View Poll Results: Is Obama just really Bush II?

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  • Yes

    19 35.85%
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    34 64.15%
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Thread: Is Obama just really Bush II?

  1. #61
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    Re: Is Obama just really Bush II?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Obama is for the opposite of the Bush policies, he is for more financial regulation of the banks, eliminating the tax cuts for the rich, and less military spending.
    That's true in a few cases, but on many big issues, he has continued or even expanded Bush's policies. They've already been listed in this thread, but I'll repeat them for you.

    things that have been kept the same:
    - warrantless wiretaps
    - Gitmo
    - Patriot Act
    - opposition to gay marriage

    Bush policies that Obama expanded:
    - Bush increased spending on health (Medicare part D), Obama added Obamacare
    - Bush cut taxes, Obama cut them further
    - Bush increased spending, Obama increased it further
    - Bush supported policies that led to the mortgage meltdown, Obama kept those policies and added an $8K tax credit
    - Bush bailed out the banks, Obama supported that and bailed out GM and Chrysler

    There are examples of Obama reversing Bush's policies. I applaud him for ending waterboarding, but for the most part, Obama kept Bush's most hated policies and expanded them in some cases. His two biggest policy initiatives (ARRA & Obamacare), are anything but policy reversals. We're still going the same direction, only much faster. Bush was Obama Light.

    Edit: I also applaud Obama for repealing DADT. I'm glad that he supports nuclear energy, supports ending corporate tax loopholes and reducing the nominal rate, and supports cutting military spending, but those things haven't materialized yet.
    Last edited by mpg; 03-01-12 at 06:18 PM.
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  2. #62
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    Re: Is Obama just really Bush II?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kane View Post
    Their differences and quibbling are merely bad theatre for the masses to consume. Notice the awful acting? Its shadow puppet theatre! Then the media can concentrate on personalities, and cable news muppets can toss fodder to Jon Stewart.

    All the while, the war machine makes slaves of you all by ensaring you in a cycle of mass murder, poverty, disease, homelessness, unemployment , and hatred. All of our nations ills, as well as the doomed fate of those countries victimized by our voracious multiheaded hydra called "National Security," stem from the endless cycle of madness this massive Pentagon inflicts on the world.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Ever notice how the least insightful people claim to be above the rest of us for seeing something they claim is dooming us?
    No, I think you must be hallucinating.

  3. #63
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    Re: Is Obama just really Bush II?

    [QUOTE=mpg;1060250569]
    That's true in a few cases, but on many big issues, he has continued or even expanded Bush's policies. They've already been listed in this thread, but I'll repeat them for you.

    things that have been kept the same:
    - warrantless wiretaps
    - Gitmo
    - Patriot Act
    All policies supported by the viable GOP candidates. If you wish to look for opposition, you will have to look to the Democrats in Congress.

    - opposition to gay marriage,
    Personal opinion, also shared by the GOP candidates. There is no Obama policy on this issue.

    Bush policies that Obama expanded:
    - Bush increased spending on health (Medicare part D), Obama added Obamacare
    Which cuts medicare spending over the next ten years.

    - Bush increased spending, Obama increased it further
    Bush tax cuts benefitted the wealthy most.
    Obama's tax cuts benefitted the working class the most and stimulate the economy more.


    - Bush supported policies that led to the mortgage meltdown, Obama kept those policies and added an $8K tax credit
    Obama supported financial regulatory reform which the GOP oppose.


    - Bush bailed out the banks, Obama supported that and bailed out GM and Chrysler
    Without the bailout, the banks too big to fail created by deregulation, would have caused the economy to collapse. Without the loan to GM and Chrysler, our unemployment and economy would have been worse.

    There are examples of Obama reversing Bush's policies. I applaud him for ending waterboarding, but for the most part, Obama kept Bush's most hated policies and expanded them in some cases. His two biggest policy initiatives (ARRA & Obamacare), are anything but policy reversals. We're still going the same direction, only much faster. Bush was Obama Light.
    You ignore the financial regulatory reform, and the increased revenues proposed under Obama. Romney is just promising more of the Bush policies that drove us into the ditch to begin with.

    Edit: I also applaud Obama for repealing DADT. I'm glad that he supports nuclear energy, supports ending corporate tax loopholes and reducing the nominal rate, and supports cutting military spending, but those things haven't materialized yet.
    The first nuclear plants in over 3 decades have begun construction, the cut to military spending are already under way, the Pentagon as already announced they will comply. The elimination for the tax cuts for the wealthy will require some seat changes in the House in November.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  4. #64
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    Re: Is Obama just really Bush II?

