View Poll Results: Right to die

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  • People have no right to die under any circumstance

    15 18.52%
  • Only terminally ill people have the right to die

    5 6.17%
  • People have the right to die, but healthcare professionals should not aid in the process

    11 13.58%
  • People have the right to die, and healthcare professionals should be allowed to assist suicide

    46 56.79%
  • Suicide attempts should not be a criminal offense

    26 32.10%
  • Suicide attempts should be illegal

    11 13.58%
  • other

    8 9.88%
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Thread: Right to die

  1. #41
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    Re: Right to die

    Quote Originally Posted by Kali View Post
    It could be argued that the person commiting the act of suicide does harm innocent people in reguards to those left behind. Like the pain of parents when their child takes their own life.

    Most that commit suicide harm on an emotional level in reguards to those that are here in this Earth. It is sad. But I do agree with the right to die.

    I also do feel it is a very selfish act in a lot of cases though.
    But what about those that have nobody? I have hubby and my pets. thats it. without doctor assistance, I HAVE to do it myself. Which means I have to do it before it gets to where Im locked up in a mental ward beause the government thinks Im mental and I cant do it myself. Im not mental. Im tired. I lived my life. I hope Im invited and dont have to do it myself.

  2. #42
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    Re: Right to die

    Quote Originally Posted by Enola View Post
    I killed my dog. that was the hardest thing Ive ever done. My other dog, his buddy, died. And when he died, so do the one still living. he lost all will to live. For months, he barely ate. He wouldnt play any more. He was grieving, just as I was. But then he got cancer. The vet said it would slowly strangle him but as long as he was eating and drinking, I was to let him continue on. Wrong. I had anice chat with him one night. We wer laying on the floor....cuddling. And I whispered in his ear to tell me when he was ready. Did he want to be drugged up? no. Could he not stick around for ME, because losing both would kill my heart. Which was selfish. And he answered int he only way he could. He stared in my eyes. One day soon after that conversation, he couldnt get up without me helping him. And he looked at me. He drank. He ate a little bit. And continued to stare at me. And he shadowed me whenever he could get up on his own.The next morning, it was like I could hear him in my head. It was time. Let him go. He didnt want tobe here any more. He didnt want to strangle.He didnt want to have more pain. Why wait until he felt it so badly? Why? for ME? That, was selfish on my part. So I said ok. Today. And i called the vet who came to myhouse. I told him (my dog), he was going to go now. That his friend was waitng for him and I would be ok. To not be scared. And he as sent over rainbow bridge in my arms. Just as the needle was inserted, he looked at me again and laid his head down, sighed and laid still. As the plunger plunnged, I said "go. Hes waiting. wait for me, too. Ill be along shortly" and his eyes ticked up at me in gratitude. and he was gone. I cried for months. Hubby cried for months. And the day he was gone, the dragonflies came. Thousadns of them. He was letting me know he was fine. I did the right thing, before he suffered further.

    If only a human would do that for me.

    That was very brave of you. I had a similar experience with my cats a few years ago. One had been with me for 17 years and the other 16. I am afraid that I waited too long and they may have suffered, but I could not let go. They were my best friends, we went through so much over the years.... It's making me cry.

    "You know, when they came and took away my fourth amendment I kept my yap shut, what the hell, I really didnít have anything to hide anyway. When they grabbed up my second amendment I sat still and bit my tongue because, truth be told, Iím allergic to guns. But here we are, you with your cold hard fingers wrapped around the neck of my first amendment and Iíve got to shout as loud as I can, because if I donít, before you know it, you wonít let me say nothing at all"
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  3. #43
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    Re: Right to die

    Quote Originally Posted by Enola View Post
    I killed my dog. that was the hardest thing Ive ever done. My other dog, his buddy, died. And when he died, so do the one still living. he lost all will to live. For months, he barely ate. He wouldnt play any more. He was grieving, just as I was. But then he got cancer. The vet said it would slowly strangle him but as long as he was eating and drinking, I was to let him continue on. Wrong. I had anice chat with him one night. We wer laying on the floor....cuddling. And I whispered in his ear to tell me when he was ready. Did he want to be drugged up? no. Could he not stick around for ME, because losing both would kill my heart. Which was selfish. And he answered int he only way he could. He stared in my eyes. One day soon after that conversation, he couldnt get up without me helping him. And he looked at me. He drank. He ate a little bit. And continued to stare at me. And he shadowed me whenever he could get up on his own.The next morning, it was like I could hear him in my head. It was time. Let him go. He didnt want tobe here any more. He didnt want to strangle.He didnt want to have more pain. Why wait until he felt it so badly? Why? for ME? That, was selfish on my part. So I said ok. Today. And i called the vet who came to myhouse. I told him (my dog), he was going to go now. That his friend was waitng for him and I would be ok. To not be scared. And he as sent over rainbow bridge in my arms. Just as the needle was inserted, he looked at me again and laid his head down, sighed and laid still. As the plunger plunnged, I said "go. Hes waiting. wait for me, too. Ill be along shortly" and his eyes ticked up at me in gratitude. and he was gone. I cried for months. Hubby cried for months. And the day he was gone, the dragonflies came. Thousadns of them. He was letting me know he was fine. I did the right thing, before he suffered further.

    If only a human would do that for me.
    I'm undergoing a similar conversation with my cat at the moment. I hope I will be able to understand her when she tells me it's time for her to go. I also hope I'll be strong enough to honor that.

    That was a really beautiful story, and he was lucky to have you.
    Last edited by SmokeAndMirrors; 03-04-12 at 04:16 AM.

  4. #44
    Stigmatized! End R Word! Kali's Avatar
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    Re: Right to die

    Quote Originally Posted by Enola View Post
    I killed my dog. that was the hardest thing Ive ever done. My other dog, his buddy, died. And when he died, so do the one still living. he lost all will to live. For months, he barely ate. He wouldnt play any more. He was grieving, just as I was. But then he got cancer. The vet said it would slowly strangle him but as long as he was eating and drinking, I was to let him continue on. Wrong. I had anice chat with him one night. We wer laying on the floor....cuddling. And I whispered in his ear to tell me when he was ready. Did he want to be drugged up? no. Could he not stick around for ME, because losing both would kill my heart. Which was selfish. And he answered int he only way he could. He stared in my eyes. One day soon after that conversation, he couldnt get up without me helping him. And he looked at me. He drank. He ate a little bit. And continued to stare at me. And he shadowed me whenever he could get up on his own.The next morning, it was like I could hear him in my head. It was time. Let him go. He didnt want tobe here any more. He didnt want to strangle.He didnt want to have more pain. Why wait until he felt it so badly? Why? for ME? That, was selfish on my part. So I said ok. Today. And i called the vet who came to myhouse. I told him (my dog), he was going to go now. That his friend was waitng for him and I would be ok. To not be scared. And he as sent over rainbow bridge in my arms. Just as the needle was inserted, he looked at me again and laid his head down, sighed and laid still. As the plunger plunnged, I said "go. Hes waiting. wait for me, too. Ill be along shortly" and his eyes ticked up at me in gratitude. and he was gone. I cried for months. Hubby cried for months. And the day he was gone, the dragonflies came. Thousadns of them. He was letting me know he was fine. I did the right thing, before he suffered further.

    If only a human would do that for me.
    I am gonna cry now. You did the right thing and just wish I could give you a big hug.
    ~Following My Own Flow~

  5. #45
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    Re: Right to die

    I support the right to die and to have a medical professional help you. I might support criminalization of suicide attempts that put the rest of the public in danger.

  6. #46
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    Re: Right to die

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    We've talked about this before, Kali. If someone is mentally ill, that precludes them from making a rational decision on whether they should live or die. If they are NOT mentally ill, I would have no problem with assisted suicide.
    Why does the decision need to be rational? Does an action need to be rational for it be taken? Does a action need to be understood by the people that practice it? I'm really sorry, but I don't see any difference here. I know you are into this whole thing, but rational or irrational behavior doesn't change the nature of the behavior. It is still the same behavior and it still falls under the right to control your body. When talking about wisdom of such a decision perhaps, but that is not really the same thing.

    Discrimination? Discriminating against the mentally ill for not allowing them to harm themselves? I doubt that the courts will do much with THAT.
    The mentally ill have all the rights of anyone else. Just because they are unstable does not change it. It only changes how you view it, but that alone is not a factor. I understand your want to help them, but that doesn't matter.
    Last edited by Henrin; 03-04-12 at 05:17 AM.

  7. #47
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    Re: Right to die

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Why does the decision need to be rational? Does an action need to be rational for it be taken? Does a action need to be understood by the people that practice it? I'm really sorry, but I don't see any difference here. I know you are into this whole thing, but rational or irrational behavior doesn't change the nature of the behavior. It is still the same behavior and it still falls under the right to control your body. When talking about wisdom of such a decision perhaps, but that is not really the same thing.

    The mentally ill have all the rights of anyone else. Just because they are unstable does not change it. It only changes how you view it, but that alone is not a factor. I understand your want to help them, but that doesn't matter.
    I'm mostly with you here, but here's the question I keep coming back to in this case, and why I'd like for there to be a screening for mental health crisis.

    What about someone who has a sudden break? For the sake of simplicity, let's say they have no history of it from the past.

    Should steps be taken to immediately de-escalate the crisis first, and then re-consult about the request for assisted suicide?

    It is true that if it's granted outright, it's not as though they will have the opportunity to regret it. But in cases like that, do we have a responsibility to stabilize before we grant the request? We deny requests when ability to consent is in question or clearly has been lost all the time. And while I don't think mental illness as a whole instantly negates ability to consent, I think that there is a case to be made that in some extreme cases it does.

    That is a fuzzy issue to me, and perhaps a sole exception to my general response, which is that requests for assisted suicide should be granted outright.

  8. #48
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    Re: Right to die

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Why does the decision need to be rational? Does an action need to be rational for it be taken? Does a action need to be understood by the people that practice it? I'm really sorry, but I don't see any difference here. I know you are into this whole thing, but rational or irrational behavior doesn't change the nature of the behavior. It is still the same behavior and it still falls under the right to control your body. When talking about wisdom of such a decision perhaps, but that is not really the same thing.
    It's the same reason we don't allow 5-year-olds to smoke cigarettes and drink booze. One could argue that they have the "right to control their own body," but the fact is that they are not of sound mind to make certain decisions regarding their own body, and so we prevent them from doing things that might cause them to harm themselves. By the same token, a person who is mentally unwell is not of sound mind to make certain decisions regarding their own body, and so we prevent them from doing things that might cause them to harm themselves.
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  9. #49
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    Re: Right to die

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    It's the same reason we don't allow 5-year-olds to smoke cigarettes and drink booze. One could argue that they have the "right to control their own body," but the fact is that they are not of sound mind to make certain decisions regarding their own body, and so we prevent them from doing things that might cause them to harm themselves. By the same token, a person who is mentally unwell is not of sound mind to make certain decisions regarding their own body, and so we prevent them from doing things that might cause them to harm themselves.
    I'll go with henrin on this one. Mental Illness is just as debilitating as physical illnesses and has a tendency to be chronic. What gives other people the right to judge when a person's quality of life is so low that they can die? If people can commit suicide because of physical conditions why not mental?

    "You know, when they came and took away my fourth amendment I kept my yap shut, what the hell, I really didnít have anything to hide anyway. When they grabbed up my second amendment I sat still and bit my tongue because, truth be told, Iím allergic to guns. But here we are, you with your cold hard fingers wrapped around the neck of my first amendment and Iíve got to shout as loud as I can, because if I donít, before you know it, you wonít let me say nothing at all"
    --Randolph J. Dworkin

    ďReading makes a full man, meditation a profound man, discourse a clear man.Ē
    -- Ben Franklin

    "It has been said that something as small as the flutter of a butterfly's wing can ultimately cause a typhoon halfway around the world"
    -- Chaos Theory

  10. #50
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    Re: Right to die

    Quote Originally Posted by taxigirl View Post
    I'll go with henrin on this one. Mental Illness is just as debilitating as physical illnesses and has a tendency to be chronic. What gives other people the right to judge when a person's quality of life is so low that they can die? If people can commit suicide because of physical conditions why not mental?
    Because mental illness inherently robs someone of the sound judgment necessary to make such a decision. As far as "what gives others the right to judge", it's the same thing that gives us the right to judge that kids can't smoke cigarettes: Kids who smoke cigarettes, like mentally ill people who want to kill themselves, generally aren't capable of making a rational decision and should therefore be protected from hurting themselves.
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