for any felony conviction. Straight from the appeals court to the gallows.
    Immediate execution? Really? What's wrong with a little bit of the ultra-violence before we extinguish the life?

  7. #67
    Sage

    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Goldsboro,PA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:48 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    5,595
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Punishment or solution?

    You and I (conservative, liberal) completely disagree on everything...
    We need to compromise.
    I doubt if I can prove any points , but check out murder rates....
    And then converse with a murderer....
    And your "moat" or "line"...
    Why do you hate your fellow man so ?
    The "fellow man" includes the Mexican, the so-called illegal....
    If I were in his shoes, I'd do the same thing !
    No question, I'd never make it as a hangman.... I would hate the man who murdered then raped the woman....he would suffer !

    "Our level" of civilization is reflected on how well we treat our criminals...without """....
    IMO, we are NOT civilizated...
    We can be, we should be, why this fear ???
    Talk with a murderer...too bad that this(with our rules) cannot be done....

  8. #68
    Sage

    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Goldsboro,PA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:48 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    5,595
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Punishment or solution?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    Realizing that my personal vision of a proper prison is essentially Alcatraz, Mensch. I'm talking utter silence, almost zero contact with any other human being, no tv, no workout rooms, etc.... You may think that's cruel and inhumane but you have to consider my other alternative, immediate execution for any felony conviction. Straight from the appeals court to the gallows.
    Nearly exactly as I felt and believed....when I was a child...even a child of 40 years.
    Now, I think I am an adult and I care not to be inhumane..in any way.....
    Think about this for 40 years !

  9. #69
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:25 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,113

    Re: Punishment or solution?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mensch View Post
    Why do you insist on imitating the brutal acts of third world dictatorships?
    i see no reason to say that intelligent application of the death penalty is inherently dictatorial. emotionalism makes for an excellent demagougic, but a poor debate strategy.

    Hanging in the public square? What if the neck doesn't break? How does strangulation that takes anywhere from 10-20 minutes NOT cruel and unusual punishment?
    strangulation does not take 10-20 minutes unless you've made a complete cockup of it. the restriction in the bloodflow alone typically ensures unconsciousness in about 30 seconds.

    however, Hanging is solidly within the American legal tradition, and there is no reason to suppose it is inherently cruel, as it is certainly not unusual. If we were to attempt to ensure that the person was fully conscious for 20 minutes of slow strangulation - that would be cruelty.

  10. #70
    Mr. Professional
    Mensch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Last Seen
    08-24-17 @ 04:07 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    3,666
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Punishment or solution?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    i see no reason to say that intelligent application of the death penalty is inherently dictatorial. emotionalism makes for an excellent demagougic, but a poor debate strategy.
    My statement is accurate if you consider world events. Nearly all (if not all) developed countries have eliminated the death penalty. The US, along with a handful of third world countries (I admit it's growing) use lethal injection as their primary means of execution. The rest use some form of barbaric, 18th century method. Where do you often find public hangings? Largely in places where there is a totalitarian government. Granted, I realize you're not trying to emulate these countries, only our own 18th century traditions, you have to admit they're a lot alike.

    strangulation does not take 10-20 minutes unless you've made a complete cockup of it. the restriction in the bloodflow alone typically ensures unconsciousness in about 30 seconds.
    I wasn't talking specifically about unconsciousness when I referenced 10-20 minutes. And why would 30 seconds of severe pain and agony be appropriate under the 8th Amendment?

    however, Hanging is solidly within the American legal tradition, and there is no reason to suppose it is inherently cruel, as it is certainly not unusual. If we were to attempt to ensure that the person was fully conscious for 20 minutes of slow strangulation - that would be cruelty.
    It is very unusual in the Western world today. Tradition does not legitimize an act.

Page 7 of 10 FirstFirst ... 56789 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •