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Thread: Opinions on Homosexuality

  1. #101
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    Re: Opinions on Homosexuality

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Huh?
    Huh what? Do you know the difference?

    Wrong. If a person yells fire in a crowded theater it can incite a panic and when people panic they shove and make people fall and stomp on those people with no regard to their safety. Thereby hurting them...all because some idiot yelled "FIRE!"
    You have no grasp of possibility, do you?

  2. #102
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    Re: Opinions on Homosexuality

    Quote Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
    My marrying two women harms no one, yet you advocate the state violate my fundamental right to marry who I choose. Why?
    Did you read the link I gave you?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
    When you can show me how polygamy or incestuous marriages harm any single person outside of that marriage.
    Being as polygamy was already addressed I'm only going to address the bold part. It is a fact that incestuous marriages where the couple has sex and has a child because of having sex affects the health of that child.

    Interbreeding:

    Incest that results in offspring is a form of close inbreeding (reproduction between two individuals with a common ancestor). Inbreeding leads to a higher probability of congenital birth defects because it increases that proportion of zygotes that are homozygous, in particular for deleterious recessive alleles that produce such disorders.[72] Because most such alleles are rare in populations, it is unlikely that two unrelated marriage partners will both be heterozygous carriers. However, because close relatives share a large fraction of their alleles, the probability that any such rare deleterious allele present in the common ancestor will be inherited from both related parents is increased dramatically with respect to non-inbred couples. Contrary to common belief, inbreeding does not in itself alter allele frequencies, but rather increases the relative proportion of homozygotes to heterozygotes. However, because the increased proportion of deleterious homozygotes exposes the allele to natural selection, in the long run its frequency decreases more rapidly in inbred population. In the short term, incestuous reproduction is expected to produce increases in spontaneous abortions of zygotes, perinatal deaths, and postnatal offspring with birth defects.[73] HM Slatis showed a significant delay in time to first pregnancy in first-cousin marriages as compared with unrelated individuals in the same population. There may also be other deleterious effects besides those caused by recessive diseases. Thus, similar immune systems may be more vulnerable to infectious diseases (see Major Histocompatibility Complex and Sexual Selection).[74]

    A 1994 study found a mean excess mortality with inbreeding among first cousins of 4.4%.[75] A study of 29 offspring resulting from brother-sister or father-daughter incest found that 20 had congenital abnormalities, including four directly attributable to autosomal recessive alleles.[76]
    Incest


    Quote Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
    It was absurd rationale for allowing the state to violate a "fundamental right."
    You have yet to dispute anything credibly.
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  3. #103
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    Re: Opinions on Homosexuality

    Quote Originally Posted by taxigirl View Post
    A lot of people say this and don't that homosexuals do not have the same rights that heterosexuals, and there are no "extra rights". There is no federal law against housing discrimination that protects homosexuals, several states and municipalities have their own laws, but for the most part if you are gay a landlod can say you may not rent or you can be refused a loan for housing etc...
    I'm opposed to housing discrimination laws that force property owners to rent their properties out to undesired tenants for any reason-- because a racial, sexual, or religious discrimination case is too easy to make when a landlord refuses to rent a property for other reasons.

    Quote Originally Posted by taxigirl View Post
    There are also no protections in place in cases of medical care (unless it comes to federal dollars) for visitation, rights to make medical decisions. The parties involved must have power of attorney, healthcare proxies etc.. If these are not in place then homosexuals do not have the rights as heterosexuals.
    That's covered by marriage.

    Quote Originally Posted by taxigirl View Post
    These are the rights that heterosexuals have. They are not "extra" rights.
    And what about the right to name someone as the beneficiary of your health insurance or your pension fund without marrying them? What about the right to adopt children without being married? Those are "extra rights", and they're being granted wrongfully because our society won't do the right thing and extend them the equal rights they should have.

    Quote Originally Posted by earthworm View Post
    And you call yourself a "Progressive" ??
    Well, at least you are honest...
    And, when are we going to see a cancer sufferers rights parade ???
    We need a more intelligent people.
    I for one find the "moral order" to be offensive !
    I model myself, as a Progressive, after Theodore Roosevelt who while being a Progressive believed very much in the indecency laws of his era. I believe in the moral order above all other considerations. Certain civil rights enhance the moral order, such as equality in marriage, while others, like the right to pornography or rights to assembly and freedom of speech that are distorted so far as to protect lawless criminals like the Occupy Movement, are detrimental to the moral order.

