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Is there a "War on Women" in the United States?

Is there a War on Women?

  • Total voters
    118
Ikari said:
I try not to condone the infringing of one's rights. I certainly would not allow murder. However, in the free exercise of rights, the current level of restrictions regarding gun rights certainly does hamper one's choice. If we are to be pro-choice, we would have to allow all those choices unhindered by government force, yes?

In the end, I find it particularly foolish to claim that pro-life isn't really pro-life because they are not pro-all-life. But it's clearly a term associated solely with the abortion issue; as is pro-choice. They refer to abortion, so it's rather silly to say one cannot say they're "pro-life" if they happen to support other means which may take life. It's clearly referring to abortion.
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I see what you are saying and it does make sense. But when someone who supports wars and the violence's I have earlier stated then talks about protecting the unborn and life it's a lie. They have chosen something they will protect. They see no value in life at all if they will take a life. It's as if they use this issue to wash the blood from their hands from all the other killing they support.
 
Parrish said:
Yes, there is.

Any woman who says there isn't isn't worthy of her uterus or the women who came before her.
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:roll:

The unabashed feminist rolls her eye.

:roll:

Paranoid much?

The number of countable efforts and measures put forward to increase equality are increasing - those that decrease it are decreasing.

Some might be more willing to open their mouths and spew forth trash: but their numbers are diminishing. Look around you: How many men do you know who want a woman to work and vote?

My ex boyfriend was pissed with me when I didn't vote - he found it inexcusable (2001 election). Contrast that to 1920's - how many men would be upset if a woman didn't vote? Some would - but not many. Most were just the opposite.

We've come so far in this country I don't believe that there are many 'anti-feminists' really out there - even the ones who say they aren't feminist really are. LOL - the other day on TV some female commentator on a news show said "I'm not a feminist" . . . LOL: with her stilletos and ruby red lips - on national tv discussing politics. Yeah: feminism abounds there.

Do not confuse the issue of abortion with women's rights.
Do not confuse the issue of insurance companies covering birth control with women's rights.

These things are not the same.
 
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Ikari said:
Pro-Choice has a huge scope. I mean, if you truly see a difference it's only because you really want to see a difference. Functionally they are equivalent. They are both propaganda terms for the abortion debate.
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Of course they are. But when a person claiming to care about life is willing to take it under some other circumstances that's wrong. You are for life or you aren't. IMO
 
Parrish said:
Yes, there is.

Any woman who says there isn't isn't worthy of her uterus or the women who came before her.
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huh.jpg
 
ThePlayDrive said:
Like I said, I wouldn't call it a war on women, but there are patriarchal attacks on women's reproductive rights. There's definitely a struggle over abortion as you said. However, there is also a definite attack on female contraception. All you have to do is listen to Rick Santorum to know that.
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Exactly. The word war is just part of the political hyperpole. That said, I can see where women MIGHT see themselves being targeted in a negative way.
 
SgtRock said:
I do not see things through rose color glasses. I see things in black and white, right and wrong, good and evil. Im not judging anyone that I leave up to god.
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Black and white in this issue is subjective and we stand on different sides of the fence.
 
Josie said:
No, the child is still in the womb. Are you saying that the child magically becomes human life when he/she emerges from the vagina?
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Life as a person begins the moment that child is born prior to that it is a fetus. We have differing views on when life begins.
 
katiegrrl0 said:
Black and white in this issue is subjective and we stand on different sides of the fence.
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I can agree with this and I think it's sensible. One of the main problems with the abortion debate is people want to view it in black and white. Some pro-life people want to view it from the lenses and perspective that abortion is murder done by the hands of evil women and taking that perspective. Some pro-choice people want to view the issue as evil anti-women pro-lifers wanting women to die in back alleys and are misogynists that hate women's rights. The black and white view doesn't really get anyone anywhere and an inability to look from another's perspective on both sides only hurts things in my opinion.
 
I don't know if there's a war as much as there is neglect and ignorance regarding women's issues.

There are still so many issues in the legal system when it comes to rape, domestic violence, equal employment...etc. American women may feel equal, but when it comes to court cases, it is really difficult to get justice. The enforcement of these equality laws in court and outside is difficult. Much of "equality" is rhetoric.
There's still plenty of recorded violence against women.
I still believe we need to define pregnancy in better terms. (Pregnancy as a disability?)
The Glass ceiling.
I could go on lol.

There's a disconnect in defining what equality means for women. I believe in substantive equality. Women are differently situated than men in certain cases.
 
At the same time we can argue that the legal system favors women and is unfair to men.

All of that is very subjective and case-by-case. More so: state by state or region by region.
 
Hare said:
No, but don't tell that to feminists, without something to be falsely outraged or terrified about their days would seem empty and unfulfilling.
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I guess this all depends on how you define "feminist."

At both my parents'--but particularly my father's--encouragement, I have been a feminist most of my life. Somehow, I think how I define "feminist" and how others do differs.
 
nota bene said:
I guess this all depends on how you define "feminist."

At both my parents'--but particularly my father's--encouragement, I have been a feminist most of my life. Somehow, I think how I define "feminist" and how others do differs.
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I think this is a good discussion. What exactly does it mean to be a feminist?

For me, being a feminist involves recognizing the fact that society treats men and women differently. Women do enjoy some advantages (like the legal system Auntie mentioned above), but on the whole males are privileged over females and we live in a patriarchal society. My feminism involves calling attention to these inequalities and injustices where they exist.

This does not necessarily mean that I believe in "women's rights" - however they are defined. I am pretty split down the middle when it comes to the abortion issue. I support more access to contraceptives for everyone, but I don't believe that free or low-cost access to contraception is a "woman's right."
 
SgtRock said:
There is an attack on the murder of innocent unborn children.
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You must be the guy who has all of the answers on how all of these unborn children would be appropriately cared for IF YOU COULD END all abortion at your will?

Right?

How many will you personally take care of?

Or perhaps you can do some magic and control all of humanity's sexual behaviors, stop birth control failures...and the list goes on.

For every action there is an equal but opposite reaction.

So you the guy the world's been waiting for. Wow....what a privilege.
 
Interesting.

Feminism to me means embracing your gender for what it is, finding strengths in it, and not using it as a reason or excuse to keep yourself - or others - down or to hold them back in life. You should not be defined by your gender in a negative sense in which you feel oppressed or confined as an individual. Thus: others should not do this to you as well (male or female).
 
digsbe said:
I can agree with this and I think it's sensible. One of the main problems with the abortion debate is people want to view it in black and white. Some pro-life people want to view it from the lenses and perspective that abortion is murder done by the hands of evil women and taking that perspective. Some pro-choice people want to view the issue as evil anti-women pro-lifers wanting women to die in back alleys and are misogynists that hate women's rights. The black and white view doesn't really get anyone anywhere and an inability to look from another's perspective on both sides only hurts things in my opinion.
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Abortion is an emotional issue for many on both sides. There is no answer for right and wrong. Some will always view it through eyes which see only an unborn child. Others see abortion through a different lens as a protection for women who for whatever reason have gotten pregnant and do not want a child. This thread turned quickly into a debate on that one issue. It's really not all this topic should have covered.
The word war encompasses so much. Women's issues have come under fire in recent weeks in health care. Politicians are attacking contraceptives. The abortion issue has come up again. Romney wants to destroy Planned Parenthood which is foolish. Only 3% of their operation is abortion. They provide so many services contraceptives, sexual education, STD's among other health issues. These services are vital.
So yes women have been under attack. The controversy over coverage of contraceptives which are not just used for birth control is an attack on women. Over the past year there have been insurance companies moaning about mammography's and there need and how often. Now they want to do invasive procedures to women wanting an abortion an indignity that men never have to suffer.
I believe that there is an attack on women and our rights by a still patriarchal society.
I get angry when women lead the charge and agree with this assault on us.
Women in the past fought long and hard to gain what we have and it is frustrating to see some wanting to give it back. I understand that men who do not deal with women's health issues don't see the need for so many services. It boggles my mind when I woman against organizations like Planned Parenthood who probably prevent ten times the abortions they preform. They prevent the spread of STD's. So many services that would be far more expensive and harder to come by are provided by organizations like this and single issue people look at only one aspect and would through the rest out.
So these issues become emotional for me because I know and knew so many women that did fight for our rights. I know what they went through and why they did it.
It's sad to see so many women that don't know or care. Many of the posters do know and are willing to stand up.
 
Aunt Spiker said:
Interesting.