    Quote Originally Posted by Black_Zawisza View Post
    I'd hardly consider corporatism the opposite of center-left regulatory policy. But regardless, my point was that Obama promised he'd halve the deficit, when he literally did the exact opposite and doubled it. I haven't heard him propose any serious plans to deal with the debt, and if he ever does, I'll believe in his commitment to deficit reduction when I see it happening.
    He has more spending cuts in his plan than Romney does in his. I'm going with the lowest spender among the viable candidates.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  5. #65
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    Re: Is Obama just really Bush II?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    He has more spending cuts in his plan than Romney does in his. I'm going with the lowest spender among the viable candidates.
    I don't disagree. But he remains a Bu****e on spending nonetheless.

    EDIT: Ha, I tried to say Bush - ite but it wouldn't let me.

  6. #66
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    Re: Is Obama just really Bush II?

    Quote Originally Posted by Black_Zawisza View Post
    I don't disagree. But he remains a Bu****e on spending nonetheless.
    Show me where Bush cut military spending?
    Last edited by Catawba; 03-01-12 at 07:21 PM.
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  7. #67
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    Re: Is Obama just really Bush II?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Show me where Bush cut military spending?
    I didn't say he did. Bush liked his guns and butter, whereas Obama likes butter a little more and guns a little less. In the end, all that matters is that they and every hypothetical 2012 president save for Paul are driving us off a cliff.

  8. #68
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    Re: Is Obama just really Bush II?

    Quote Originally Posted by Black_Zawisza View Post
    I didn't say he did. Bush liked his guns and butter, whereas Obama likes butter a little more and guns a little less. In the end, all that matters is that they and every hypothetical 2012 president save for Paul are driving us off a cliff.
    Poppycock! Increasing the GDP, reducing our most wasteful spending, and increasing revenues will lead to a lower deficit than the GOP's promise of more of the Bush policies.

    Paul can't win, so his policy proposals are not in the running.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  9. #69
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    Re: Is Obama just really Bush II?

    Quote Originally Posted by OnWisconsin View Post
    I think you guys are missing the glaringly obvious difference of Obama actually having a functioning brain. Obama has been fighting a congress that is so dysfunctional it is almost non-existent. That being said, he has gotten a surprisingly long list of accomplishments, all while painting the Republicans into a corner as being the corporate lap dogs they are.

    You have to understand that there is not going to be any major differences between presidents when the congress that actually controls things is made up of the same idiots that were there with the previous administration.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kane View Post
    Their differences and quibbling are merely bad theatre for the masses to consume. Notice the awful acting? Its shadow puppet theatre! Then the media can concentrate on personalities, and cable news muppets can toss fodder to Jon Stewart.

    All the while, the war machine makes slaves of you all by ensaring you in a cycle of mass murder, poverty, disease, homelessness, unemployment , and hatred. All of our nations ills, as well as the doomed fate of those countries victimized by our voracious multiheaded hydra called "National Security," stem from the endless cycle of madness this massive Pentagon inflicts on the world.
    Quote Originally Posted by German guy View Post
    Obama is more diplomatic towards us Europeans. Both in style and policies. He doesn't tell us to shut up and follow him, but actually coordinates his efforts with us. And Obama uses the UN when it's helpful, instead of actively obstructing it.

    That's a change already. Maybe not a great change, all in all, but it's something.
    Yes, the Obama Admin. is more diplomatic. Hillary announces to the world why Libya has to be bombed back to the stone ages, before she actually does it. Now she has announced Syria must be invaded and the U.S. drones are already invading that country. Way to earn that Nobel Peace Prize, by ratcheting up the war machine.
    Last edited by Kane; 03-01-12 at 08:32 PM.

  10. #70
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    Re: Is Obama just really Bush II?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    All policies supported by the viable GOP candidates. If you wish to look for opposition, you will have to look to the Democrats in Congress.
    This thread is about Bush and Obama.





    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    There is no Obama policy on this issue.
    Obama Still Opposes Same-Sex Marriage - Political Hotsheet - CBS News
    They say that his position is "evolving", but until he changes his mind, my point still stands.





    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Which cuts medicare spending over the next ten years.
    We'll see if that materializes. Cutting payments to hospitals just shifts costs to the states. Cutting payments to doctors isn't working out too well. Well see if it's sustainable.






    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Obama's tax cuts benefitted the working class the most and stimulate the economy more.


    Obama supported financial regulatory reform which the GOP oppose.


    Without the bailout, the banks too big to fail created by deregulation, would have caused the economy to collapse. Without the loan to GM and Chrysler, our unemployment and economy would have been worse.


    You ignore the financial regulatory reform, and the increased revenues proposed under Obama. Romney is just promising more of the Bush policies that drove us into the ditch to begin with.
    None of that contradicts what I said.
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

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