    Quote Originally Posted by katiegrrl0 View Post
    As was stated by Kali heterosexuals do those things also. Why do you express a double standard in your rant?
    Because this is a gay rights thread. When it's heterosexual vermin engaging in displays of public indecency, it's usually a First Amendment thread.

  4. #104
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    Re: Opinions on Homosexuality

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Huh what? Do you know the difference?
    Could you rephrase it please? I don't get how "government attached to the state" is relevent to this discussion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    You have no grasp of possibility, do you?
    If you want to take the saying literally then...

    People have indeed falsely shouted "Fire!" in crowded public venues and caused panics on numerous occasions, such as at the Royal Surrey Gardens Music Hall (London) in 1856, in Harlem in 1884,[1] and in the Italian Hall disaster of 1913, which left 73 dead.
    Wiki ~ Shouting fire in a crowded theater

    They also have a SCOTUS case refering to it.
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  5. #105
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    Re: Opinions on Homosexuality

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    When you use vague terms, you allow the reader to fill in the details.
    *Thread title is "Opinions on Homosexuality*
    *"vague terms*

    Sure buddy. Sure.
    "Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough."
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  6. #106
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    Re: Opinions on Homosexuality

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Could you rephrase it please? I don't get how "government attached to the state" is relevent to this discussion.
    How many people demanding rights of gay individuals are in fact including benefits from the state and NOT the act of simply being allowed to marry?



    If you want to take the saying literally then...


    Wiki ~ Shouting fire in a crowded theater

    They also have a SCOTUS case refering to it.
    In order for an action to be a right violation it can't simply be a possibility of injury argument.
    Last edited by Henrin; 02-25-12 at 09:35 PM.

  7. #107
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    Re: Opinions on Homosexuality

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    I support equal marriage and kinship rights for homosexuals, and for age-of-consent laws to be equivalent for heterosexual and homosexual sex. Beyond that, I can't think of any other "gay rights" that gays require or that I would support.
    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    That's covered by marriage.
    Right, and they do not have the right to marry.


    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    And what about the right to name someone as the beneficiary of your health insurance or your pension fund without marrying them? What about the right to adopt children without being married? Those are "extra rights", and they're being granted wrongfully because our society won't do the right thing and extend them the equal rights they should have.
    You can names anyone you want as a "beneficiary" of insurance, I am not sure what you mean as "beneficiary of your health insurance", do you mean adding them as a covered person?

    Single people can adopt, heterosexual couples who are not married can adopt. A lot of what we are discussing are the same rights we had to make laws to cover blacks for because they were being discriminated against.

    "You know, when they came and took away my fourth amendment I kept my yap shut, what the hell, I really didnít have anything to hide anyway. When they grabbed up my second amendment I sat still and bit my tongue because, truth be told, Iím allergic to guns. But here we are, you with your cold hard fingers wrapped around the neck of my first amendment and Iíve got to shout as loud as I can, because if I donít, before you know it, you wonít let me say nothing at all"
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  8. #108
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    Re: Opinions on Homosexuality

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    How many people demanding rights of gay individuals are in fact including benefits from the state and NOT the act of simply being allowed to marry?
    Every right has a benefit to it. That's actually kinda the point of having rights. So its no surprise that people include the benefits that a right gives when talking about that right.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    In order for an action to be a right violation it can't simply be a possibility of injury argument.
    Why?
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

  9. #109
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    Re: Opinions on Homosexuality

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Every right has a benefit to it. That's actually kinda the point of having rights. So its no surprise that people include the benefits that a right gives when talking about that right.
    Benefits are benefits, rights are rights. They are not interchangeable as people are using them. The government providing you something is not a right, but a benefit. Everything that the government does in marriage is a benefit, not a right.

    Why?
    Because otherwise you are taking away rights of individuals.

  10. #110
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    Re: Opinions on Homosexuality

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Did you read the link I gave you?



    Being as polygamy was already addressed I'm only going to address the bold part. It is a fact that incestuous marriages where the couple has sex and has a child because of having sex affects the health of that child.



    Incest




    You have yet to dispute anything credibly.
    You are not addressing the issue: which is the fundamental right to marriage. Incestuous relationships occur, polygamous relationships occur. You have a fundamental right to engage in those relationships. Yet somehow you feel the state has a right to deprive those same people of their fundamental right to marry. Why? If these relationships are so damaging to the culture or to others, why does the state not ban sexual relationships between siblings, or between more than two partners? I will answer that for you--because you have the "fundamental right" to engage in those activities.

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