Feminism to me means embracing your gender for what it is, finding strengths in it, and not using it as a reason or excuse to keep yourself - or others - down or to hold them back in life. You should not be defined by your gender in a negative sense in which you feel oppressed or confined as an individual. Thus: others should not do this to you as well (male or female).
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Feminism should be about the wonderful parts of being a woman and accepting who we are. I don't see it as an attempt to hold men back or take away what they have. We should be committed as people to make each others lives better and not hider each other. I do that best though accepting who I am and as you said using the strengths I have.
 
Aunt Spiker said:
Interesting.

Feminism to me means embracing your gender for what it is, finding strengths in it, and not using it as a reason or excuse to keep yourself - or others - down or to hold them back in life. You should not be defined by your gender in a negative sense in which you feel oppressed or confined as an individual. Thus: others should not do this to you as well (male or female).
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You can only embrace your sex fully when there isn't discrimination/oppression.

For example:
Women fall into the "pink ghetto" because they choose to parttime or smaller paying/less intensive jobs/careers in order to raise their children. Many women are primary child care givers. It's hard for women to embrace their ability and choice to bear/raise children when they often don't have access to employer-based healthcare because they work part-time or have those "pink ghetto" jobs. Private insurers have plans that sometimes don't cover pregnancy or enough of it.
(Of course, the new healthcare act will solve that issue)
 
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Clandestine said:
You can only embrace your sex fully when there isn't discrimination/oppression.

For example:
Women fall into the "pink ghetto" because they choose to parttime or smaller paying/less intensive jobs/careers in order to raise their children. Many women are primary child care givers. It's hard for women to embrace their ability and choice to bear/raise children when they often don't have access to employer-based healthcare because they work part-time or have those "pink ghetto" jobs. Private insurers have plans that sometimes don't cover pregnancy or enough of it.
(Of course, the new healthcare act will solve that issue)
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Hmm...this is a chicken or egg kind of question for me. I'm of the opinion that you are not fully equipped to fight discrimination or oppression until you fully embrace your gender.
 
StillBallin75 said:
Hmm...this is a chicken or egg kind of question for me. I'm of the opinion that you are not fully equipped to fight discrimination or oppression until you fully embrace your gender.
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That is true of most anything. It is the same with stopping discrimination against gays. So many have yet to embrace themselves.
 
Clandestine said:
You can only embrace your sex fully when there isn't discrimination/oppression.

For example:
Women fall into the "pink ghetto" because they choose to parttime or smaller paying/less intensive jobs/careers in order to raise their children. Many women are primary child care givers. It's hard for women to embrace their ability and choice to bear/raise children when they often don't have access to employer-based healthcare because they work part-time or have those "pink ghetto" jobs. Private insurers have plans that sometimes don't cover pregnancy or enough of it.
(Of course, the new healthcare act will solve that issue)
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I made the choice to be a stay at home mom - I didn't have to. This is how it's different: it use to be the only thing expected or supported. I could have been employed this whole time.

Being a stay at home mom by my own free choice doesn't make me less of a feminist or an individual. No one told me I had to do this - not even my husband.
 
SgtRock said:
I was there for her and always will be. She is my daughter, I love her much. She understands my position on the subject of abortion and she has come around. Even if she did not I would still love her unconditionally.
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And yet she "murdered" her unborn child, and you have said that women who "murder" their unborn child shoud die. I guess there are exceptions to your rule, if they are family.
 
SgtRock said:
If they do not die while murdering their child they should go to prison. When a guy walks into a store to rob it. Then shoots and kills the clerk and another clerk shoots the theif. Are we better off that a murderer is off the streets and we do not have to pay to incarcerate him? I say yes. Just as we are better off if a murderer dies while killing her unborn child. Simple logic, try it some time.
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Is your "murdering child" in prison? She had an abortion, after all. Is she still walking the streets instead of being incarcerated, or executed? Maybe that is different in your eyes.
 
Afterthought on this part here:

Clandestine said:
You can only embrace your sex fully when there isn't discrimination/oppression.
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There will always be discrimination and oppression - somewhere, at some point: it will exist in some measure. An individual - a group of like minded people - and so forth. Just like racism: it's unaccepted in our society, we hate it, people act out against it all the time, we pass measures to try to correct it - but it will always be there in some form.

Whether or not you let it get to you or govern the way you feel about yourself or conduct your life is the real issue.
 
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