View Poll Results: Do Men Have the Right to Control Women's Health Issues and Reproductive Systems?

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  • Yes

    4 7.69%
  • No

    42 80.77%
  • Under Certain Circumstances(s) - Briefly list what circumstance(s))

    5 9.62%
  • Does a male dominated government?

    2 3.85%
  • Does a male dominate Religion?

    1 1.92%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Do MEN have a Right to CONTROL Women's Health Issues and Reproductive Systems?

  1. #381
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    Re: Do MEN have a Right to CONTROL Women's Health Issues and Reproductive Systems?

    Quote Originally Posted by katiegrrl0 View Post
    I know there are insurance companies that don't rate men higher and yes it is a discriminatory practice. The rates should be equal. I don't like anyone discriminated against not just women.
    It's not really discrimination though.
    It's statistically based risk pricing.

    They do it with car insurance, life insurance, basically every other insurance, although the factors the use to "discriminate" vary.
    I don't have a problem paying more for certain types of insurance, if you can prove that insuring me, statistically costs more.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  2. #382
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    Re: Do MEN have a Right to CONTROL Women's Health Issues and Reproductive Systems?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    Are you saying that effective birth control methods are not also available to women? Of course you're not. You're "playing field is perfectly level" point is denied.
    I am saying that if the male is anti choice he should take measures to protect against pregnancy. Why would you expect women who are pro choice to use birth control. So the playing field is level. I would expect a woman who is anti choice to use birth control. I would expect men who don't care or are pro choice to do as they see fit. If a women is pro choice and doesn't care about having an abortion she may well not use anything in the way of contraceptives. That does leave it up to the anti choice male to do what he can. Why is that hard to understand?
    The flame that is between us could set every soul on fire. I would love to take that heat and let's fill the whole world with desire.
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  3. #383
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    Re: Do MEN have a Right to CONTROL Women's Health Issues and Reproductive Systems?

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Wrong, we are talking about abortion. What if he wears a condom, and it fails? Your problem is you don't have a dog in this fight, lesbian; now do you? No you don't, not the slightest. Don't try to derail the thread, and deflect a valid point.
    The failure rate is rather small. birth control pills and other options have failure rate as well. I am not deflecting anything. Why would a man expect a woman who is pro choice to use birth control pills. If the male fells so strongly about the potential fetus why does he not protect himself. I would see him as very foolish or not caring so much as he states.
    The flame that is between us could set every soul on fire. I would love to take that heat and let's fill the whole world with desire.
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  4. #384
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    Re: Do MEN have a Right to CONTROL Women's Health Issues and Reproductive Systems?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    I understand all that.
    The whole health care discussion is complicated and people take a lot of offense in what I say.
    Mostly because they don't understand the relationship between prices and third party payment systems (like we have now).

    It's an economics argument, involving theoretical realities, that plausibly could exist.
    I have lived in nations with nationalized heath care and their care is better and the cost far less than the US.
    The flame that is between us could set every soul on fire. I would love to take that heat and let's fill the whole world with desire.
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  5. #385
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    Re: Do MEN have a Right to CONTROL Women's Health Issues and Reproductive Systems?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    It's not really discrimination though.
    It's statistically based risk pricing.

    They do it with car insurance, life insurance, basically every other insurance, although the factors the use to "discriminate" vary.
    I don't have a problem paying more for certain types of insurance, if you can prove that insuring me, statistically costs more.
    Car insurance is based on driving record and age brackets. There is a difference. An insurance company should do life insurance in a way that there is no weighing of the premium for men who on the average die earlier.
    The flame that is between us could set every soul on fire. I would love to take that heat and let's fill the whole world with desire.
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  6. #386
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    Re: Do MEN have a Right to CONTROL Women's Health Issues and Reproductive Systems?

    in fact men need to control what they have.

  7. #387
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    Re: Do MEN have a Right to CONTROL Women's Health Issues and Reproductive Systems?

