View Poll Results: What do you think welfare should be?

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  • Leave it as it is

    3 4.11%
  • Make provisions to the current welfare system. Explain

    29 39.73%
  • Abolish it completely.

    37 50.68%
  • Other. Explain

    4 5.48%
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Thread: Welfare

  1. #71
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    Re: Welfare

    Quote Originally Posted by John View Post
    because as I have read and seen economically a "livable wage" is an illusion.

    Our livable wage is based on prices and costs remaining fixed. Now if you could close the market (ie, eliminate all foreign goods & services) it would be a start in the right direction.

    Next you would have to tell the federal and all other governments to never run up debt. Why because this increases the eventual taxes needed to pay for everything.

    These two things would greatly change the effect of the minimum wage.

    afterward, taxes would have to be reduced on the people. And I don't mean more on the rich and more refunds to the poor. it needs to be streamlined, yes it's great with the bottom 20% (or whatever) pays no taxes. But what about the refund mechanisms? they cost money to operate.

    at this point is where I would plug "The Fair Tax Act" to simplify tax revenue collection.

    Finally, the US government can never "issue" more money. This creates inflation which hurts the poor directly. If you notice the "poverty level" always rises. Why? inflation. However, this is because more money is being issued. This is theft and the worst part is it hurts those least able to stop it.

    Will this completely fix the problem. I don't know, however it would greatly improve the situation.

    Oh, final note. To improve the wages received by everyone, the elimination of all welfare would increase the value of money held by the poor. Again, it won't fix everything. But it will be easier to spot the problems remaining.

    Poppycock, our minimum wage in 1968 was close to a living wage for full time work and the planet didn't explode. It would only take an increase of a couple dollars an hour to the current minimum wage. We already have the minimum wage system set up.

    Or, we can continue to subsidize employers inadequate pay for full time work with taxpayer supported welfare.

    None of the candidates are proposing the so called "fair tax" because it is even more regressive than our present system has become.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  2. #72
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    Re: Welfare

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    Welfare needs a drastic overhaul these days. The amount needs to be reduced, it needs to require full-time employment, recipients should be mandated to take random, frequent drug tests, and women need to be placed on some sort of birth control who receive funding. These are just tips of the iceberg.
    I'd add one favorite term from left; Regulation. Tougher, tighter regulation of who get welfare, how much for how long, and under what circumstances. Yes it's abused, but yes it's also needed at times.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


  3. #73
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    Re: Welfare

    I saw this floating around on facebook the other day and found it very interesting

    Welfare-417434_185576588216000_100002909812407_320618_1499972823_n-jpg

  4. #74
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    Re: Welfare

    Quote Originally Posted by kerussll View Post
    I saw this floating around on facebook the other day and found it very interesting

    Welfare-417434_185576588216000_100002909812407_320618_1499972823_n-jpg
    I'm glad someone spent the money testing that stupid theory. Maybe we can finally put it out of it's misery?
    But I'm also glad it wasn't my State that wasted the money.
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  5. #75
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    Re: Welfare

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    I'm glad someone spent the money testing that stupid theory. Maybe we can finally put it out of it's misery?
    But I'm also glad it wasn't my State that wasted the money.
    Yeah, I'm glad it wasn't my state either. I know it's shocking, but all poor people aren't drug-using mooches!

  6. #76
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    There are much more precise ways to limit welfare fraud and waste. Scalpel-not-axe approach.

    One example: Eliminate benzodiazepines from all formularies. There should be laws against prescribing them on an outpatient basis. Soooo many people simply claim anxiety and get those pills for cheap (thanks Medicaid!) and sell them and trade up on the street.

    Forget universal drug testing. Just stop permitting doctors to hand out addictive substances. Benzodiazepines, opioids and amphetamines. Get rid of 'em. That'd be a giant step in the right direction.

  7. #77
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    Re: Welfare

    I think the biggest problem to that graph is the 178 million they attribute to testing costs.

    This tells me two things: the government inefficiently allocates resources, and too many people apply for and are considered for welfare. Yeah, duh to both, right?

    My cries for reform ring louder now.

  8. #78
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    Re: Welfare

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    There are much more precise ways to limit welfare fraud and waste. Scalpel-not-axe approach.

    One example: Eliminate benzodiazepines from all formularies. There should be laws against prescribing them on an outpatient basis. Soooo many people simply claim anxiety and get those pills for cheap (thanks Medicaid!) and sell them and trade up on the street.

    Forget universal drug testing. Just stop permitting doctors to hand out addictive substances. Benzodiazepines, opioids and amphetamines. Get rid of 'em. That'd be a giant step in the right direction.
    Geez paranoid much? Why don't you leave prescription decision up to doctors who know more about this than you do. Preventing doctors from prescribing people medications isn't going to limit their abuse. Doctors don't prescribe cocaine do they?

  9. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by kerussll View Post
    Geez paranoid much? Why don't you leave prescription decision up to doctors who know more about this than you do.
    Because a) many do a ****ty job of it and b) many dont in fact know as
    much about the problem as I do. But my personal knowledge/expertise aside, the conditions that benzodiazepines, opioids and amphetamines treat (anxiety, pain and attention deficits) are not lethal. Many people receive them and don't abuse or sell them. Tough. The ethical drawbacks of harming patients by dealing drugs to them outweighs the subjective benefits of these drugs. There's insufficient medical necessity to have to keep prescribing them.

    Preventing doctors from prescribing people medications isn't going to limit their abuse.
    Yes it will. Eliminating addictive meds from the formulary restricts people's means to get their fix.

    Doctors don't prescribe cocaine do they?
    If their patients are trading Xanax for cocaine, they might as well be.

  10. #80
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    Re: Welfare

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    Because a) many do a ****ty job of it and b) many dont in fact know as
    much about the problem as I do. But my personal knowledge/expertise aside, the conditions that benzodiazepines, opioids and amphetamines treat (anxiety, pain and attention deficits) are not lethal. Many people receive them and don't abuse or sell them. Tough. The ethical drawbacks of harming patients by dealing drugs to them outweighs the subjective benefits of these drugs. There's insufficient medical necessity to have to keep prescribing them.
    And you treat how many people a week? How many are over 62? How many are disabled?

    Have you ever had a personal injury or condition that required pain medications beyond OTC?
    If so, what was prescribed for you?

    Are there other treatment options available instead of benzodiazepines?
    Would you expect some patients to get better with the use of benzodiazepines?

    Same questions for amphetamines?


    If you're denying a possible cure or relief are you willing to continue supporting these people indefinitely?
    Last edited by MoSurveyor; 03-14-12 at 03:00 PM.
    Mt. Rushmore: Three surveyors and some other guy.
    Life goes on within you and without you. -Harrison
    Hear the echoes of the centuries, Power isn't all that money buys. -Peart
    After you learn quantum mechanics you're never really the same again. -Weinberg

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