    Quote Originally Posted by katiegrrl0 View Post
    I am saying that if the male is anti choice he should take measures to protect against pregnancy. Why would you expect women who are pro choice to use birth control. So the playing field is level. I would expect a woman who is anti choice to use birth control. I would expect men who don't care or are pro choice to do as they see fit. If a women is pro choice and doesn't care about having an abortion she may well not use anything in the way of contraceptives. That does leave it up to the anti choice male to do what he can. Why is that hard to understand?
    An articulate response, but still incorrect. As long as both people are participating in the sex act, birth control is an equal and shared responsibility. She can easily choose to not have sex if he refuses protection, not to mention the myriad of other effective and pro-active birth control options available to women. Maybe she does want a kid, but pro- or anti-abortion as an option is irrelevant at that point. In fact, unless they're in a committed relationship, and have discussed having kids in detail, then not having kids should be the presumed default position for both. It is fully rude and irresponsible for a woman to have unprotected sex and presume that the man will be ok with having and supporting a kid that he may not want.

  8. #388
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    Re: Do MEN have a Right to CONTROL Women's Health Issues and Reproductive Systems?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    An articulate response, but still incorrect. As long as both people are participating in the sex act, birth control is an equal and shared responsibility. She can easily choose to not have sex if he refuses protection, not to mention the myriad of other effective and pro-active birth control options available to women. Maybe she does want a kid, but pro- or anti-abortion as an option is irrelevant at that point. In fact, unless they're in a committed relationship, and have discussed having kids in detail, then not having kids should be the presumed default position for both. It is fully rude and irresponsible for a woman to have unprotected sex and presume that the man will be ok with having and supporting a kid that he may not want.
    Thank you.
    What you fail to take into consideration is that abortion is a form of birth control. Therefore any woman who is willing to have an abortion has a birth control idea in place. She has a plan for an unwanted pregnancy. She will have an abortion if that happens. This is not true in all cases but it may will be a plan for some women. She does not necessarily have the opinion that the fetus means anything as an anti choice person might. So if you are an anti choice male you presume to much in thinking she is on birth control. If she does decide that she wants a child and the male has not worn a condom he will suffer the consequences of his inaction. I do realize there may be condom failure but no contraception is foolproof unless you are practicing abstinence.
    For me if I were a male and was anti choice or did not want a child i would use a condom. This is not to say that I think it would be good practice for any women who are sexually active to use BC of whatever sort.
    I am just trying to make the point that if the man does not do what he can to prevent pregnancy, how can he say he is anti choice. He's hoping the woman is on BC and she may well not be.
    The bolded line is true but he should be aware that this can happen and do all he can to prevent the predicament that a child might be.
    On another forum a poster said he is anti choice but never used a condom. How sane is that? How much sense does that make. He would have a fit if she had an abortion but yet he didn't take any responsibility for the outcome. Is this person really anti choice? By his inaction I would certainly say he is not.
    The flame that is between us could set every soul on fire. I would love to take that heat and let's fill the whole world with desire.
    Sophie B. Hawkins

  9. #389
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    Re: Do MEN have a Right to CONTROL Women's Health Issues and Reproductive Systems?

    Quote Originally Posted by katiegrrl0 View Post
    If you are a male which i am guessing you are, and you are anti choice, you should wear a condom. If you do not and a woman has an abortion because of that failure on your part you are responsible because you did not do all you could to prevent it. That's what I have said throughout this thread in a nutshell.
    A pro choice woman or any women for that matter may not be using any form of birth control. You can not take her word for it. Wearing a condom would make sense because of your views. If you think that is wrong headed of me to think it foolish for a man not to wear one please tell me where you think that's wrong.
    You're going off on a tangent and making me repeat myself.

    I'll take this as your surrender, thank you. If you want to continue the conversation, go back and address what I actually said.

  10. #390
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    Re: Do MEN have a Right to CONTROL Women's Health Issues and Reproductive Systems?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Sorry. Anyway, lets say it again.

    Military is for the protection of the rights and liberties of the people as a whole and more to the point the countries survival. What is comparing to is something meant to only pay for what someone wants or needs.

    better?
    What rights and liberties have been protected by our involvement in Iraq? We lost rights and liberties since Iraq and Afghanistan. I don't want to get off on the war argument here, though I will be happy to on a separate thread. My morals, part of which I derive from my faith, do not support the US actions in Iraq and Afghanistan. The US military was sent for reason other than a direct defense of the U.S. and in doing so over 100,000 people have died so far - and my money helped pay for those deaths. So there is a direct correlation with the argument in this thread.

    US citizens gained no rights or liberties as a result of Iraq or Afghanistan. We have lost right and liberties since our invasion of those countries. Our presence there is morally wrong, but I pay my taxes to support what I am morally opposed to.

    Oh, and those people in the military? They get free birth control - and you're paying for it.










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